Hello,
(Background)
First, I want to say I hope everyone actively playing 9.2 has had better luck with Tier than I have. For background, as of today, I have killed 27 bosses in SFO that drop Tier tokens and have not looted a token off of a single one. I do want to say that I have a Tier helm from my Great Vault which I received on 3/22.
(Current Problem)
Last night a Warlock in our guild looted 3 tokens out of 7 kills. The Warlock that got lucky already had 4 pieces and everyone on that token has their tier set as well. In the end, 2/3 of the Tier drops went to waste. This might seem like a normal system at the middle to late stages of a patch, however, we still have 2 people in my guild that do not even have 2 piece tier set (myself included). It is incredibly discouraging that I can play for more hours and do more content and still end up without loot. While being unlucky with Tier may seem like a small quality of life issue it has greatly affected my gameplay inside of raid and outside of raid. I have gotten declined from MANY +15 LFG groups this week because I do not meet their minimum requirement of 2 set Tier. Even though I have KSM and worked hard to do so in the first 3 weeks I have found myself unable to play this week. I have also been declined from PVP because of my lack of set. While you could make the argument “Why not just do lower keys and content until you get tier?” I would counter with that is not how I want to play… I enjoy pushing myself and doing challenging content. Which I am no longer able to do because of the Tier barrier.
(Hope)
I know that on April 12th the new creation catalyst system will go live but my hope is that Blizzard will consider implementing it sooner. Creation launching 6 weeks after raid is incredibly late IMO since it doesn’t offer much for bad luck. Instead, I see Creation as an alt catch-up or non-Raider catch-up. While I fully believe there should be alt-friendly catch-up I do not want this to be the only system for those that get unlucky on their main. Ideally, I’d love to see reroll tokens come back into the game ASAP or some form of Vendor that takes a currency dropped for tier bosses (x amount of boss kills could = one token). Even adding a guaranteed drop chance for tier once per difficulty would feel more rewarding than the current RNG iteration.
(Conclusion)
I DO NOT want Tier sets removed from the game. Actually, I love them being added back in. Classes get a much-needed boost mid-X-Pack and it allows for underperforming specs to become relevant without major changes to their existing base toolkit. I DO WANT to see a major change to how Tier is handled especially if this Patch is really going to be 12 months or more. I know people that are at their wit’s end including myself that feel they cannot play the game with enjoyment due to being declined from every form of content due to RNG.
Please let me know your thoughts and what you like/dislike about the current system. This is meant as a feedback discussion and not just to flame developers who put a lot of effort into this game.
Best,
Krovey
16 Likes
I’m not sure you understand exactly how the catalyst will work when it comes out.
There is a global set of charges for every character in the game. currently that number is 0. Starting on 4/12, you gain 1 per week (this will accelerate later). So if I cap another toon in early June, I’ll have 4 set as soon as I have 4 upgradeable items and the flux.
It’s just not out yet because not having 4set does not make you behind the curve yet. Having 4 set makes you ahead of the curve.
1 Like
It just needs to be out already and since we’re in the week, on Tuesday. It’s an amazing system that will primarily only be good for alts, which largely devalues it.
It’s also supposed to be for bad luck protection, which at the moment it’s unable serve one of it’s purposes.
4 Likes
Open the creation catalyst next week
Clearly whatever “bad luck protection” blizz has for tier pieces is not working
13 Likes
Git GUD … I mean GIT LUCKY
8 Likes
Okay, I do understand how the system works. The issue is just what you said… it’s really built for alts and much later catch-up. Secondly, I raid in a CE guild, we clear normal every week, run LFR, and clear heroic for tier. I have not gotten a single drop and still do not have 2 set which puts me severely behind. It impacts how I play the game since I get declined from pugs as well.
2 Likes
Then (if you are wanted to be on the roster by your guild), you should be at near maximum priority to be traded tier next farm raid.
1 Like
Well, that is part of the issue… Completing sets is the priority for maximum raid damage. When I did not have a tier item I lost out on drops to maximize raid potential. Now that I have a tier piece our last 7 tokens have been the wrong ones for Hunter. The amount of RNG behind this system is crazy.
1 Like
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ONE token type. None of this junk where I can only share with two other classes that might not be in the raid.
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Have each of the five tier tokens drop off two bosses and have Zovaal drop all of them
Creation Catalyst, in true fashion, is selling a solution to a problem they create and they’ll crow later about how people engaged in the system without mentioning that poor drop rates, and making the tokens so class restricted essentially forces it.
7 Likes
Honestly I never liked the RNG in this game. It was always garbage seeing other people just get lucky while you get squat for your effort. It feels 10x worse doing a much better job and NOT being the reason for any wipes and still having the same result. Or having friends that put less time into the game than you just come up with similar or better gear because they just got better luck.
I dunno, there’s just a time and place for RNG and the majority of rewards that are tied to how your character performs is not it. Probably explains why I haven’t bothered to play this game competitively since like WotLK and MoP. I can stomach a bonus RNG drop but please give me some currency to spend at a vendor for my guaranteed loot. And don’t make it something that takes forever to farm like multiple weeks for one piece.
We all know the best guilds in the world game the system to get multiple upgrades in a week. The game is basically balanced around them and catered to what they can do. So when Blizzard actively tries to impede their progress they just find another way around it. And then the rest of us are left behind getting upgrades at a much slower pace.
Ironically the master loot system was the best because then you could give gear to those that earned it. By being better performers and showing up to all the raids before the content was put on farm. Even though I completely despised such a loot system for pugs, at least being in a casual guild was rewarding. Now there’s just no point. If there was a way to make the game automatically reward you for similar conditions even in a pug setting that’d be great.
Are you doing good enough dps for your ilvl? Or are you just lazily pressing buttons and barely a step up above being afk? Are you constantly dying to the same mechanics? Reward people that perform better. Are you actually showing up to the raid every week? There should be a per instance multiplier that lets you get a targeted piece of gear at a higher and higher chance till it eventually becomes 100%.
The game also doesn’t really reward you for going the extra mile. Gem, enchant your gear… drink potions or foods. That costs you money. It helps EVERYONE get the kill faster and the game spits on you for your effort and gold by giving someone else loot while you get a fat nothing. Makes me never want to explore that optional system unless I’m in a guild that can just provide the stuff to everyone because they sell carries and everyone is rich.
I know I’d certainly be buffing every fight if it like doubled my potential loot gains.
3 Likes
It more than doubles your loot gains. The boss might not die otherwise.
UPDATE!
Currently doing our second raid of the week and I am now the only player in the guild without 2 set Tier
3 Likes
The fact you only get 1 tier per 10 people in a raid setting is just beyond asinine. We had 10 players tonight, had the same token drop the entire evening across tier bosses. I’m beyond annoyed with the loot system.
To add insult to injury, the weekly vault giving you a tier item multiple times and the additional ones can be lower item level is also beyond sensible.
I get Blizzard wanted to discourage the RWF teams from getting 4pc too early, but all the gating you did, it didn’t help & it is only making the game significantly unfun for the remainder of the players in the process.
I’m convinced it’ll be week 12 before I see 4pc while everyone else just trots around with their own across multiple characters and I don’t even have it on my main.
Great work Blizzard, really good work.
7 Likes
I knew tier sets would go poorly right from the start. Just like how I knew domination gear would go poorly from the start. It really isn’t rocket science.
Tier sets will work themselves out though over time once the creation catalyst opens and people build up a lot of charges. But as of right now the system is a failure in my eyes
2 Likes
What irks me even more is Blizzard will nerf tier bonuses and only those who got super lucky with 4pc will get to enjoy it before it happens too. I fully expect that.
7 Likes
I would direct folks to my thread about bad luck protection and alt catch-ups ideally needing to be separate systems with stuff like this. I don’t mind luck as a factor, but I think they whiffed the early implementation and caused severe outliers of engaged, no- or low-tier players that now get to watch the fun everyone else is having through the glass wall of terrible loot luck. And worse, they continue to be disadvantaged beyond 4/12 while crossing their fingers that they don’t craft something that’s about to drop for them in Sepulcher.
It just isn’t very well-considered as an early system, or it is - neither scenario is particularly inspiring.
1 Like
Again, I want to encourage this post to be feedback-based. I understand how frustrating the current system can be with the RNG, trust me I know. But let’s stay away from “Blizzard sucks x,y,z.”
<3
Thanks guys!
It’s also bad luck protection. It’s in the blue post, it’s meant for finishing tier on mains.
1 Like
Though that is the intention I’m not sure that is how it actually is working. 50% of my guild has 4 pieces, 95% have 2 pieces and I am sitting alone with 1. If I have the same bad luck I will not be completing my set for a long while and others have had theirs for a bit. I can understand it being used to complete sets but the disparity in drop chance and luck doesn’t really allow for the Catalyst to function as intended IMO.
1 Like
Precisely, so how do we find a way to get it to function correctly? I think the simplest answer is to release it now, maybe even backdate a charge or two to correct the initial mistake.
Raid currently = 9.0 & 9.1 Torghast
Instead of drooling through Torghast for the Nth time it’s normal raid, LFR, or even heroic for some.
Instead of giving it away for free they could have even given us a reasonable means for buying charges of it. Instead of the really cheap costs of Flux to convert a piece, maybe you spend 10k flux to buy an account bound charge to convert it and you can convert as fast as you get flux. However fast you want flux is entirely up to player agency.
2 Likes