Lol k. Denial never ceases to amaze me
If they’re not easily swappable it primarily only becomes a problem if the balance is completely messed up, in which case that’s a problem regardless of how often you can switch.
It’s also worth reiterating that I said the system shouldn’t be so restrictive people are concerned about being able to respec for raid night if they want to do a bit of PvP.
What I don’t think should be as easily done is respeccing for each and every individual boss fight in a raid.
You are starting to cross the line between a little nuts and completely insane if you think adding any type of system that is anything like the azerite speccing system we have now is okay.
It is not okay to be punished if someone wants to play a single character to its full potential, and by that I mean being able to play a protection paladin one week and then switching to playing retribution the next week, or even playing one spec on a boss fight and then switching specs for the next fight.
The argument you are making is that if I want to play a paladin I should level 4 paladins and pick up a unique covenant on each one and gear each one so I can swap between them if I decide I want to use a different covenant.
H. E. L. L.
N. O.
Nope your talking about yourself here all the best gear still comes from harder content you keep reaching here sir your good at it.if it cater to me there would be world content on hard mode and world bosses think rift endgame it doesnt exist at all here sir.To bad i hate how that game works or plays over there tower might be worth a stay in shadowlands.
Holy run on sentence batman.
I think I pieced together what you attempted very poorly to say. You only confirm my believe that this game caters towards players/people like you.
???
So having the choice is forcing people now.
I didn’t call you blind that’s very selective from you.
blind gaming is basicly only playing without guides or if you prefer without caring about guides. It’s just a style, it’s not meant to be derogatory.
Seems like you’re just a troll. Yes they should try to balance them, but that doesn’t mean that making them swapable would make them worse balance wise. xd I don’t think you had any valuable argument about this explaining how it would make them less balanced if we could swap them. You only suppose they would balance them less if they make them swapable?
People made multiple characters to get the “right” legendaries.
People got benched for not having the “right” legendaries because they were something up to 20%+ of your output.
They designed content with legendaries in mind in ToV for sure, with Helya being really hard on enrage. I would say you don’t have knowledge about cutting edge content with your experience.
And that’s not an argument. It would be ignorant to think so. 
Because you’re fine with it DUDE xd
Because we were never in the situation where it was obvious to play 4 of the same class to deal with a problem. This is something concerning. We are voicing that feedback, you clearly disagree for mainly personnal reason, I get it. 
I mean let’s face it … If players can freely swap covenants, they will. They will swap for mythic+, they will swap for raids, they will swap for pvp, they will swap for questing. Heck, they will swap between pulls while in raids, or in mythic+. I know at this point, it might be the only way to salvage the covenant system in a realistic development time frame … but it still doesn’t change that being able to freely swap without any real penalty is stupid and degenerate solution to an even bigger problem.
I don’t know what an elegant solution would look like in the time constraints they, but IMO, they are damned if they do and damned if they don’t. Keep covenants as they are, and there is going to be massive backlash (rightly so). Or, change covenants to freely swap (which does satisfy a serious problem), but make a huge portion of the RPG elements completely meaningless.
I mean, unless there an option C that prevents players from feeling forced into a covenant for a specific ability, while also not making covenants feel completely worthless, then I hope they can find it.
Disagree i already said i hate how the endgame us set up i could careless if easy gear went away i want my solo hardmode gameplay sir but it ain’t happening and i dont mean visions either timed crap can go to hell.
Lol, the dude abides.
To your argument from a philosophical level, it’s the non-combat factors that really make Door of Shadows strong. Very few classes have a teleport. If you played competitively, DKs really have no choice but to take Door of Shadows. It’s icing on the cake that they’d also get an AOE Grip. Those don’t deal damage, but that can save you time and offer situational utility that doesn’t have a downside. If you don’t pick Venthyr as a competitive DK, you’re a meme.
A good compromise for me is being able to switch atleast once a day without penalty. I can live with that. Anything that make it worse than just making another character and gearing it is not an option.
Please don’t stoop to personal attacks. It’s okay to disagree. We all have opinions. There is no right answer for the direction the game should go; it’s all just our personal preference.
3 Likes
I agree everyone has their own opinion. I also believe some opinions are more valuable and are superior to others. Not all opinions are created equal.
I guess that’s admirable to desire at least some flexibility.
I still don’t see what benefit I get as an RP/Casual if this was executed the way you envision.
All it would do is restrict someone who enjoys playing freely.
I mean I guess if you like other people being restricted - then sure, that’s a benefit you gain. But it’s not anything tangible that impacts your gameplay. At that point your benefit comes from the detriment of someone else.
This is what has confused me about this whole issue from the start. I don’t understand what benefit RP/Casual players like myself gain/lose in either scenario. I DO understand what other players lose/gain in each scenario though - and it doesn’t make me feel good when they lose the ability to switch when they would have more fun doing so.
1 Like
True, but this isn’t the place for that. In those debates, it comes down to facts. We don’t know the whole picture at this time, and we certainly don’t have all the facts.
It’s better to understand why people have their point of view instead of think of them less for holding as such. We can find middle ground (hopefully) and find reasonable compromises.
1 Like
I disagree.
There is absolutely a “right” direction the game should go. If casual players are to the south and hardcore min/maxer’s are to the north, east and west should be the only reasonable options. Unfortunately Blizzard has been taking the southern route a lot lately by ruining systems from a hardcore players point of view.
The entire game has changed in recent years and has gone from letting us play the game at our own pace to introducing time-gates and other mechanics to slow the hardcore players down.
Taking the game too far in either direction is unhealthy, but Blizzard doesn’t seem to care.
You are right we don’t have the facts. I can only rely on previous alpha/beta feedback and response. Based on those past events full of facts, blizzard will botch this entire fiasco and nonetheless profit from the audience they currently cater to (casuals who don’t care about the integrity or flaws of systems that permeate throughout the entirety of the game/new expansion).
Total Hippo after reading OP.
I’ve been advocating for keeping covenants a hard choice. It should be hard to choose and it should be impactful. It should change how you play.
But then there’s the min-maxers. Hell, I’m playing resto druid so I can pug, hard to get groups on the warlock in comparison. I’m not sure I’d call it “min-maxing” but it’s not my first choice.
I like the idea of “non-combat benefits” being the key, so “cutting edgers” can swap about at the cost of these. But it has to be pretty deep to affect gameplay.
We know you get torghast keys from your covenant. Maybe they don’t send them to oath breakers? Or only send them to exalted characters, and leaving sets you to “unfriendly”. Additional resources (especially legendary resources) could also be an incentive. Legendary patterns for exalted characters, for example.
Just an idea. The choice should be hard and walking away from that choice should also be hard. It should be painful. If it can’t affect combat, it has to affect other things. Like flying, maybe oath breakers can’t fly. Or they are FFA PvP at all times?
Ideas?
That’s fair. I’d just like to point out that once we get to East vs West, then we’ll be debating going back towards North vs. South again. We can repeat that process until we find our center. We’re sort of at the earlier stages of that balancing act.
2 Likes
You have a choice in a covenant right now, do you not?
And you feel forced, that’s what you’re asking for a change…right?
How is what i’m saying different?
???
lolwut
Still ignored the actual argument to some how impose a belief that everyone who doesn’t play at the 1% is “blind.”
Do you think because I don’t do mythic raiding or +20 keys l can choose whatever talents I want and be viable? Because…that’s not how WoW’s balance works. LOL
And advocating for more of that through covenant talents is the issue i’m trying to get at, but you don’t seem to understand that…
Why am I a troll? Because I disagree with you?
LOL
Always happens whenever I win an argument. They choose not to replying to my actual concerns and instead call me a troll. OKAY DUDE.
“You only suppose they would balance them less if they make them swapable?”
No…clearly they would have to balance each and every build and talent even more. Making this game more homogenized. That’s the issue…
But I don’t think critical thinking is your strong suit and clearly this is all going well over your head at this point.
God forbid I make you try and understand my view point. Seems my critical thinking is just too hard for you to understand.
“People” didn’t make multiple characters.
Top 1% raiders did.
Did you make multiple characters? If that’s how you choose to play the game, then good for you!
You seem to only look at this from one form of player perspective. And not the entirety of the game. You don’t understand the implications these changes would have. This is why blizzard shouldn’t be listening to the community on how to develop video games in outrage culture.
Legendaries aren’t comparable though. LOL
BUT GO AWF.
It isn’t obvious though…
You guys are making assumptions based on what?
Are you and your guild racing for world first? Why do you need 4 characters? Because one might give you a marginal increase in one fight opposed to another? Does that NOT have to do with a balancing issue that i’m advocating for?
WHY do you feel you need 4 characters? Because Limit is going to do that? Limit is payed to play and be competitive. That is not the same as playing a video game for fun. What they do should NOT be what everyone does.
If only Blizzard didn’t suck at balancing