I’m gonna preface this by saying I’m mainly commenting on the dps specs.
So talents are a thing, and while there are some great ones that affect the way we play and give us power in meaningful ways (infected claws + bursting sores combo, for example), it’s really neat. Even when a talent isn’t particularly strong, it can be really nice to have as a niche option, like how clawing shadows is always going to be great when we need more uptime.
That said, there are continuing problems with certain talents that have been going on for 2+ expansions now that I feel eventually need to be addressed.
Starting with unholy:
Harbinger of Doom has continued to be a mediocre talent pick for Unholy. When it’s still not worth taking when the Death’s Certainty legendary and Embrace Death conduit both exist, it’s just not likely to get better. Pestilent Pustules seems to do a better job overall in st and blows it away in aoe. Unholy is still on the resource starved side compared to Legion and BFA (after Lucid Dreams became a thing) and Harbinger was a passive perk through our artifact weapon, so maybe it should become a baseline part of how Sudden Doom works and be replaced on the talent tree with something better (maybe a rebranded BFA Soul Reaper).
Unholy Pact is an amazing addition to its row and it’s great (even if fire isn’t super on theme with being a DK). But that’s kinda the problem; Unholy Pact alone is so good that it beats out the other two in all content by a mile. Even if you were to take both Phearomones and join Night Fae for Death’s Due, Unholy Pact still gives more dps in all situations than defile. The lesser two talents need to be brought up in value a bit, or the next time they nerf unholy’s damage, maybe partially do it by toning down this autopick talent a tiny bit.
Now onto Frost DK:
Icy Talons has been a bad pick for the longest time, even when at face value it synergizes so much with the rest of DK’s kit (Killing Machine procs, Runic Attenuation, Frozen Pulse). It probably needs a look.
Glacial Advance is this interesting ability on paper, but in practice it has never been worth taking, only more discouraged by the existence of BoS. Being on a 6s CD for no apparent reason doesn’t help it, either.
For PvE. It appears to be a pretty popular pick for competitive PvP.
A few additions
Frozen pulse shouldn’t exist. It’s a fire-and-forget passive on what you’re already doing anyway (keeping runes low.) I have a similar feeling regarding avalanche. even passive talents should impact how you play in some manner. Personal opinion.
Also, gathering storm should probably be a core part of RW functionality. It’s been the de-facto choice since Legion, it’s an interesting interaction, and frankly it’s healthier for frost’s gameplay to have RW as a regular rotational ability rather than the core “two buttons and a proc.”
I’m surprised that Gary is not mentioned in this post. Could it be that maybe I’m underestimating it as a talent?
Defile and the current state of Pestilence should be merged.
Bring back Necrotic Plague in place of Gary and make a new disease spreading playstyle for Unholy.
Ebon Plague should affect ALL diseases DKs use, not just virulent plague.
Pestilent Pustules is a very boring passive for Unholy Dks vs Harbinger of Doom and Soul Reaper.
Death’s Due needs a little bit of buff as well as Defile to make it competitive against Unholy Pact. Right now, Unholy Pact is too good even as a NF DK.
GS should be baseline.
Maybe make Icy Talons baseline OR make it grant haste.
Fix GA and remove its CD. Maybe keep GS as a talent if GA is to be buffed and fixed. Hypothermic Presence is interesting but it’s just a very niche option.
Rework Frost Lv 35 row while making FScy baseline. This row is just way too passive to be consider to make interesting choices.
Buff Sudden Doom, maybe add DC damage modifier on top of it perhaps?
I didn’t realize Harbinger had a place in pvp. My mistake!
I can agree about Frostscythe being virtually the only thing on its row that switches up gameplay. I particularly hate frozen pulse for not having been adjusted at all for 2-hander DKs, and have slight annoyance that the occasional Night Fae FDK is able to forego frostscythe entirely.
Gathering storm as an interactive version of (and in my opinion, more interesting version of) baseline Pillar is great, and its power has only been encouraged by its conduit, but if they’re not going to give and replace it, I’d love for them to put in a decent and interesting st talent to compete with it.
Overall, I feel like Frost DK needs a bit of a revamp because it doesn’t feel like there’s much to do outside of having runes ready to spam for Winter + big cooldowns. It feels like a bit too much time is wasted on waiting for procs.
And I’m going to be honest, BoS needs to be changed or die off already. It’s oppressive in how much it limits and takes up FDK’s design.
Making BoS work like Bonestorm or do the exact same change they did with Voidform is probably the most feasible answer they can do without upsetting people who actually like BoS.
Also Frost could use an execute so maybe replacing Lv 35 talents to try that while making FScy baseline.
I find it hard to believe that Harbinger is used in PvP as Unholy is just meh in PvP rn.