Then Mythic Raid shouldn’t drop 311 loot until both Alliance and Horde both have filled 100/100 HoF entries.
Do you see how asinine that sounds when you think about it?
You want one person’s progress to be restricted solely based on the progress of others who may likely not be as good a player and where their progress will be substantially slower than yours, to justify accessibility to rewards.
Nobody cares about players at Top 3%. Even you, you dont care about them.
What evidence gives you the impression I do or don’t?
You don’t know me.
It’s not stupid. It’s time consuming.
Getting a 262 item level legs that costs 475 valor to upgrade 1 level. 200 valor per mythic lvl 2 let’s say at 20 mins per run. So you need 3 mythic plus 2s to level up a 262 ilvl legs 1 time. To lvl up to 298 you need 5700 valor points. That is roughly 29 mythic plus 2s. And even then not all will give 200, some will only give 135 depending on if someone’s getting a rating upgrade. Roughly 12 hours of game time.
So you need 12 hours of game play time to level up your 262 legs to 298. 12 hours of game play time, now mulitply that by every piece of gear you have.
It’s not stupid, it’s time consuming. You look at valor upgrades like it’s free loot when in reality it’s a ton more work than raiding. Your argument is null and void.
Thats the point. Whereas when you do LFR, even if you spend 24 hours a day for 1 week, your LFR garbage loot would remain garbage loot. Unlike on M+, your garbage loot could become ilevel 298.
Except for the flaw in your logic is that in order to upgrade to 298, you have to have actually completed both Tyrannical and Fortified versions of all dungeons at a +15 or higher, which takes a minimum of two weeks, atop of the time investment to earn the Valor needed in the first place.
Dinar could be carried forward in a similar way for raid drops, allowing any raid-quality item to be upgraded to Heroic quality as a cap. It would require at least 2 Heroic boss kills that drop the item in question, and you would need a specific number of Dinar coins to upgrade said piece, with a weekly cap on coins.
Yeah, i understand. Let’s say you did KSM and you want Range Weapon.
After getting KSM, you would farm those Faceroll dungeons like +2s. You would do it over and over and when it drops, use your infinite valor to get it to ilevel 298.
Whereas on Raid, Let’s say after completing AoTC, even if you do 24/7 farming of LFR, you would never ever gonna get an ilevel 298. You have to farm Heroic and up for Antique Cyphers not faceroll LFRs or faceroll Normals.
We’ve already covered the problem with this logic. I have 50 plus junkyard runs and still i don’t have the ring I need. Jesus Christ dude. Just stop.
RNG is RNG.
It has nothing to do with your infinite valors transforming a garbage into ilevel 298. Uncapped Valor has to be eliminated like the overpowered Creation Catalyst where you could transform your reject garbage Vault item into BiS Tier gear without lifting a finger.
I love, it’s been a blast.
I feel you should feel less about the game and more fortunate for being out of the hospital. 
Hope you are doing well!
M+ is infinitely farnable. Raid is not. You are way, way, way more likely to be able to get an item that can be upgraded with valor on week 1, whether it’s BiS or not, than you are to get 4p tier on week 1. Especially if you deliberately group up with other people that csn funnel drops to you.
And no, I’m not saying no to uncapped valor because of the RWF degenerate tactics with loot funneling. They’ll use degenerate tactics no matter what and nerfing stuff because of them only makes the game worse (case in point the overtuned SotFO). No, I’m saying no to uncapped valor because M+ is good and consistent enough that without loot funneling you can spam M+ enough to get most of your slots to a mythic ilvl on week one. You seriously underestimate how good M+ is for gear compared to raid already as it is if you think that uncapped valor won’t just completely invalidate raiding as a gearing path.
You are holding onto ideas implemented 18 freaking years ago. ‘Raids durrr tier durrr’
WoW needs to evolve, or die. Plain and simple.
I see comments like this and it clearly tells me that you have no idea how the gearing system works in Mythic+ because in no way can you have your slots anywhere close to max week 1, unless you are literally doing +35 keys.
Now, this is the chart of Valor needed per slot. I’ve ignored weapons here as they can differ depending on whether you’re a shield tank, a 2H or 1H user.
| Slot | Valor Cost/Upgrade | Valor Needed - +2 ILVL | Valor Needed - +15 ILVL |
|---|---|---|---|
| Helm | 475 | 5225 | 1425 |
| Neck | 250 | 2750 | 750 |
| Shoulders | 400 | 4400 | 1200 |
| Cloak | 250 | 2750 | 750 |
| Chest | 475 | 5225 | 1425 |
| Wrist | 250 | 2750 | 750 |
| Gloves | 400 | 4400 | 1200 |
| Waist | 400 | 4400 | 1200 |
| Legs | 475 | 5225 | 1425 |
| Rings | 250 | 5500 | 1500 |
| Trinkets | 400 | 8800 | 2400 |
| Total | 51425 | 13025 |
Each dungeon earns you 135 Valor per run and if the people you group with have a lower score than you, you gain an additional 65 Valor. Now since you’re focused on spamming dungeons effectively you’re likely going to do this with guildies or friends and so you likely aren’t going to see the bonus valor, so we’ll focus on the 135 per dungeon.
Now first off, Valor uncapped or not you are required to have 2000 IO score in order to upgrade your gear to 298 ILVL, which requires a minimum of a +15 for each dungeon for each +2 affix, Tyrannical and Fortified; which requires 2 weeks minimum.
So week 1, you farm your 10 +15 keys, so you earn your 1350 Valor. Additionally, during week 2, you’ll need to re-farm those 10 +15 keys again, so you earn an additional 1350 Valor. This means in both totals above we can subtract off 2700 Valor.
During this two-week period, you then spam +2 keys for valor, which will require 48725 Valor after getting the IO score requirement, or 361 dungeons. I’ll be lenient and say that these +2 keystones will take 15 minutes max to complete, so that’s 5414 minutes or just under 91 hours of game time.
You could also take the other route during this two-week period, you spam +15 keys for valor instead, which will require only 10325 Valor after getting the IO requirement, or effectively 77 dungeons. Let’s assume each dungeon on a +15 takes on average 30 minutes, so that’s 2295 minutes or just under 39 hours of game time.
If you compare that to an average guild who raids 6hrs/wk, the former method is equivalent to just over 15 weeks of raids and the latter is equivalent to 6.5 weeks of raid.
Even prior to M+ being introduced, there was never a point in time in my career while I raided where I wasn’t fully decked out by the end of weeks 6-8, generally being one of the last to be geared since tanks are usually the last to get gear anyway.
You talk about degenerate tactics, spamming +2 keys for 91 hours (effectively more than 2 work weeks for the average person) is degenerate. Hell, I’d argue spamming +15 for 40 hours in a week is also degenerate play in order to get all the Valor you need. So how is that any different?
And the fact we’re even complaining about this, knowing full well that Valor will always remain capped at the outset because Raiders somehow need to feel validated, Blizzard wants to keep MAU up, and they add these caps to prevent degenerate gameplay.
But the hyperbole that people spread about Valor and M+ gearing being so lucrative but there are substantially far more steps you have to cross each season in order for the Valor upgrade system to even be available to you, but Raiders always wash that under the rug because it doesn’t support their agenda.
And what’s worse, none of this even focuses on the RNG aspect of getting the item to drop in the first place, Blood-Spattered Trinket being a great use case where running DoS for double-digit weeks and it never drops. A lot of good use that Valor does when you don’t even have the item to spend it on.
But if you want Raids to be spamable, how about this:
I think if the affixes are difficult enough for the number of people required, this maybe is a good middle ground and modernizes Raids with a similar setup to what M+ has with a similar set of rules and restrictions.
You have more achievement points than Asmongold - I don’t think it’s possible for you to run out of content in wow or get tired of it 
Yeah, and your definition of WoW evolving is to kill Raids… I come here to play a game. And Raiding Dungeons is a very good game. You should evolve and adjust. There is a Dungeon Finder for Raid. You could join, kill 3 bosses and leave. That is something you could do nowadays. Instead, you make excuses of your precious time on work, family, whatever. Hey, this is a game. If you dont have time for videogames, then dont play it.
the constant “I HaVe A JOb anD FAMILY”
so does everyone else who plays wow. newsflash, we’re all old and balding.
Thank Elune I’m an Elf and I don’t have to worry about either!
If you want to upgrade to 298, you’ll need KSM, which means you ran a lot of 15s, which means you’re not upgrading from 262, but rather from 285s and 288s.
Cuts back the valor costs alot.
Yeah that poster is just a troll baiting at this point. There’s nothing wrong with S4 outside of uncapped valor. With capped valor, it wouldn’t be as lucrative and the loot system would be great.
That depends.
I think the underlying argument here by some is that people get KSM and then they simply spam +2 for ease and walk away with 135 valor per M+ since Valor doesn’t scale with the key difficulty, which IMO it should.
Agree, but I also think in a short season like S4 where it’s pretty much “here go have fun” and we’ll see you in the next expansion, it’s fine.