Your post contributes absolutely nothing in a sense of story discussion. Don’t pretend like there’s a different culture between the playerbase of the factions, everyone ‘hardcore’ Horde now was Alliance in WoD. Narratively, sure, there does seem to be a greater passion for Horde races by the writers, but player wise? They’re pretty much identical. If Alliance suddenly gained a race with stronger racials, you better believe all those ‘better players’ would zip over to the Blue side.
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OK … I’m sorry, but the Kaldorei have never been shown as weak. They were literally portrayed as being stronger than the entire Horde faction in “A Good War”; and even a skeletal police force of defenders were able to result in a larger death toll on the Horde combatant side (despite being outnumbered 8 to 1). Like, seriously, how much stronger do the NE players want these guys?
They are essentially a militarily stagnant civilization that has not adapted their military tech and tactics for thousands of years. They have done nothing tangible to reinforce their military supremacy on Kalimdor, or keep pace with the Horde/Alliance arms race. Hell, from all indications they are sort of portrayed as being extremely resistant to annoying things like “Time”.
Bluntly, if the NEs were a RTS Civilization Faction one could play … they’d be banned.
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Funny but all their lands are constantly on fire because “HORDE SMASH!”
If they were so powerful as you like to fantasize over WoT wouldn’t have happened.
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Lol you says my comment doesn’t contribute with anything and then you say this nonsense
there does seem to be a greater passion for Horde races by the writers
I didn’t know getting 2 civil wars in a raw and needing the alliance to solve the whole affair was a sign of passion and love, if you want that kind of love then sure take it.
Also yes there is a big difference in mentality, most alliance players wants to be like the emperium of mankind of warhammer and still being more holy than jesus and that combination will never work, also only 5% of the total playerbase are hardcore raiders that doesn’t care about the story, the rest of the playerbase at the very least know the current events by cinematics or mentions from their in-game friends.
Uhh … yeah, no that’s literally how they are portrayed. “A Good War” constantly reinforces how if the Horde didn’t deter the majority of the Kaldorei forces south, they would have had no chance in hell of winning the WoT. The remaining defenders in the NE territories were also stated as being outnumbered 8 to 1 and canonically resulting in a larger death toll on the Horde combatant side. Like … do you understand how ridiculous this is? I never thought it would be easy, but the idea that the NEs are just … immune to annoying things like Tech-Creep is sort of absurd. Resistant? Sure, I can buy that … but seemingly immune?!
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The same can be said of Teldrasil from the Horde’s perspective.
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The difference the Horde decided they wanted to kill everyone and burn everything.
Not the Alliance.
Funny how the fleet showed up and they still lost and the greatest druid in the world was having a tough time against Sylvanas who is pretty much an undead archer.
Sure you may read they are super strong on paper but at the end of the day all their lands are constantly on fire and they need rescuing.
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TBH … I have no clue what is going on with Sylvanas. She’s always been one of the more potent characters on the Horde side (if only because we don’t actually have a lot of magic reps; not even a single Shaman rep these days) … but yeah, her going toe to toe with Malfurion is weird? Like, I suppose I could kind of buy her being able to Banshee-Form out of like vines … but the guy is just acting on a completely different Genre of Fantasy than most characters.
My point still stands.
Welcome to the MMO night elves. A far cry from their RPG incarnation.
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I am just putting it out there maybe the Night Elves are not as strong as you think they are.
The best explanation I have for you is that the Horde was at a severe disadvantage in the terrain. I doubt the NEs would have fared great on an open plain in the barrens due to their super human abilities.
Your point is no more! It has ceased to be! 'E’s expired and gone to meet 'is maker! 'E’s a stiff! Bereft of life, 'e rests in peace! THIS IS AN EX-POINT!
Fixed that for you.
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I mean … that’s certainly possible. The primary advantage the NEs have is their use of friendly terrain (and their amazingly physical and magical prowess) to really brutalize their opponents. Their built for viciously fast hit and run tactics, but they aren’t necessarily built for prolonged sieges. On top of this … they do lose their potency proportional to the condition of terrain around them (hence the burning you keep referring to. The Blight and Fire being utilized by the Horde in current Darkshore is almost a necessity to deny the NEs one of their biggest military assets).
I pictured a Sylvanas v. Malfurion fight as one where Sylvanas brings in blight sprayers as backup to destroy the local wildlife and deprive Malf of power as she battled him. I kinda wish that aspect was played up in their fight.
On a larger scale, I agree that the strength of the night elves’ resistance in the War of Thorns was weird. I expected the night elves to do well on the defense on their ancestral turf, but I expected (and wanted) it to be a guerilla war of hit-and-runs on the Horde army, not a standing army holding them back.
I’d have preferred a situation where the night elves could keep those death ratios, but they’d be due to running away and evading the Horde rather than outslugging them. And I really wanted night elf civilians to simply leave their homes and slip into the woods, either waiting to return after the Horde gave up the search and left, or conducting nighttime sabotage if the army was trying to entrench itself. I think those portrayals would be more thematic of night elves, and not contest the Horde’s superior enemy-crushing ability.
But, despite these ridiculous numbers, the night elves still lost. And the player was treated to a well-written account of the ready-to-surrender civilians getting burned to death, with the only Horde objection being a moment’s hesitation after Sylvanas orders them to burn the tree.
So I think a lot of the objections comes from the fact that, despite being presented as being that strong, it’s shown in the light of inevitable defeat. I (and some others) don’t care about strength if it continually fails to actually accomplish objectives. (And I think that type of raw strength isn’t thematic to night elves, either.)
If I could trade the War of Thorns depiction of night elf defensive strength for a weaker, stealthier approach that saved more nameless NPC civilians that we’d likely never hear from again, I’d do so in a heartbeat.
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Think of it this way if the NEs were as god like as you think they were then when Garrosh invaded Ashenvale it should have been an unmitigated disaster.
He didn’t assault them with every single Horde army he could muster and he didn’t wait for their army to be half a world away.
The NEs are not that powerful mate.
Maybe they got a few strong characters compared to the Horde with some unique abilities but its not like they are Thor dishing out lightning killing thousands with a single strike.
They aren’t gods.
Very well said.
Reminds me of our epic win which was killing a random Val’kyr we never knew about have killed hundreds of since Wolk.
All that hype for nothing.
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Not to make a point about it, but Sylvanas doesn’t have a lot of those prime Val’kyr left … and you absolutely should be making it a point to hunt them. They are her lifelink for staying out of Hell; you want her to suffer … you can either kill her (forcing her to use her remaining ones), or kill them (denying her the ability to use them). Taking out the few remainder of Sylvie’s Nine really should be a priority target for the Alliance in every way.
Either way, get rid of those last three … she’s goin straight back to hell (get ride of 2 of the 3, and she’s effectively mortal again … and you can be sure she’ll stay dead if you kill her).
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I understand we killed a spare out of the 3 she needed for her spare life.
It wasn’t much of a vengeance. Especially how it went down with all hyping they did for the Night Warrior.
I expected Tyrande to walk into this fight like this:
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Yes the objectives were meet and then were undone via the alliance. Don’t know how that’s a stalemate, more of a counter no?
It was smart to lure the army out, normally the attacked loose a lot more bodies when raiding a city. But the alliance did without loosening much. Yes Mek. Is out but he is going to come back bigger and stronger like all Allaince hero’s(minus Varian)
I mean it is a valid point about hallow victory. I would hate to be put though this war that ends with the allaince forgiving and forgetting I don’t disagree with that.
But the horde side is even worse. The player didn’t want to be evil, player wanted to have heroic moments even if they were small. To this day horde hasn’t won anything without super weapon or cheap tactics and to make it worse they only win when they are evil. Which again the player base doesn’t want. When the factions are not at war the horde player follows around allaince heros.
Like man cmon, I get the allaince player complaints but it is very lame horde side as well and has been since MOP
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Meh, Blizz aint about to let her going around one-shotting every Horde rep she sees. But she and Malf got one, go get the others. You really only likely need to get one more to really screw Sylvie out of her last remaining extra life, unless of course Tyrande and Malf would like the pleasure of killing her twice (which … may be tempting fate with someone like Sylvie).
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Fine. I am not saying you are having a grand old time there but I am just trying to clarify the definitions here.
Alliance lost both times and Horde came out on top both times.
HOWEVER.
It doesn’t mean when you did “come out on top” it was an enjoyable experience.
It wasn’t an awesome cinematic like Terror of Darkshore or Pride of Kultiras.
But at the same time neither of these cinematics delivered anywhere close to what they seemed to promise.
The Kultiran Navy was never seen again besides just a few ships in the Battle of Dazaralor and apparently while still nothing but a few handful in the latest cinematic they are now apparently all destroyed in 8.2
And don’t get me started on the travesty that was the Darkshore questline.
Blizzard keeps hyping this comeback, justice, retribution or whatever you want to call it but it never arrives. So obviously we get disappointed and angry.
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I mean the Horde did spend all of their 8.0 Horde Campaign stealing the Scepter of the Tides, only for it to be used once; Stolen; then used against us (forcing us to destroy it). That was … a really weird tangent that led no-where you led us on there Blizz. Also, like Zelling died … so I guess all we really got to show for that entire experience was Stone?
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Sorry, you might’ve missed the part where the Kaldorei were practically wiped off the face of Kalimdor, giving the Horde total uncontested control of the continent, as well as full use of the resource rich lands of Ashenvale. The Forsaken might be making a mess of Darkshore right now, but Ashenvale and it’s nigh limitless hunting, foraging, and logging opportunities don’t seem to be getting the Blight make over.
In contrast the Alliance got… land that no living being can sustain themselves on, and the Eastern Kingdoms is still contested thanks to Quel’Thalas. No convenient, easy to isolate island the Blood Elves are all cramped on at the moment.
In fact, given that the Horde just recruited the Zandalari, it’s quite possible that the Horde has fresh forces to field in the Eastern Kingdoms to continue to contest the Alliance’s push northward; the Forest Trolls. Imagine that. Meanwhile no recently added Allied Race to the Alliance threatens the Horde in the same way, and I honestly can’t see one coming from Kalimdor to do the trick.
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