“Imperial aggression”
Literally sided with a genocidal warchief and was actively helping to bolster said genocidal warchief’s naval forces.
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Perhaps worgen was a bad example because of their unique lore.
How about… if the kingdom of Stormwind were lion-people instead of simply having the lion as their insignia! We would then need to treat people with big furry lion heads as people, just as Velskar mentioned the positive aspect of basing animal races on POC cultures was!
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Please check your facts.
The Zandalari trolls literally only joined the Horde after the Battle of Dazar’alor, in direct response to the attack.
Which, as I’ve pointed out many times, was pretty much an inevitable outcome that Anduin the Idiot should’ve seen coming.
Prior to that point, they were only ever harboring the Horde, specifically Sylvanas and Nathanos, in their…well, harbor.
Which, if you’re going to argue that makes them complicit, then by the same logic Theramore was perfectly-justified, since Jaina had been fueling the Alliance war effort in the Barrens for years using Theramore resources.
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Yeah. I agree with this.
It is admittedly funny to imagine a fantasy scenario where the traditional Euro-ish race is represented by a nonhuman race while the lesser-represented ones would be portrayed by actual humans. Has a setting done that before? I’m not very varied in my media so I don’t know.
Having said that, putting the idea of alliance saberon in my head makes me sad. D:
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Imagine how cool it would have been if Orcs, Tauren, and Trolls, which are the three big Shamanistic ie constantly engage with the dead and have for centuries races in the game and central to the Horde, had been given proper dignity in Shadowlands ie the expansion centered on navigating the plane of death.
It would’ve demonstrated the Horde is uniquely important in the expansion centered on a theme that is uniquely central to the Horde. It would’ve balanced out the power levels of the factions at least a smidge.
Instead we got Bolvar. Because they had to.
Again, would’ve worked/been cool.
(Sadly cat people in video games are usually given Global South Tribal Stereotypes, including in WoW with the Saberon 
)
Just don’t respond to her, it’s always in bad faith saying ridiculous petty things.
YIkes @ her Theramore comment; Fuhrer-metaphor Arc (Garrosh) using a Nuke-metaphor (Mana bomb) developed by the MENA/Muslim metaphor (Blood Elves) on a port city with a large central tower (*ahem *) was narratively valid, big oof
Literally never
Which, uh, really goes to show lmao
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With that in mind I guess I could be represented by a chamois or a rooster. Or even a Basilisk if we’re going really balls to the wall.
For some reason I now have to think about animal-human hybrids in anime.
Of course there can and should be more than only animal hybrids.
Not everyone is so mired in racial identity politics that they can only see racism when they look at video games. Some of us just look at the story and go “Okay cool.” and start enjoying the story.
Theramoore invalidated their claim to neutrality for years and got wiped out by Garrosh. It was justified. Just like the Siege of Dazar’alor.
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The only fantasy series that comes to mind that the European metaphors aren’t human (but because nobody is just a human in this entire universe) is The Kiesha’ra Series.
You can become the first, become rich amid racist / nationalist / other forms of intolerance! Not that I really knew what these words mean, the process of writing the book, and the speed with which the agenda changes.
Stop. Will the Dark Crystal work? It looks like no.
I blank at the moment to be honest, but I’m sore there is something out there.
I know this picture was meant to be propaganda like and paint a good image of the soldiers etc. But I had to think of that one too (works only for some in my view). More as a mention, not fitting the topic really.
https://i.pinimg.com/originals/8d/70/bf/8d70bf67ba72609a557ecaff6a7c50dc.jpg
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So, couple things:
I would argue an attack on Theramore was justified.
Dropping the Arcane-Magical equivalent of a nuclear warhead on the place was not. The same can be said for the Horde’s (supposedly) initial plan of merely capturing Teldrassil vs. outright burning it.
Again, my main problem with the Siege of Dazar’alor is that it was completely idiotic as a military assault to begin with. Anduin literally says he wanted to “drive a wedge” between the Zandalari and the Horde, which means that at some point in time, Genn or Jaina or someone should have spoken up and gone:
“But, uh…Anduin? When the Zandalari see the Alliance attacking their city and killing their king, and the Horde defending their lives, won’t that make them want to officially sign up with the Horde?”
Again, Anduin is idiot.
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I think this was justified. What wasn’t justified was the capture and prolonged torture of fleeing civilians.
The problem with the Siege of Dazar’alor is that they didn’t occupy it or just make sure they wouldn’t in any way be an asset to the Horde once they left. Instead they rolled in, blew up only some ships, killed the King when he refused to stand down, and then left.
So we could be fed Jaina Bipolarmoore suddenly deciding that pressing the advantage would make the Alliance just like the Horde for zero reason.
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If I recall correctly, I thought the in-game explanation was that the alliance didn’t have nearly the manpower required to do anything like that, so it had to be a quick in-and-out mission while the horde forces were away?
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There is a very good reason that the use of certain weapons are considered war crimes IRL.
The same, I would argue, should absolutely apply here, and as we saw with War Crimes, rightly did.
Because they already knew they were outnumbered—the Zandalari and Kul Tirans have actually been compared in posts when it comes to martial prowess and the strength of their arms.
The consensus has typically been that the Kul Tirans win on water because Tidesages and fleet, but the Zandalari would win in a land battle because Loa.
Guess which setting the majority of Dazar’alor took place in?
Which, again, points to Anduin being an idiot if his whole “plan” was to have Greymane and Shaw send a relatively-small force into a city that greatly-outnumbered and outmatched them, kill the king, and GTFO. That’s not a military assault (which would have resulted in conquest), that’s just the war version of a child poking someone and going, “Tee hee, I got you.”
Oh, right…
The Alliance has always been “just like the Horde.”
The only difference is that, from around Cataclysm onward, they’ve stopped admitting it, even to themselves.
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See my above post, because you are absolutely correct.
No. Pressing the advantage is proposed and Jaina’s response is “While the Zandalari mourn their king?! That would make us no better than the Horde!” And then Boy King of Peace agrees because he’s an absolute moron.
I should have quoted the relevant bit of your post, sorry. I was talking about your suggestion of occupying the city while the alliance was there instead of pulling out.
The lack manpower only really mattered when it came to aiding the Night Elves, because of course it did.
The current state of the 4th War post-Dazar’alor raid is that the Alliance is close to victory.
Then Nazjatar happens and the Alliance is down to a token force.
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