I did it for looks, but a couple of the summonable bosses drop pretty decent loot for new guildies or alts. The staff from Valthalak was solid, and looked great.
At the very least it was valuable for bragging rights for those who knew what it took to get the set completed.
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The quest line takes a crap ton of gold. People likely wouldnât have anywhere near it by the time they release it. Hell, people may not even have epic mounts by then.
Indeed, but having it accessible at release would give the option of powering your way to achieving it before raid gear diminishes it (even if it would only do so slightly)
Why do we have this thread, when thereâs already an identical thread on this topic near the top of the listing?
As for my opinion on the subject, absolutely opposed to moving up the release date for the setsâŠ
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It was intended to be a non raiderâs END GAME in vanilla, much akin to Naxxramas being the end game for raiding players. It was also one of the very few ways a non raiding player could get access to epic gear.
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Regarding the power level of the gear, most of the set was trash, but a few pieces where very good and moving it up would throw off gear progression tables for raiders, who the set isnât supposed to be designed for.
Remember that other thread that you just reminded people about? Your 2 points were shot down in there.
No, they really werenât⊠You just kept spamming the thread with inane âbut I want it earlier and feel entitled to itâ nonsense.
Obviously the set is more akin to being a early game set than a late one, you said it your self, its not very good.
Oh? Is that how it translated to you?
People didnât repeatedly explain how the extreme cost, length of time to accumulate the needed mats, the length of time to get the D1 set, and the extreme difficulty of the baron 45 part of the looooooong questline, all added up to zero need to time gate it?
Having it ACCESSIBLE earlier does not mean people would suddenly be able to accumulate D2 gear quickly. Nor would it affect your fragile raider âgear progressionâ as few raiders actually had the skill to earn it if they even bothered to try.
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Which isnât relevant.
None of which is relevant information.
Youâre comparing casual player gear to raiding player gear as if they are on the same wavelength, and that is a decidedly retail wow mindset, NOT a VANILLA mindset.
You where intended to be raiding if you wanted gear, let alone epic quality gear in OG vanilla, thatâs how the game was designed.
You CHOOSING not to engage in that activity, does not entitle you to get your endgame content pushed forward. Suck it up and wait in an authentic manner for the D2 sets to get pushed in, and frankly be happy that Blizzard ever put it into the game in the first place, because there was an entirely justifiable uproar on the forums when it first came out, because it was handing epic level gear to people who willfully didnât raid, which was a fairly massive deal at the time.
Stop pretending this is BfA where you are entitled to epic quality gear, for refusing to raid, when the near entirety of Vanilla WoWâs gear progression post 60 was based upon raiding.
Gear should be awarded on a risk + time versus reward process, not via RNG and being a warm body with a pulse among 39 other warm bodies with a pulse. D2 acquisition is arguably pound per pound more difficult than acquiring raid gear. Your raid-centric delusional âraid = hard, casual = easyâ mindset is really tiring.
In your interpretation, PVP rank 14 is âcasualâ since you do not even need a group much less a raid to acquire it.
Lastly you have a really annoying way of attempting to equate access with entitlement.
This is some hardcore ignorance and proof that you never acquired D2 during vanilla.:
âHanding epic level gearâ, indeed
Like Iâve said in the other thread, in probably 20 times as many words, you need to invest 0 time in the questline to kill the bosses and get their insanely good items.
Also Classic is going to be much easier than Vanilla was, thereâs no need to have even more easy-to-get gear early on. And no, a 45-minute Strath run isnât hard by any means if your group is competent.
Which is NOT HOW VANILLA WAS DESIGNED.
You where intentionally funneled towards Raiding first, PvP second, and doing nothing third.
Your inability to grasp how the game was actually designed is really tiring⊠I never once said that raiding (especially early on) was harder, than a 45 minute Baron run, I said you whining about the difficulty disparity was entirely irrelevant to the discussion because itâs not how the damn game is designed.
Now youâre just making things up⊠HWL takes more effort than raiding does, and the gear is exceedingly rare for the epic level set, and even then itâs inferior to pve gear.
BY YOUR logic, HWL gear should be absolute BiS for the entire vanilla era, and the rank 10 set should be at least epic quality gear. But itâs not designed like that, and you arenât advocating for that⊠because all you care about is getting casual non raiding player handouts. Take your disgusting entitlement issues and scurry off to BfA where you get epics just for hitting lvl cap and doing a world quest.
And you have this incredibly ability to ignore the fact that providing access to the gear early means people will get the gear early⊠You completely ignore that SOME of the pieces of gear ARE ACTUALLY good, and would change itemization progression paths, and you ignore that your entire argument essentially boils down to you feeling that you are entitled to get access to your gear early, simply because you want it earlier.
Youâre asking for a fundamental design change to the game by moving the gear around like that, and Classic ALREADY has more of that non authentic garbage than should be tolerated.
That is PURELY YOUR OPINIONATED INTERPRETATION BASED ON A RAID CENTRIC VIEW.
No, you just imply repeatedly that âcasualâ play should not reward epic gear. To wit:
âHandoutsâ.
As does the D2 questline.
There you are once again attempting to equate a desire for access as âentitlementâ of gear.
Most players did not get it at all, including raiders. And heaven forbid someone who didnât win the RNG lottery in a raid should be passed by someone who did the D2 content which you minimize at every opportunity.
Yeah, some pieces ARE good, and they are locked behind some serious difficulty.
Nope.
I donât even like raiding⊠I never have⊠Itâs literally just the thing in your way to get better gear for PvP.
The difference between us is Iâm not delusional enough to ignore how Vanilla was designed⊠Nor am I entitled enough to demand that rank 13-14 gear be handed to me in a non authentic fashion (which in my case simply means I authentically wonât get it via never being able to hit the honor caps weekly consistently enough to get those ranks). I donât demand that the entire game changes for me just because I prefer pvp, much as you are here demanding the game changes itâs design philosophy simply because youâre âcasual and proudâ.
If you compare obtaining the whole D2 set to obtaining a single epic, sure thing. If you compare obtaining the whole D2 set to obtaining the whole T1 or T2 set, then youâre spouting off nonsense.
It will take more time and effort to get a full raid tier than it will to do the D2 questline, which is pretty much just a beefed up version of the Onyxia attunement that also costs a ton of gold.
His opinion is much closer to fact than yours.
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The biggest obstacle to raid gear is not difficulty, it is RNG.
I firmly believe that blizzards intent was Risk/Reward. Not Raid/Reward.
It was neither. It was always Time/Reward, with content getting progressively harder as you put in more time and get through more tiers.
- Leveling? Takes over 200 hours for most players.
- Epic mount? Takes many hours of farming gold or even more hours getting to R11.
- R14 gear? An insanely high time investment condensed in a small timeframe.
- Raiding gear? You bet it takes forever to get full tier, let alone full BiS.
- Updated Dungeon set? Ditto for that even if it doesnât take as long.
This was always Blizzardâs design philosophy with Vanilla. It was about the journey and commitment, not the RNG or the risk. Hence why
This is strictly your opinion.
And this is strictly what your opinion is on raiding as well. You can dislike the facts, but you donât get to pass off your opinions as facts.
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All the mats can be bough from the auction house, and you can bet that people will be selling the mats if the gear became available earlier.
Serious players will have D1 in a matter of days and D2 in a matter of days after that, as soon as they hit 60.
The average player can and will easily get these quests done while completing their other pre-raid best in slot gear.
Especially if Dire Maul does end up being out at release, a 45 minute run of Stath UD is trivial for any group with Tribute Buffs and consumables like jujus and elixirs.
Once again you demonstrate that you have no clue and never accomplished the D2 set during vanilla.