Tanking dungeons as 60 troll prot(13/5/33) never really have rage for a heroic strike queue , not even close to hit capped so specials do miss/dodged/parried/etc.
same dps(40) weapons(both swords) one 2.4 speed generates 6 rage other 1.6 speed generates 4, tested on boars out front of org.
anyone have a table of attack speed to rage gen, if that is a thing?
faster weapons just feel better when tanking, anyone have any comments on this?
while tanking once if have 5 sunders on a target(dungeon boss) should i forgo additional sunder applications and prioritize shield slam, revenge or even heroic strike for threat? i know this question is a bit iffy because sunder armor is static and shield slam/heroic strike scale with gear, there has to be a break point where heroic strike will cause more threat, i don’t know if its even achievable.
Well yes, Tactical Mastery is great. But that’s part of the 35pt Prot threat build. We can’t really say anything without seeing the exact build you run.
You want a faster weapon (faster hits for smoother rage and also more threat), this is normal and is what you generally seek forever. You also want to make sure you get that hit - you can even wear some +hit pieces that aren’t entirely tank pieces (the ring from Princess in Mara is one). Hit/threat > defensive stats, especially in dungeons.
Heroic Strike is a noob trap until you’re tanking raid bosses and are overflowing with rage. It not only costs rage, it is even more expensive than it gives off - you don’t gain rage from your next swing. As has been said, only use it to avoid overcapping rage.
You’re much squishier and you also do less threat. Shield Slam in its 1.12 state is insanely good.
You generally don’t want to use heroic strike unless you really need to [ie - taking a ton of damage and can spare the rage], but in that case with multiple mobs you are better off using cleave to get more agro on 2 targets. Since you are full prot, your super-glue should be shield slam and revenge should be used as much as possible, i would priortize revenge>shield slam once on main kill target>sunder armors on other mobs [along with cleave if you have the rage].
if 1 have 5 sunders on a target(dungeon boss) should i forgo additional sunder applications and prioritize shield slam, revenge or even heroic strike over sunder armor for threat?
I would prioritize revenge 1st, followed by shield slam when off CD, then sunders. Heroic strike & cleave are your rage dumps and not something you should be spamming.
Once Sunder is at 5, it’s really only useful to refresh it. Shield Slam is your highest TPR ability and Revenge is second to that, and on stunnable targets and talented it can stun.
As we’ve said multiple times, avoid Heroic Strike unless overflowing with rage. It’s a huge rage cost and is really bad to use in most situations.
Deep Prot is only utility. Threat and mitigation benefits end after 17-20 points. 31/5/15 and 0/31/20 or 3/31/17 are higher threat/offense builds.
But definitely try to get your hit capped, or close to it. I liked tanking with Argent Avenger, but I’ve since replaced it with Brutality Blade, but I had weapon swaps for Silent Fang, among others.
Take off some of your Defense gear and put on some +crit/+miss gear. I have a few different combinations of tanking gear - for 5 mans i use about 340ish defense then the rest is enough +hit for what im hitting (6-9% is only for a raid boss - most lvl 60 5 mans i run 5% with 305 weap skill), str and crit. Usually around 4k hp unbuffed.
Sometimes i DW Dal Rends for better rage gen. sometimes i use a 1.9 speed 1h axe and a shield. Both these setups give me alot of rage (DW on mobs that i dont take alot of damage from, swapping out to 1h+shield for bigger packs).
Demo shout, battle shout, sunder, tab sunder, tab, revenge proc, tab, sunder, tab, etc etc is pretty much the rotation. At 5 sunders on a boss (most trash packs die before i get a full 5 stack sunder on every mob) i start to weave in the odd heroic strike, making sure to maintain shield block on cooldown (i dont use it earlier as it costs to much rage), every revenge on cooldown. Rebuffing battle shout, demo shout when needed.
I usually have enough rage for one shield slam in the beginning. After that if i spam sunders, i wont have enough rage for another shield slam. At what point do i wait for enough rage to do shield slam again.
Yes you do. But at 5 stacks of sunder armor your damage abilities will hit the hardest. More damage = more threat + more rage earned from damage = making the most of rage spent.
Damage: Damage generates threat at a 1-to-1 ratio, so for instance 100 damage dealt would generate 100 threat. To clarify further, the type of damage is not taken into account (physical or magical), and missed attacks and resisted spells do not generate threat as they do not deal damage. In addition, critical hits do not add bonus threat by virtue of it being a critical hit - it would still be calculated at a 1-to-1 ratio based on the amount of damage dealt
Heroic Strike is damage dealt + 175 threat. This already generates more threat than a max rank sunder (provided you swing for 86+ damage) BUT it has a cast time (weapon speed) AND costs you 15 rage + the lost rage from your next swing.
This is why hs is considered a rage dump. 50+ constant rage line them up. You can still cast another ability while heroic strike is qued up. If you dip under the rage to cast hs, it will just normal swing and the hs button will ‘grey out’ - you can kind of abuse this while dw, because your off hand does not suffer the hit penalty from dw, and you will generate rage from both mh and oh swings, while only needing the min hit cap.
If sunder is 5 stacked and not close to needing to be refreshed, shield slam is on cooldown, revenge is on cooldown, shield block is on cooldown, you have battle shout, the mob is demo debuffed, the mob is disarmed or cant be, the mob isnt casting - its ok to just melee and bank some more rage. Burning rage on a sunder for a fixed threat value when you could heroiuc strike for 600 threat 1 global later is better.