I agree and the map is the most fun when its pugs vs pugs. its back and forth.
I joined a few premades a few weeks ago, thats really the extent of my participation in that. It’s not fun for the premade people. I mean by that…it’s more of a business enviroment. Getting honor via premade is just a transaction.
All that written…it won’t change. Because it has never changed. So it won’t.
So you pop flasks to fight people you already outgear? This seems exhausting…
Whens the last time you played retail? Because considering the amount of daily things to do to keep up is far from catering or giving leeway to those who dont have the time to play.
Liiike season 1 of BFA, terrible expansion IMO, they ruined PvP in s2
Its not a great expansion ill give you that but its not what you described it as either.
The focus of this conversation is pvp, gaining rating or casually doing BGs in retail is considerably easier than trying to rank up in classic or queue in against pre-mades. The type of people complaining about classic premades likely aren’t the type to be doing the massive laundry list of daily nonsense in BFA anyway, because they are once again, casual.
The future pvp systems are far better and more enjoyable than the one Classic has though. Theres really nothing impressive about someone who spent 20 hours a day to get R14 that also doesnt require actual skill to obtain.
I agree with you.
I misunderstood the earlier quote I was refuting. Carry on
All these threads are from the “victim mentality” this generation loves so much. Easier to complain endlessly for other people to fix your issues then to actually use the resources you have to fix it yourself.
I don’t know if it’s victim mentality in this case. Here’s an example…a few times each week I head down to the park to play basketball. There’s a guy with bad knees, a fat guy trying to burn some calories and various other people around waiting to get into games. Now imagine we have to play against a pro team when we finally get on the court? Even the Hawks would crush us and we wouldn’t have fun and the fat guy might, in fact, die.
It’s not “victim mentality” to want to have a little fun. Playing against sweaty rankers all day isn’t a great experience. Why is even mentioning having fun on this forum a crime?
You example is terrible.
Most the teams you are up against are not “pro teams”. You just think they are because the average pug team is just THAT bad. Your fake example is people with legitimate health concerns. Unless you somehow built a character that is disabled, then you have all the tools at your disposal to build a team that is at least mediocre. My guild’s team are all PVE’ers and are not pro PVP’ers in the slightest, but we still win a decent amount of our matches and put up a good fight against the better teams. So I stick with my original arguement and your completely out of context example is not going to change my mind.
One thing a lot of people don’t consider is how few pugs actually have healers
Premades can be absolutely garbage and still win a high amount of games
You turn premades into a separate bracket. Problem solved. Don’t worry about AV, it’s already dead.
This misconception that every premade is a sweaty, neckbeard is just ridiculous. If you just put a little effort in to making a team, you would be amazed at how much better the games go if only from group comp, and communication. People in pugs are constantly fighting over leadership and nobody knows who to listen to. If you create your own group, at least everyone should know who the leader is and follow directions. Just these 2 things alone could easily double your win rate even with a pretty garbage premade.
Was aggreeing with you btw 
Then you’re just a pug+.
You’re not a premade.
I am fine with that. We are having fun and not complaining to have things changed. I will take my 30%-40% win rate over the 0% win rate that most of these posters are claiming.
I have a career, kids, and wife that are keeping me from playing anywhere near the amount that I was able to during vanilla. I have no interest in pushing for rank because I know that I will not be able to put in that kind of dedication, but I am having fun with guildies/friends and having some good matches. Call me what you want, but my team will still beat your pug and make you cry on forums
Cool but when blizz match premades against premade then it’s you who will have 0% win and we will have 50%.
Then you will cry and the cycle of whining will continue 
They won’t. And using some fantasy of yours about the future doesn’t make for a great arguement.
When talking mice take over the world, you will be sorry!!!
They broke premades once they can do it again