that is not the fault of starsurge but convoke itself. Starsurge is supposed to kill things when you pop cooldowns. That isn’t the problem. What is the problem is casting muiltiple spells in a single gcd.
I dont consider getting 2 shot by 2 starsurges acceptable. Maybe you do. Just because a guy pressed his DPS Macro and hit 4 twice, your supposed to die? Its too much even without Convoke, but Convoke makes it even worse.
The risk vs reward in SL is completely out of whack for some classes, and people thinking getting 2 shot by instant abilities is acceptable conditions becuase you used a CD, is proof enough. The difference in doing that compared to trying to outplay/survive it, is massive.
Its not like hes casting 3 second Chaos Bolts here. Its instant cast damage.
1 Like
lot to catch up on. i’m not gonna quote the explanation of vivify or chains again for people who may or may not have been run off their own region’s forums as an impetus for lurking here on a level 10-it’s fine to disagree. blizzard is not gonna listen to me anyway, i’ll live with it if yall don’t.
oh yikes, my bad. i’ll modify that line, thank you.
cmon dude, does unbreakable restealth really seem like a fair tool to keep at your disposal?
i can agree that convoke is a unique problem, but starsurge with full modifiers still hits a lot harder than most of us think it should when it can rng crit at any time without BOAT and incarn/ca last 30/20 seconds. that’s an awfully long time for a ranged spec to be able to force the “counterplay” of running headlong for the pillar, isn’t it?
Exactly true. But Blizzard isn’t going to do anything. I’m convinced whoever is running PvP right now plays paladin.
What do you want? Stop the rogue from getting away then. You have the tools to do that.
Hasn’t deep roots been a thing for a long time now?
Would you guys agree that stuns are the hands-down best cc in the game? And that pvp goes and kills are literally built around them? And even in pve, M+ is still completely designed around them despite the fact that Blizz has made changes to stuns precisely for this reason?
I feel like deep roots, and the current conduit(s) to allow more dmg before fear breaks are both attempts to add value to cc other than stun. I’m not sure if they’ve hit the mark yet, but imo they are trying with these things.
2 Likes
Yep you’re right. And almost every stun is also instant cast. Perhaps that is the problem
1 Like
far as i know, but aff hasn’t been for most of the overlap time. i’ve never liked it, fwtw, but it wasn’t obnoxious in bfa cuz either every MLD was dumb, every druid had 3 move slot syndrome, or even deep roots roots broke constantly when destro was firing chaos bolts every 2 seconds. couldn’t really say between the choices
i’ll bite
rogue team does a go that gets cooldowns but doesn’t win the game. rogue starts retreating, but he used sprint during the go, so he isn’t beating feet, and the mage and the disc are in the open, so step won’t break line of sight. this puts the rogue in a position to dive toward a pillar no other players are on, maybe right through me and my team because we already did our counter go and got his evasion or ps or whatever.
right now, or within a couple seconds, everyone on my team is off of stun dr. if i dive right behind the pillar, i commit myself to a position where i could get brutalized with my healer being ccd by LoS before they even get the free sheep i’m in no position to stop. if we want to stop the rogue from getting a restealth-not even do meaningful damage to him, just continue to tag with abilities that force him to use an actual cd if he wants to get back into full stealth, the entire team has to follow the rogue around.
and let’s sprinkle another wrinkle in, what if this happens later into a game, when the disc has finished farting out 8 radiances between their terrible goes and has to drink? if we dive the rogue and they just use their drs and 0-1 dances to peel us well enough that we can’t get any meaningful damage out, the disc can be 60 yards away getting a full drink and we have less hope of stopping it than we did when it was a double mage rdruid in bfa.
please try to understand-these are scenarios where a good rogue player would be looking for a restealth anyway. I’m not trying to say that that’s a problem in and of itself, but that it should be one good players can solve by putting a fresh dot on a rogue before he leaves his healer’s line of sight on that solo mission.
Bloodlust doesn’t cost any mana if you take the shamanism PvP talent.
I was like “hold up wait, did it get randomly hotfixed since the last time I checked?”
https://imgur.com/Zsay6oG
So I hop on a horde shaman instead
Sure enough Lust is free with Shamanism, Hero isn’t
ok cool sick
im actually so mad rn lol, do you know how many games i’ve been in where i could have turned on a dime with doom winds lust only being 12% of my mana instead of 33%?
e: i cant actually math its 33% whatever
2 Likes
i’m so sorry that’s hilarious
down with alliance
4 Likes
Every time a rogue runs off to restealth, you are 3v2. Thats the trade off if the rogues allowed to re. In 2’s its evenworse. I run’ n re, and my team mate is 2v1.
You are forgetting this aspect
what do you think most teams can do with 10 or so seconds to hit a mage that’s already using his peel drs? cuz the answer is almost always nothing, especially in the situation i laid out that stipulates the offensive cds have already been spent on the rogue.
Stop hia polys? Dude im just saying. Rogue runs away to restealth and you are officially 3v2. Uou cant stop a mage CCing with 3 ppl on him and no rogue support?
u forgot that the mage is also like unkillable
Well hopefully not so much on tuesday.
@merfy what comp you play?
uh huh. i’m gonna stop engaging with this, you’re starting to sound like a twitch viewer more than a player. in real games, 3 people vs a mage at 20yds and a disc at 40 do not have a hope in hell of doing anything relevant to the mage before the rogue gets the re that dots were supposed to prevent, and then the rogue gets back in and turns off any damage to triune ward you’d managed to do.
the actual play you make if you do have to give up on preventing the rogue re is just diving the priest, but that forfeits any hope of making the rogue use vanish or meld to begin the go, and having those tools during a go is an advantage i don’t think is fairly earned here.
You are making rmp sound like an S tier comp…
Like there is nothing you can do at all?
it’s not rogues’ fault that triune ward exists
to fairly complain about something in a vacuum, which is what i’m claiming to do, and ignore its relative strength with rogue not being the best melee rn, i have to account for the possibility that people are playing rogue with other dps specs than mage. it’s possible that going the other target while the rogue with a full flame shock gets a re he doesn’t deserve will be more rewarding on a spriest or boomkin or ret than it would be on a mage, but that doesn’t change my certainty that the conduit just makes the game feel crappy.