The real problem with BFA

Community General Discussion
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Players. We, the players, are the real problem.

And we only have ourselves to blame. Blizzard gave us what we wanted.

In fact, to paraphrase Blizzard said “We know what you (the players) want better than you (the players) do”. They were right. And they gave it to us. And now we are paying for it.

Sure, the Azerite system has been a fiasco. There have been balance issues (as there have always been) but those get corrected. But those types of issues are not the biggest problem with the game overall.

The big problem is that WoW is an MMO that has been turned in to a single person game. I do not know where a good balanced cutoff should be, but it lies somewhere between LFD, LFR, LFD, Personal Loot, and everything else that has been introduced and removes the necessity of engaging with other players.

I do know, however, that particular agency and value has gone down drastically since I started in Cata. And the players I have come to know who have played longer saw it starting before then.

From my perspective, I can see the deterioration from when I started serious raiding in MoP. It was tough. It could have been easier, but I was new, really bad, and it took me quite awhile to learn how to really play.

I built a reputation for myself on that server, as someone who listened, and learned. There was no LFG at the time. Even a DPS might be hard to replace. Now with LFG? Just boot them. Grab another. Or as a player raid fails? Just leave. Find another. No learning. No consequences. Nothing.

There is no more agency to actually working together.

Take it from there and removing the value of guilds in general… especially the personal loot only system. On that, Blizzard said they were protecting “trials” and LFG groups. I shouldn’t need that protection. If I don’t like a groups loot policy, why should I make them conform to me? Just find a different group.

Those are just a couple of my specific thoughts on the problem. I have a few more, but overall, it’s more down to the point of community is very important to this game. As a single player experience, it pretty much sucks. But add others, and it becomes interesting.

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I don’t recall asking for them to delete valor/justice points myself and asking them to replace it with the mess that is AP points.

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Nobody asked for any of this mess. It has benefited no players of any playstyle.

The idea that PL takes away from having to deal with other players means other players who intend to steal you blind in the pug groups they start can’t do that as they used to back in what you seem to feel was the good old days.

When they announced that they were removing ML, they said it was because they needed to eliminate split runs. Only after trolls on the forums came up with the “trials” meme (and raiders just totally worked their butts off to make sure everybody was familiar with it) did Ion grab it and claim that was the reason. Likely the reason was so they could slow down gearing and thus content would last longer.

You are just totally off base on this.

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It’s now a single player game pretty much sums it up. And once you finish a single player game, you quit playing it.

But I’d put the blame more on catch up mechanics then LFG or PL. ML was a massive hassle in terms of stable guild relationships and pugs were where you found a lot of eventual guild mates. Although cross sever makes that less viable now.

Effort vs. reward, clear gear progressions and any sense of accomplishment have been thrown out the window for the more addictive and constant trickle of gear in an attempt to get that last 25% of players into all the content.

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We really are the problem, since we find crud acceptable.

Even if you are semi OK, with this expansion, nearly everyone admits that it is pretty bad. The problem is those of us, like myself, who stay subscribed anyway.

Honestly, this is the first time that I really thought we should all unsubscribe. Imagine the affect that would have? Imagine if Blizzard came in, one morning, and no one was playing (or paying.) Imagine if everyone posted/submitted a reason as to why.

So yes, I agree that we are the problem.

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Blizz already showed us what would happen if most of its player base quit or if WoW wasn’t successful through HOTS. Quitting isn’t the answer

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Apples vs. Oranges

WoW’s success is a proven fact. WoW would be synonymous with “MMO” if it had come out sooner.

HoTS was a flaccid, nothing failure of a game to begin with. It was a loss they could survive cutting.

WoW is one of two metrics Activision’s long since used to relate it’s overall potential to shareholders. If that were to go down, heads would roll, panic would set in, and Activision would fundamentally change.

The loss of the little toe that is HotS is regrettable, but losing WoW would be like losing a limb.

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The problem is simple.

When WoW was created…the “creators” didn’t realize the ramifications of what they were doing. They became “rock stars”, nay “gods”…but all they really thought they were doing was making a game.

But here we are, all part of this world with our own desires and definitions of success, and the devs are the sole arbiters of our future as players.

They don’t understand why we get so upset. It’s because we are a part of this world yet have no control over it’s direction. It’s because we see this as a real world that we care about, so we rage.

They didn’t realize they were creating a real world. And they don’t really know how to be gods.

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Yep, all my fault that I’m bored and have nothing to do when I log on. How dare I do the 1 questline that was brought in 8.1.

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A lot of the old guard are gone. They knew they made something special. Unfortunately so did the vultures.

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I can agree with you to an extent Zilthlora. A lot of us players are entitled and it’s partly due to the increasing quality of life in video games (and life in general). We are used to getting what we want and continue to ask for and desire what we don’t have.

With that said the Azerite system is pointless unless you’re a hardcore Mythic raider. Then you’re forced to farm mind numbing content, repeatedly. The Azerite Gear system is lame in that it’s not very player intuitive. It could use some improvement or tweaks to make it work closer to the old tier system.

BFA is a vast ocean of potential that hasn’t been tapped into yet. Two of the most important features to BFA are War Fronts and Island Expeditions. Both of these are not very entertaining for me, I avoid doing them as much as possible, outside of doing War Fronts once per cycle per character.

Ok so I’ve been enjoying BFA - I’ve been subscribed since launch. I’ve experienced serious pain in seeing many friends, guild mates, acquaintances quit WOW. It’s so damn disheartening. I’ve loved WOW since 2006. It pains me so much that things are this way right now.

What really needs to happen is communication between game developer and player needs to be reestablished. We have 0 genuine discourse with the company that determines what goes in and out of the game and it really sucks. How can BFA possibly get any better if we all don’t discuss and compromise what’s going on in the game?

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I wanted more tamable murloc pets.

Still not seeing those.

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Speak for yourself. All I’ve ever asked for is to be able to play a High Elf in the otherwise awesome World of Warcraft. But noOOoOoOooo.

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I feel for you. All I’ve wanted in WOW since 2006 is the ability to roll a Rogue as a Tauren. /cry

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LOOK behind you! One just ran by…Quick go after it! (silly undead) :smiley:

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Hey look its another LFR and Personal loot complain thread in disguise.

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But all you do now is moOOoOoOooo.

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I don’t want much, just the account bound everything and maybe idk…FLYING.

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OP: You’re talking out of your donkey(alt)