I have alts that have never stepped into a raid and are over 385 ilvl. The new raid just came out and they can get really nothing out of the normal raid so will skip right to heroic. Blizzard has this new structure of throwing gear at people to make them happy. When gear is this easy to attain it has no real value and there is no sense of accomplishment or gain
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5 years ago you would have called us the participation generation, we have to been acknowledged and given any chance to join, even if that meant failing, so LFR came out.
But the high level players were upset, things were too easy, so Mythic came out, than M+ and well, nothing since.
Now I would call us the handout generation, we not only have to have a way to participate, we have to get something even if we don’t deserve it because “It is just not fair”.
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Agreed. I say quite often that it’s far too easy for players to out-gear their skill level. As of last night when I got a lucky Titanforge from a got-danged Heroic Dungeon, I now officially out-gear Normal BoD and I haven’t even down the last 2 bosses yet.
It’s insane how we have catch-up mechanics running side by side(and arguably more efficiently) with the content it’s intended to catch you up to.
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I farmed heroic Uldir on my hunter raiding with a guild every week and my Druid never raided and I only played them to do some wq and world bosses. They entered this raid above 5 ilvl difference.
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“Gear isn’t Everything, it’s the Only thing.”
385 is low considering heroic drops 400, m+ 10 400, m+ cache 410 and mythic raid 415. If you said you were 400+ ilvl without stepping foot in m+ or raids that would be broken. While I’m sure with extreme luck and titanforges it might be possible it’s extremely unlikely.
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I’m super casual and don’t raid or do serious pvp and I would LOVE it to have gear go back the way it was previously where you either raided and earned it or farmed it with rep or Conquest/Honor, it was cool to be able to gain amazing pieces of gear and dominate in Wpvp like the way it was in Wrath. Soo much to do soo much fun
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But itemization is kind of right on track.
Let’s assume 425 is the highest.
Casuals tend to hit a wall at 370. After that the loot pinata stops and it’s a grind to try and up your item level 1 point and every few days. At that point you have to start running mythic. You have to start raiding on normal, not LFR.
But isn’t that what raiders want? For people to take the next step and challenge themselves?
This is exactly what happened in my case.
Stop saying people can get to 415 425 off magic freebie boxes. It’s a lie and although a couple people may have done it, it isn’t the norm.
To whine and cry and say it’s not fair they have all this 370 to 390 gear. What you’re really saying is “I want to be super elite and better then other people. And once they have that gear they should not even be allowed to try the content im in”
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I have yet to enter a mythic dungeon, not one piece of gear has come from LFR, only Darkshore, Arathi, and Emmisary questing has been my sources. I have 5 400 ilvl pieces and sit at 385 Ilvl …Its just too easy to keep up
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I find it entertaining. For the longest a segment of the community has shouted out loudly that ilvl does not matter. And that just because a person has a low ilvl, doesn’t mean they are a bad player.
Now we are given an expansion where the value of ilvl has been greatly diminished, yet the people benefiting the most are often struggling with content “below” their ilvl.
We see people thinking that just because they have a 390 ilvl, it means they should qualify to get instantly accepted into +8s or +9s. And then we see the wake up call when it does happen.
Blast from the past that most youngsters probably never heard of. Well done.
IDK, I have avoided M+ because of the whining and complaining of people and the trouble just to find a group casually. for what? a piece of gear that may or may not be an upgrade?
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And thats fine, and I get that.
I am referencing specifically the people who have gotten to 390 ilvl (or something similar) without touching m+. And now want to do m+, but haven’t had any experience. They only want to do ones that drop ilvl upgrades, which throws em to the 8, 9, 10 level.
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Same issue—at 390 from doing almost nothing, there’s little to bring me into Normal raids let alone LFR to learn the basics. Its really far off from just a couple of expansions ago where LFR and Normal were part of normal progression.
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If you look at chasing higher ilevels as the endgame you might feel cheated. Gear is the journey not the destination.
To me it’s less “loot dumpster” and more “no player left behind”. There are still ways for dedicated players to distinguish themselves. It may mean you have to look at achievements or mounts.
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That’s because Blizzard has to cater to all play styles. Not just a handful. Some of those play styles also include people switching mains and such mid-expansion. What happens if one of your tanks or healers has to stop all of a sudden or just wants a break from those roles? Sure you could recruit, but a lot of times, players will step up to the plate and switch characters to fill that roll as well.
And it’s not really running side-to-side. IIRC, from the second tier onward in an expansion, the next raid is iLevel tuned on normal to the previous one’s heroic. Hence why LFR will give the previous raid’s Heroic iLevel. So players can gear up for it that way and then be ready for normal.
It is a 100% false narrative that LFT came out because of the need to cater to people with a lack of skill.
LFR came out because of one raid… Naxxramas. Naxxramas was released in June of 2006 in Patch 1.11. Blizzard made a few mistakes with it, releasing it too close to Burning Crusade’s release and making the quest rewards better than individual pieces of Tier 3-level epics. As a result of that, and the raid being genuinely hard, barely anyone saw the inside of the place let along cleared it. Estimates put it at anywhere between 5-10% of players. Meaning Only about 300,000-600,000 players.
Raids are not cheap to make. Pre-Cata forums, a dev posted that Black Temple cost about $6,500,000 to make and only about 1/3 of players saw that when it was current.
That’s why Blizzard recycled Naxx for Tier 7 raiding in Wrath. So, 30 or so months later, Naxxramas was released again with minor tweaks and it was still new content to almost 100% of players.
LFR came about with one purpose… getting eyeballs into the raids. More eyeballs justifies more money being put into certain content areas.
It was only later that Blizzard adapted LFR to serve as a gear catch-up mechanism.
But LFR always had to be a much lesser difficulty because of the lack of organization, communication, composition, and the ability to control participation.
“Good gear doesn’t make good players. It just hides bad ones more easily.”
Hence why we have things like raider.io. It provides alternative means to measure a player’s ability to complete content.
I also wish GearScore had not been discontinued. Even though Blizzard integrated the concept into the base UI, the addon did much more than simply give a composite score of all the gear. It looked at things like gemming and enchanting, and stat distribution. So it showed the player cared enough to look at resources and find out how to optimize their character.
Exactly. WF/TF exists simply to offer a chance above and beyond simply having your BiS piece to get an upgrade for doing the same content. I found previously that once I had my BiS from certain bosses, I lost interest in fighting them. I sat out sometimes to let others have a crack at getting loot, but most of the time I just sucked it up and did it anyways because there are 9-29 other people who might still need something and it’s selfish of me to say “Well, I have mine so good luck!” and refuse to help.
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Historically, loot was not easy to get in WoW, and good loot was truly rare.
Every expansion has eased this pattern up a bit. That’s part of the appeal of the new content - I can finally get my hands on some of that sweet loot!
We’ve reached a tipping point, though. The jig is up. The loot firehose, combined with scaling, has finally deflated the value of loot too much. It’s a rotten carrot, and now one of the pillars of WoW is crumbling.
Along with terrible community and boring, shallow classes, this game is about to tip over and break.
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I really don’t care about gear but I can understand why some of you may care and be upset.
But what I really, REALLY don’t understand is this notion that you can’t feel any sense of accomplishment through the act of doing the thing you are accomplishing rather than the act of being given something to reward your effort.
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(man you talkin back to me?) SHUT YOUR MOUTH.
Me and co worker back in the day used to sing this song in the kitchen at a chili’s when we worked. Greatest song ever. We’d yell the shut your mouth part just to try and make clear to our managers to well, shut your mouth. Good times.