Totally and completely wrong, Verbal Kint telling a story is not what really happened, it is him tricking the police and the U.S. Customs agent. The titan discs stuff is the very definition textbook case of unreliable narrator, literally 3 layers deep. If they had just been recordings of Khaz’goroth speaking in his own words that would have been unreliable narrator, but it doesn’t even contain that. It has recordings of somebody else saying what they think, and then having another layer of a 3rd person commenting and speculating about what they assume and retcon about the opinions of archaedas making an opinion about khaz’goroth. And then a 4th layer of a naive dark iron dwarf kid with no world experience to validate or verify anything making wild illogical jumps to conclusions that don’t fit. There are whole books on unreliable narrator that you could be reading to see how deep this one goes.
Being mentioned is not “coming to help”. She literally is operational or alive depending on how you view constructs…and yet she never appears. Never shows up. Never communicates via technology from afar. Never sends a servant messenger, nothing. In Dragonflight the very dream itself was being threatened, and she never appeared, ever. We therefore have no evidence that Freya is not a villain at all, we have no evidence that she would help the world soul to be free.
Then explain me how Dagran know so many things? Like he know everything he needs to know not on a logcial sense, but on a scenaristic plot device sense, he know so many things, like he know how to fix water pipes and everything about history, that he should not know, like how does he know that the well of ternity was work of the titans? Thats what i meant when i said its a dev talking and not an actual character.
Nymue? I mean, you knwo she is an envoy of Freya at least? So yeah, i feel like you talk but you dont know all the elements.
And well, for now, no keepers showed up in tww, and Freya not being here in the dream, as i said, she have Nymue on the spot, and the dream is big.
Not Eonar which already was made to be in opposition to Aman’thul
Not really no, nothing was said about working with them, at least as far as i remember.
Pure evil? Pragmatic is what I would call them. More to the point, I doubt we’ll be working with them. I expect a three way war in Last Titan. Xalatath on one side, Odyn and whatever keepers stay loyal to him on another, and us on the third.
I’m on the fence regarding the pantheon’s spirit remnants showing up personally or not.
My prediction for the end of this expansion is that the last raid will be us destroying the prison around the world soul at the center of Azeroth to free her spirit. Then, in Midnight, Xalatath is going to win. Both of these will set up the war in The Last Titan centered around Ulduar.
…lol wut? Why? What would this accomplish?
If abandoning the edicts was enough to get the Keepers to start spilling each other’s blood, they would have started doing that ages ago.
Eh, Yogg Saron merely lit the match — The fire was all Loken.
He couldn’t manipulate his darker & more sinister emotions or even his thoughts as those were well guarded, but the emotion that wasn’t safeguarded was his passion; thus Yogg’Saron amplified such and turned passion to love and love into fanatical obsession which lead to the accidental death of Sif — and the rest is history.
Even Xal’atath commended Loken on his intelligence: “Loken did find work turning her (Helya). But in truth, Odyn’s arrogance takes most of the credit.”
Although I always wondered what Loken’s final words to Odyn were before he & Helya confined him to the Halls of Valor … As a Shadow-Priest, Xal’atath asked the player to ask Odyn if he had considered those words — and if you do, Odyn INSTANTLY slaughters you for asking such a question Sensitive-Egodyn clearly wasn’t happy about it, lol
I think that, we will fight Odyn and kill him, and once he is dead, his death will shot a signal which will draw the titans to our world, this will likely be a plan of Iridikron to draw them to our world so he can (or let us) face them.
Simply because, certain keepers will feel more atracted to defend Azeroth integrity than to let the titans turn her into an Oroder being, that being said, the keepers did spill the blood of each others already : Loken betrayal, Horid and Thorim fightning each others etc…
Helya and Slyvanas both have very sympathetic origin stories. One was wronged because her adoptive father was so obsessed with protecting the Titans’ vision for Azeroth he saw her criticisms as a threat. Slyvanas fought to deefend her homeland, was turned into a tool to help destroy it, and was then manipulated by a cosmic power at her most vulnerable point.
That doesn’t make either of them good people, or justify the terrible things they did after. Slyvanas became a genocidal dictator in service of an eldritch abomination, and Helya spent a millennia gleefully torturing people totally unrelated to Odyn in a horrible nightmare hellworld while also working with that same eldritch abomination.
Having a sympathetic backstory doesn’t mean everything you do afterward is justified. Nearly every single villain in the game has some kind of tragedy in their life but it doesn’t mean the innocents they tortured deserved it and it doesn’t make them good people.
It’s a real surprise that there are people who sympathize with Helya when she’s never done a single decent thing for anyone except maybe tell her Titan zealot of a father to chill a little.
But Legion lore retconned a ton of warcraft og lore…what are you even talking about?
The difference is that it is Odyn who made her have that position and pout her as the goddess of said nightmare realm, he made her into the baddy she is now.
I think its because Helya really did nothing wrong other than as you said “tell her Titan zealot of a father to chill a little.” the punishment of Sylvanas was done by her ennemy while the punishement of Helya was really unjustified, which is why i can see people defending her.
Well, your arguement dont really work since its not a whole sentance here, there is more than just what you quoted from me therefore you are just playing small head here.
Also, you forget a point, Helya being evil is the result of her body and soul being directly twisted by Odyn, so if she is bad its completly on Odyn’s fault.
Also, there is something interesting to do with Helya : She is Hel from the nordic mythos, and in nordic myth Hel have 2 side, one of pure evil and a more good side, which could be used for Helya.
Do you imagine that? The lazy plot device of the split soul they used for Sylvanas, but this time it would make actual sense and referencing the myth she is inspired from?!! Incredible!
I think TLT we’ll see more than just the Keepers split. I think we’ll see the whole Titan Pantheon become split between Aman’thul’s camp of absolute order and maybe Eonar’s camp of more compassionate followers. We’ll most likely be placed on Eonar’s side with Keepers like Freya, Thorim, and Tyr. While Keepers like Odyn, Hodir, and maybe Mimiron will be on Aman’thul’s side.
I think, even if Yogg did influence Loken, its still Loken who did all the things, like the plan to trap Odyn with help of Helya, the plot to change the discs, the plot of making himself prime designate etc…
Loken was also supposed to be a smart guy considering he was Norgannon keeper, so i would imagine he could have imagined something in case he died, since he did exactly that with the signal sent once he died in Hall of Lightning.
Although I always wondered what Loken’s final words to Odyn were before he & Helya confined him to the Halls of Valor … As a Shadow-Priest, Xal’atath asked the player to ask Odyn if he had considered those words — and if you do, Odyn INSTANTLY slaughters you for asking such a question 
Sensitive-Egodyn clearly wasn’t happy about it, lol