Just about any other RPG where your stats are permanent and you can’t switch classes and abilities? Look at DnD, you can’t just switch all willy nilly.
as it should be, everything is too easy to switch as of late. It doesn’t even cost anything to switch specs anymore.
Actually part of the larger issue is not what Blizzard designs into the game, but actually how the players act like they need to have everything. Your not able to make anything unique in the game anymore. It either has to be uniform to give everyone the same power no matter what path the player chooses or its the end of the world. A part of an RPG is that you make choices that lead you one way or the other and it may not grant you the same powers, spells or abilities. Sometimes these things are not 100% balanced, its not due to the lack of trying, its just how it happens.
More and more people sim everything little aspect of the game. Even people who really don’t need to sim what they are wearing, they simply do not play at the level that requires it. But because we fallen into the crack of sim happy players its more and more an issue. So while yes a 1% or 2% advantage in one choice might be something a mythic person would be worries about, the more casual player really shouldn’t care that much about. But the times we live in they do, they expect as much balance or bonus as someone running mythic raids now days.
I don’t recall doing the mage tower as locking you out of elite pvp. Must’ve missed that.
The only wake up call they will get is when so many players leave the game that the accountants tell them to fix it.
But they won’t be able to, even if they are willing. A core system like this that the entire expansion is built on cannot be tweaked to change it from the inside out.
They know full well people are going to hate this. They knew it before they even made the choice. That’s why they’re introducing it to us now rather than closer to release, because they think pushing it now will get player buy-in.
Players aren’t going to care about some purity of design that with come with strict adherence to some arbitrary “RPG” ideal. They’re going to care about fun. And there’s a lot to this system that people who play the game are going to find is not fun.
Once you make your choice you will never be able to make another choice. You are locked into a rut for the entire expansion, and no amount of lecturing people on purity of design will make that fun.
Go moralize somewhere else.
Covenants don’t lock you out of elite PVP though, so I don’t understand the comparison.
And you can’t change classes here either.
Like…the tabletop games? Are we comparing that to a video game? So the jrpg videogame isn’t a fair comparison but a tabletop game is?
You know that having two separate systems like players are asking for still doesn’t mean it has to be easy, right? They could make it an unlock that involves having to go do another Covenant yet keep you from getting that Covenant’s cosmetics.
Maybe I’m just jaded at this point based on basically every bad idea that was brought up in previous alphas/PTRs… pretty sure it’s there way of saying “we know it sucks, we are hearing your feedback, but we’re choosing to ignore it so move on.”
Yeah but you don’t NEED the covenant abilities to complete content. That’s what people are saying.
From the examples of abilities I’ve seen, like Hunter’s shooting without line of sight, I don’t see how any PvP Hunter is not going to take that Covenant. And if they do, good luck getting on any semi-serious arena or rbg team.
I am not sure I actually understand what the primary issue is. I’ve read through quite a bit of this topic, along with others, and people are talking in many different directions at once.
If I understand correctly your chosen covenant will provide you with a slew of cosmetic items such as mounts, pets and transmog, as well as 2 abilities (one general skill and one that is class based) as well as the ability to “soulbind” with elder members of the covenant which unlocks some sort of talent tree you progress in via anima…
And this is bad because you might like the look of the transmog from one, but feel you have to pick another because it’s soulbind tree has a skill thats just uber leet for your class in pvp or mythics or what have you?
Why then cannot the soulbind be generic class based power ups no matter who you have it with while the other cosmetic items and 2 skills remain unique for flavor?
Choosing the wrong covenant certainly will lock a player out of elite pvp.
Ok…
Currently according to Worldofwargraphs as of december 2019. Of all the players who were 2200+ rating, 11.4% of them were rogues. Their specs were as follows:
9.5% Assassin
1.3% Outlaw
.6% Sub
So… the META for the rogue is assassin to achieve 2200+ right? If you’re not playing assassin you’re gimping yourself, right?
This is Pikaboo. He is currently the 11th highest rated PVP player on the US servers with a rating of 2748. And guess what, he is currently playing SUB, which is only represented by .6% of all rogues above 2200+.
According to the META he is playing a bad spec. But because he is a great player, he can make it work. So please, quit saying you NEED certain abilities to be good when there are currently players playing non-meta specs and are rank 11 in the entire US for PVP.
You are just like the players I meet in League of Legends who say you need to play the meta and are stuck in silver, when there are non-meta challengers because they’re good at the game.
Oh, so he chose the wrong covenant? No. Everything you posted is completely irrelevant to the issue at hand. You KNOW this, and you’re trying to distract us.
There will be one covenant that gives an ability that will be mandatory for PvP.
“LOL, you chose THAT covenant and you want to get into MY yolo group? GTF out of here you moron, uninstall and kys.”
According to World of Wargraphs, 9.5%, a hard majority of high rated rogues, feel you need to play assassin to get the higher rating. Players are proving them wrong by being good at the game.
When high rated players are playing non-meta specs and still succeeding, it’s not the spec or the covenant ability, it’s the person using them.
Which should tell you there’s a Meta and only a few of the best players in the world can go against it and succeed on the level of the Meta.
But people on this thread are saying it is going to be impossible to achieve things with non-optimal settings. When people are proving them wrong in-game.
Per your point, you literally have to be one of the best in the world to achieve that! You even cited only .6% can compared to the other almost 10% of Rogues!
But in the end it will be easy to switch, keep them locked, best way to do it.
Keep working on that “because rogues” argument. Nothing you are saying is relevant to the issue you are trying to distract us from. Apparently you don’t even understand it yourself if you think it is.
By the way, finding ONE PLAYER who has excelled in spite of bad balance is anything but a resounding endorsement of a system guaranteed to make things much worse.
You’re like those people who say, “There’s one feral in the top 500, therefore feral is fine” every time feral is total trash.
I think covenant abilities should be like a talent tree and easy to switch and swap as you please. Unless they somehow manage to balance all the abilities and make it so everything is equal. But thats from a min/maxing perspective and maybe someone else has a better idea
Talents would do nothing as soulbinds still exist, people would still complain