Yes, subs would be even lower with out the WoW Token.
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I buy a token evety 2-3 months for gold to spend on mats, pts, leggos, etc. Having a job and a family limits my play time. The token enables me to focus on gearing up and doing end-game content instead of farming gold/mats. This seems like a fair exchange - my money for someone elseâs time.
Never bought BiS BoEâs. Never bought more than one token in a month. Never paid to be boosted in any content.
While there are things that are potentially problematic, the token is a net positive. I donât know whether Iâd play if I couldnât buy some gold from time to time. It would impact my capacity to play the content I enjoy and I do not have the time to mitigate that impact.
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The moment you have to try to change how something is viewed in order to make your argument is the moment youâve already lost your argument.
Trying to make definitions like pay to win apply to scenarios where they donât weakens the term and means that when more egregious forms of pay to win are found, theyâre not treated with the severity thatâs due.
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It is a service called armor stack funnel. If you donât think it works, go try it. It works exceptionally well. The carry service runners will run a full team that can loot your item type. It is largely automated, they generally are commercial operations in China and Russia running bot arrays.
That sounds all kinds of crazy, all these years and still so many people can cheat, but you are still not paying to win through the hand of Blizzard.
Iâm no coder, but wouldnât you have to close off all possible mod/addons to avoid bots? Seems less like intent and more like not willing to give up one for the other.
I mean its only you and lizzie being bad faith making this threas toxic arguing against the fact that wow tokens can be used for power progression.
Thatâs not really the point. The point is the loot structure designed to be funnel serviced.
Yea i agree same reason why i pay to win. If i miss a raid tier ill just buy a carry and catch up quick or if i have to do pve for pvp ill just buy a pve carry. Saves a ton of time
This is a ridiculous argument that youâre trying to make throughout this thread and it doesnât hold an ounce of water. If I understand you and I believe I do, then in your mind in order for any system to be pay to win it canât have RNG elements? Why is RNG the thing youâre hanging this argument on? Thatâs a paper thin argument for at least a couple reasons.
The first is that, you can you can buy raid level BoEâs from the auction house and BoPs now from crafting orders. Those arenât RNG at all and they directly contribute to player power. The other issue is that RNG is the preferred method that game companies use to hook players into pay to win schemes because they donât want you to pay one time. They donât want you to buy one token and get all the gear on your first run. No no no.
The stance youâve taken here is one which to be logically congruent you would need to also argue that loot boxes arenât problematic and arenât pay win in other games because thereâs RNG involved. Iâve seen a lot of arguments in favor of tokens but this is by far the most absurd one I do believe Iâve ever seen and Iâve seen a lot!
Itâs okay for the game to be pay to win, it doesnât necessarily make it a bad game. No oneâs saying that. Iâm playing after all, right? I like the game. Itâs a great game, but it clearly has some pay to win elements. I wonât be responding to you by the way as I know that youâll continue making the same circular argument as youâve done many times throughout this thread. 
mm sounds like you still cant prove the part where buying a token removes RNG
Not sure whether youâre trolling or just donât understand what I wrote. Either way, you do you.
Yes it was
If you enjoy gold farming thereâs nothing stopping you from continuing.
No it doesnât, gold isnât being created with this, itâs being traded from one person to another. There is nothing p2w about the token. The gold gained through the token is the same gold you can earn by playing the game. Buying a token doesnât guarantee that the run you bought will give you anything.
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Sadly, despite multiple people pointing out this clear logic, the peanut gallery still refuses to accept it.
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And very few on the other side.
Probably the best comment on this thread.
P2W was a term coined for games that directly sold what ever end game, top tier, top of line stuff they have in the game to give you an advantage immediately. Directly! Not though other players, not through RNG ( that was an odd take from Liizzy with that one but sorta on the right track ), no need to hit up people for carries, just a direct transaction from you with the gaming company so you can win now or gain power or whatever. That is P2W
What you and others have done in this thread is twist the original definition to suit your argument. Now if you can show me Blizzard directly giving you gold for money ( or printing gold for you ), and show me the NPC vendor or store page that sells top item level items that are not crafted but generated by Blizzard to sell for money, then you have an argument for P2W.
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I see that as an UPSIDE, not a downside. Iâve never had the patience to farm gold, so prior to WoW tokens I was always flat broke in-game.
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I do not think it is a benefit at all. Due to the artificial inflation it causes because it is sellable by players.
If you could only purchase/use it, but not sell it, THEN it would have been a boon in the way of providing an alternate method of payment for the subscription.
But we all know that was the furthest thing from their minds when they introduced/created it. They wanted a way to combat gold sellers, they made one, then tried to disguise it as an âalternate method of paymentâ.
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You do know people can trade gear right? When people buy boosts through this content they often have all of the gear they can equip passed to them. On top of that, they get items from the weekly vault.
Yes, itâs RNG, the same as everyone else playing the game trying to get gear. It likely wonât happen in a single carry but people can easily buy full mythic sets. PvP is also another way to get really high item-level gear quickly by buying boosts later in the season and upgrading that gear with honor.
Overall the token was been great for the game in my opinion. It gives a way for people without much money to lower the cost of the game and for people to play for free if they know how to make gold. Iâve already earned 6 mil in DF and if I convert that into tokens Iâll have a few yearsâ worth of game time. Bots and gold sellers are also much less popular thanks to that, yeah boosts in PvP, for example, can be bad for the game but overall I see tokens as a positive.
Tokens did not increase the price of BoE items, those items would be priced just as high as after WoD we have been flooded with raw gold. As I and many others have proven earning gold through normal means is pretty easy even in DF atm, the people fighting over those expensive BoE items are guilds going for server/world first. They are generic items that just give basic stats, crafted gear and drops are where you get actual good items.
Smart people got exalted in AV and bought that mount for 540 g !
no.
it lead to too many cases where people exploited it for bad boy reasons. id rather they have a cap on it. 1 per week or something