I just cannot fathom that anyone working for Blizzard thought it would make sense to have to give someone permission to pillage your entire guild bank to be able to set their own guild note.
Surely this is not what they wanted. And yet, if it's not what they wanted, why did they do it? Did they not even consider the endless list of consequences a change like this would have? How is that possible?
The Rank permissions are still seperate from the bank access settings for that rank. I have no clue what you are talking about with this. LOL
Extended the cap once more on this one!
As you can imagine we're aware of this thread but don't have anything to share at this time but just wanted to say thanks for the continued feedback on this one. As soon as we have something to share we will post that for you guys.
Ythisens, thank you for letting us know that this is still being seen. :)
I'll take this moment to reiterate that this issue is paramount, and we need rank controls restored and improved upon.
Everything I have to say on the topic I've documented in this thread, and at
https://us.battle.net/forums/en/wow/topic/20766196416?page=1To any other blues else who may be watching:
The communication we've gotten about this change is dismal at best, non-existent at worst. Where are the rank changes in the patch notes? Why haven't these been documented? Why was this not specifically something that was asked to be tested and given feedback for in beta? I played in beta, and submitted a smorgasbord of bugs I encountered in vuldun. Not once did it occur to me that I should go look at guild controls. I never would have
imagined that they would be changed, let alone reduced.
When sweeping changes are made to guilds we need better communication.
When guild changes hit Beta, I think your testing would benefit from having an opt-in or selection for
entire guilds to copy to the test realm to test guild changes, perhaps for a limited time.
In a world where we're paying monthly for a service, changes to the service need to be clear and available. Logging in and finding ranks on fire and needing to spend time reformulating and re-deciding what all our ranks need to be instead of playing the new pre patch content is pretty not fun.
Please learn from this. A feature rollout as large as communities (which came with subsequent guild changes) and voice chat should have much, much more than 5 sentences written about it. See:
https://worldofwarcraft.com/en-gb/news/21959894/battle-for-azeroth-pre-patch-notes under "Social Features"
Thank you.
Extended the cap once more on this one!
As you can imagine we're aware of this thread but don't have anything to share at this time but just wanted to say thanks for the continued feedback on this one. As soon as we have something to share we will post that for you guys.
How?! How can you have nothing to share at this time? After all this feedback of people hating it? Stop doing things that literally nobody asked for.
And we can't even get a reason why this happened. Just "no comment." What the hell? Is it a system limitation with the new "Communities" feature? Is it more unwelcome streamlining? Is it because they hope to sunset guilds in favor of communities? Is this by design or are they working on a fix? So what if they're "listening?" Congrats, you guys are doing the bare minimum. We want to know where Blizzard stands here and why it happened.
The thing I find most frustrating about these changes other than the "single click rank permissions" is that I have to turn off all of my addon's in order to do anything to a guild member, such as put a note, promote etc. It will not allow me, for some reason to modify anything with my addon's turned on. I never had any issues until this was done. I have even tried the old version using /guildroster to no avail, sadly.
Might be time to hang up the old guild master hat and pass it along.
Extended the cap once more on this one!
As you can imagine we're aware of this thread but don't have anything to share at this time but just wanted to say thanks for the continued feedback on this one. As soon as we have something to share we will post that for you guys.
Could use a post like this in other threads going on forever too.
Or one telling us you shut the door on reconsidering.
So pretach is coming to an end this week and we still haven't had a 2nd blue post.
We know that it's intentional(the changes) else they would have said as much right off the bat like they do with bugs.
At this point we can just assume the answer we get is going to disappoint us because it looks pretty damn certain that we're about to go into BFA with this new change in place. Once it starts i doubt they will make the time to change it.
Extended the cap once more on this one!
As you can imagine we're aware of this thread but don't have anything to share at this time but just wanted to say thanks for the continued feedback on this one. As soon as we have something to share we will post that for you guys.
Tell Ion to stop trying to dictate what is fun for players. Removing features doesn't make things fun. Ever since he took over this has been a hallmark of WoW. The fact that this was allowed to move forward shows a complete disregard for the playerbase.
Revert the guild permission changes... do it now.
Extended the cap once more on this one!
As you can imagine we're aware of this thread but don't have anything to share at this time but just wanted to say thanks for the continued feedback on this one. As soon as we have something to share we will post that for you guys.
Tell Ion to stop trying to dictate what is fun for players. Removing features doesn't make things fun. Ever since he took over this has been a hallmark of WoW. The fact that this was allowed to move forward shows a complete disregard for the playerbase.
This is why you don't make a poopsock raider your top dev.
08/06/2018 08:27 PMPosted by
Daugil
This is why you don't make a poopsock raider your top dev.
Everything he has done has no reflection on his raiding history, quite contradictory if you ask me. Master Loot, Guild Permissions, Leveling Ease (frequent rerolling is a thing for higher end raiders, fast leveling was complimentary), GCD changes, all of it is crap to anyone who plays the game at a higher level.
I'm stunned that someone that could take this game so seriously as a player could do such a crap job at directing it.
Wow this thread has gotten a looooot of attention since I last posted... keep it up maybe we can get a revert! Blizz needs to not be lazy and just give us separate coding for guilds vs communities. They’re not entirely the same thing...
At least fix the public note shenanigans!!!!!
Blizzard is attempting to streamline the game for a number of reasons including ease of use for players as well as coding and looking down the road.
The problem is that players enjoy the customization elements of the game and meshing all these permissions together like this are really starting to interfere with guilds and their identities.
Guilds are not ‘Communities’ and should be allowed to incorporate a much more intimate experience for its members including permissions, access, and loot distribution.
How is this possibly not fixed yet?
Blizzard Please fix this and restore our guild controls as soon as possible or at the very least before the first raid comes out in BFA. This new guild control setup is terrible.
I'm not sure exactly what I want to say right now so I'll keep it simple.
We need a moderately heavy amount of control for ranks and permissions. Having a check box for who's an officer is fine but there still needs to be a good amount of tweaking options available.
Each guild has it's own unique way of handling these things and guild leaders should have the expertise to set everything exactly how things should be for that group of people.
In general, I'd like to see more features; not less. Tidying things up is fine but outright removing is usually not.
( Take a lesson from the GNOME project here and remember the outrage that occurred during the transition to GTK 3 and the extreme pruning of functionality and slow reintroduction. ;)
Once again pleading for old guild settings at the very least. Release is going to make it very difficult to handle any recruiting or additions to the guild.
Sadly, I think that the only way that this gets resolved in our favor at this point is if someone comes up with a theory of harm that will stick. If there is an identifiable tort or an identifiable breach theory available that would put Blizzard at an increased risk of having to spend money on mitigating that risk. If it becomes less expensive for them simply to revert the changes than to leave them as they currently exist then they will, from a business perspective, have little choice but to revert. Right now we are getting exactly zero in the way of feedback from Blizzard so I suspect that there is more to the story than we currently know. The last time I remember this occurring Blue eventually posted:
"...Finally, there's the natural question of why we didn't patch-note this. It was not to be deceptive; we know it's impossible to hide a change from millions of players. But the system was meant to feel largely transparent and subtle, just like level-scaling does if you don't stop and really think about it, and so we did want players to first experience the change organically. " That never got fixed. iLvl scaling is a part of this game going forward. Its sole purpose is to degrade the end user experience by slowing progression of open world content.
Unless we can come up with some means of turning this issue into a RealID fiasco that causes mainstream industry ezines and media to pile on or we can turn it into a Flying Noflying debate we won't see any changes to this issue. I think at this point that the guild masters are faced with a choice: Deal with what is now extant or pass the torch or disband. Until we negatively impact the revenue stream (say by affecting tournaments or world firsts and the like) the executives will not become aware of the issue. Executives are the only ones that can FORCE a change (the brown stuff always rolls down hill and Lead Game Designer is still beneath the boardroom level of administration) and they usually only use that stick when the investors tell them they have to use that stick or the investor walks away. The investor wont tell the executives to use that stick unless it becomes apparent that decisions made below the boardroom level are affecting revenue streams negatively.
Long story short. We want this reverted we have to make enough noise outside of the forums that we get noticed by those who are speculating on the stock. The only way I see THAT happening is if we can make a case that the changes to the permissions poses a threat of loss of control or loss of information or loss of security that imperils account information.
Had no idea this was a thing until now, but it explains why it's been really difficult to contact an officer in my guild lately.
Sadly, I think that the only way that this gets resolved in our favor at this point is if someone comes up with a theory of harm that will stick. If there is an identifiable tort or an identifiable breach theory available that would put Blizzard at an increased risk of having to spend money on mitigating that risk.
I'm sorry, but this is nonsense.
First, this is Blizzard's game, and they can do anything they want. It's very clearly stated in the EULA and ToS. There is no breach of anything here.
Second, we don't need to go all litigant to get things fixed around here. Yes, if it was an intentional change because this was the way Blizzard devs want guilds to be run now, odds of getting it fixed are close to nil. However, I think it's simply a result of blending the Communities feature with Guilds. It was probably easiest to do it this way to meet the deadline. Perhaps fingers were crossed in hope that it would fly and further tweaking wouldn't be needed.
I'm sure that some kind of fix will be brought forth sometime. I don't know when, and I don't know if it'll be all that the community wants in regard to guild control. But if we stay focused, refrain from insults, conspiracy theories, or threats, we're likely to see positive results sooner than if we let this thread devolve into some slavering cesspool of salt and vinegar. (Not that your post is in any way like that. I just think you're wrong about Blizzard only listening if we threaten their bottom line.)
Please revert ASAP. 8.1 won't be good enough. This needs to be fixed before release. 6 Days! At the absolute very least, let us know what you plan to do and when you plan to do it.