Imagine being able to run Uldir normal like LFR, where you just sign up and "Poof!" you're running Uldir. Yeah, I know it would kill guilds, but Blizz is already going that direction anyway with LFR and LFG.
If peeps could raid regular and even heroic as conveniently as LFR, there would be a whole lot more raiding going on.
And as for baddies, easy to kick the suck as there's always 100 queued and waiting.
You know you want it....
im not sure if it's the best idea to make it queable.
if the mechanics were still in place on normal you would get lots of wipes.
i don't see how this would be a good experience for most casual players.
if the mechanics were still in place on normal you would get lots of wipes.
i don't see how this would be a good experience for most casual players.
The average LFR player and group couldn't do normal, much less heroic.
queueing up for LFR should result in your Blizzard account getting deleted.
10/28/2018 10:20 PMPosted by EspurThe average LFR player and group couldn't do normal, much less heroic.
A average lfr player could barely do lfr.
And plus you can already q up with a custom group for normal + stuff.
10/28/2018 10:20 PMPosted by Rauthaim not sure if it's the best idea to make it queable.
if the mechanics were still in place on normal you would get lots of wipes.
i don't see how this would be a good experience for most casual players.
LFR doesn't have too many wipes, tho everyone said it would, it doesn't. Just up the iL requirements for normal and I doubt it would be a wipefest, cause Uldir normal is easy anyway. Not that much harder than LFR IMO.
Heroic on the other hand, is a different matter, which may require greatly enhanced requirements, such as 8/8 normal, plus say 345 iL, you get the idea. Heck, guilds wipe on heroic so we shouldn't expect to see heroic Uldir with a queue and no wipes.
10/28/2018 10:26 PMPosted by PorschaLFR doesn't have too many wipes, tho everyone said it would, it doesn't.
LFR is also severely undertuned and there are still wipes, even with people outgearing it.
10/28/2018 10:24 PMPosted by Rosenoa10/28/2018 10:20 PMPosted by EspurThe average LFR player and group couldn't do normal, much less heroic.
A average lfr player could barely do lfr.
And plus you can already q up with a custom group for normal + stuff.
People seem to be assuming that queuing for normal would be as easy as queuing for LFR. Umm, no. Obviously there would have to be higher standards in place.
10/28/2018 10:27 PMPosted by PorschaPeople seem to be assuming that queuing for normal would be as easy as queuing for LFR. Umm, no. Obviously there would have to be higher standards in place.
Like what? Item level isn't enough. And we've seen how upset people get about raider.io.
10/28/2018 10:27 PMPosted by Espur10/28/2018 10:26 PMPosted by PorschaLFR doesn't have too many wipes, tho everyone said it would, it doesn't.
LFR is also severely undertuned and there are still wipes, even with people outgearing it.
Guilds wipe on normal, so our objective is not no wipes. Wipes will happen no matter what you do. The objective is convenient raiding, with reasonable standards in place to mitigate wipes.
But in the end, baddies are out there and not just in LFR mind you. Baddies are in guilds, and they raid Uldir Normal
10/28/2018 10:29 PMPosted by PorschaGuilds wipe on normal, so our objective is not no wipes. Wipes will happen no matter what you do. The objective is convenient raiding, with reasonable standards in place to mitigate wipes.
But in the end, baddies are out there and not just in LFR mind you. Baddies are in guilds, and they raid Uldir Normal
Queued groups have no patience for wipes, nor reasonable standards. They're thrown together players of generally the lowest skill levels.
Normal should never be Queable. That would kill game. I say this as a person 7/8 normal because of outside life. I love raid mechanics I'm not trying to ruin the experience through random LFG.
10/28/2018 10:28 PMPosted by Espur10/28/2018 10:27 PMPosted by PorschaPeople seem to be assuming that queuing for normal would be as easy as queuing for LFR. Umm, no. Obviously there would have to be higher standards in place.
Like what? Item level isn't enough. And we've seen how upset people get about raider.io.
My main is in a guild that's 7/8 Heroic. All they ask is for a 355 iL to raid heroic. Queuing will be no different. Some will be good, others will suck, just like in most guilds. Not gonna rid the game of that, no matter what you do. Kick the suck if it's too sucky and move on.
10/28/2018 10:33 PMPosted by PorschaMy main is in a guild that's 7/8 Heroic. All they ask is for a 355 iL to raid heroic. Queuing will be no different. Some will be good, others will suck, just like in most guilds. Not gonna rid the game of that, no matter what you do. Kick the suck if it's too sucky and move on.
Pretty sure there's additional steps in a guild setting you can't do in LFR. Like have a raid leader.
10/28/2018 10:22 PMPosted by Soyboyqueueing up for LFR should result in your Blizzard account getting deleted.
And WoW would collapse because the casuals keep the doors open. World of Warcraft is not the juggernaut it once was and MMORPGs as a whole have fallen from perch. We seem to be in an era of battle royal games. Hopefully that trend won’t last but MMO market will probably not be what it used to be.
The would probably be the worst possible timing for running off the casuals.
If people hate LFR so much that they want it gone, just keep those arrows in the quivers and wait for Warcraft to be in a better position to address your concerns. Right now the anti-LFR crowd is poisoning the water with all these threads when Blizzard can’t do a damn thing about it now.
10/28/2018 10:29 PMPosted by Porscha
Guilds wipe on normal, so our objective is not no wipes. Wipes will happen no matter what you do. The objective is convenient raiding, with reasonable standards in place to mitigate wipes.
But in the end, baddies are out there and not just in LFR mind you. Baddies are in guilds, and they raid Uldir Normal
Absolutely there are bad players in guilds and lots of guild groups wipe. A lot.
But what they have that random groups don't is collective learning.
A guild group goes in and wipes a bunch, but each pull a small amount of progression happens, until the group knows the fight well enough to kill the boss.
A lfr group would go in and lose 40% if it's players every few wipes, getting new players in, very possibly setting the collective knowledge back every time players cycle in.
10/28/2018 10:27 PMPosted by Porscha10/28/2018 10:24 PMPosted by Rosenoa...
A average lfr player could barely do lfr.
And plus you can already q up with a custom group for normal + stuff.
People seem to be assuming that queuing for normal would be as easy as queuing for LFR. Umm, no. Obviously there would have to be higher standards in place.
its not the ilvl issue its the mechanics issue.
in lfr mechanics that are supposed to 1 shot you are watered down to where you can stand in them on purpose.
On this pally on the crazy servant boss in nighthold I did an experiment I had the wrist legendary which procs a shield of vengeance on a killing blow and the amount the shield gets eaten away it does 200% damage then I could holy wrath at 1 hp on top of it.
I couldn't even get the shield to proc standing in the beam the whole time.
On normal mechanics are supposed to be more punishing. like if you ignore it you will die most likely.
the difference between LFR and normal is lfr is literally tourism mode where the heroic and mythic raiders there who are there for XMOG can carry the raid while everyone stands in the fire.
Im not saying lfr is bad I still run lfr and for the most part have fun,
but on principle as soon as you leave lfr into normal the tour is over. it's time to start watching fatboss videos, know your class, know the mechanics, and I don't think most casual lfr players do that which is fine. and that's why we don't que into normal or heroic or mythic. to preserve the integrity of the mechanics in place for those who like bigger challenges.
if you made normal into an lfg auto que you would have to start tuning around that for sure.
10/28/2018 10:31 PMPosted by Espur10/28/2018 10:29 PMPosted by PorschaGuilds wipe on normal, so our objective is not no wipes. Wipes will happen no matter what you do. The objective is convenient raiding, with reasonable standards in place to mitigate wipes.
But in the end, baddies are out there and not just in LFR mind you. Baddies are in guilds, and they raid Uldir Normal
Queued groups have no patience for wipes, nor reasonable standards. They're thrown together players of generally the lowest skill levels.
This seems to be a popular sentiment, that everyone in LFR is terrible. Simply not true. Every LFR I've done there is always 365+ iL players and at least a handful putting out big numbers.
Sorry, I know people want to believe they're better than everyone in LFR but if you think so, go queue and watch how at least a few dps will challenge or beat you and at least one healer will give you run for your money. Not every time, but most times.
Fact is, there are lots of good players who cannot commit to a regular raid schedule, so they queue for raids. They don't always suck and some are very good in fact.
10/28/2018 10:37 PMPosted by Rautha10/28/2018 10:27 PMPosted by Porscha...
People seem to be assuming that queuing for normal would be as easy as queuing for LFR. Umm, no. Obviously there would have to be higher standards in place.
its not the ilvl issue its the mechanics issue.
in lfr mechanics that are supposed to 1 shot you are watered down to where you can stand in them on purpose.
On this pally on the crazy servant boss in nighthold I did an experiment I had the wrist legendary which procs a shield of vengeance on a killing blow and the amount the shield gets eaten away it does 200% damage then I could holy wrath at 1 hp on top of it.
I couldn't even get the shield to proc standing in the beam the whole time.
On normal mechanics are supposed to be more punishing. like if you ignore it you will die most likely.
the difference between LFR and normal is lfr is literally tourism mode where the heroic and mythic raiders there who are there for XMOG can carry the raid while everyone stands in the fire.
Im not saying lfr is bad I still run lfr and for the most part have fun,
but on principle as soon as you leave lfr into normal the tour is over. it's time to start watching fatboss videos, know your class, know the mechanics, and I don't think most casual lfr players do that which is fine. and that's why we don't que into normal or heroic or mythic. to preserve the integrity of the mechanics in place for those who like bigger challenges.
if you made normal into an lfg auto que you would have to start tuning around that for sure.
Totally agree and I too run LFR for "raiding lite" where I can crank up my tunes, pretty much ignore mechanics and have fun. I get it, and by no means am I saying to replace LFR with Normal. I'm saying we should have both, where we can queue for a LFR level raid or normal.
If you queue for normal, yeah, you better know mechanics and your role or you will probably get kicked.
So what you are saying is: LFR, but harder, with more mechanics.
Yes, that'd work.
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Yes, that'd work.
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