Undead every Horde race on the battlefield say hello.
I’ll find vendors and quest NPCs. No one who shows up in lore who didn’t survive (or become a zombie, I guess.)
He’s one of the very few, and by a brand new character who isn’t as interesting or as cool.
No, you can’t. I wanted to be certain beyond a doubt if people were lying, and they were. Saurfang specifically says “The Horde doesn’t kill innocents.” and orders you to save them.
Blame Blizzard.
Horde players wanted revenge for the Warchief. How was killing Teldrassil, who wasn’t even INVOLVED in Genn’s attack, revenge for the assassination attempt? How was attacking Darkshore revenge for the assassination attempt? It was barely fighting the Alliance. Only a few weeks after the Teldrassil did you have Night Elves aiding the Alliance’s assaults on Lordaeron.
The Undead of every Horde race did not join the Alliance. My rebuttal to you was the the Undead Night Elves join the Horde and so the Alliance Night Elves are indeed being betrayed by their own.
Which are more important to some players than single NPC that never showed up in the game before this expansion.
Which a youtube video would have done.
Treng can actually be a very useful poster representing Horde players who are looking for the honor aspects of the Horde.
He also gets tunnel vision and will argue for the sake of arguing instead of actually making good points, but no one’s perfect.
Point taken. Blizzard refuses to admit that Sylvanas creates slaves. But she created slaves, who are not Horde from the Horde, who do nothing but defend Lordaeron from both factions for her.
The players who care more about nameless NPCs are far and wide less prevalent than players who care about characters from books, cinematics, and faces of factions.
There were none up at the time. Nevermind the fact that doing the quests doesn’t make me ‘worthy of punishment.’ That argument is insane.
Night Elves who burned got a collector’s edition book depicting their deaths. Rastakhan has never shown up in any books, has he?
That’s not the argument I made. Tarrok said they would not like to do an atonement quest line, and I pointed out that they did the War of the Thorns questline despite a that they didn’t want to be playing the role of the bad guy either, so I find it just as likely that most Horde fans would play through an atonement questline if that was what was give even if they didn’t like it.
No but humans are a big issue. Blizzard has never really moved on from this idea that Alliance = Humans, thus races under the banner are shafted anytime Faction representation becomes a thing (despite a bunch of human buildings even in wc3 being high elf and dwarven…) The Jaina point doesn’t prove anything, because Jaina is still being shoved down our throat either way than letting Tyrande fight in Nazjatar, or focus on the war in Kalimdor. All this patch, with the former capital of the Kaldorei empire, has going for it outside of Humans, is a gnome island.
You want to destroy an orc capitol and the surrounding ecosystem? What did the lizards ever do to you?
But seriously…
Not really. If Stormwind was wiped out? Then it would be.
Honestly, if I had to say give up one city? The strike I’d make would be Thunder Bluff. Tauren were involved in the attacks too and it would be a more severe blow to the Horde… Assuming the Warfront for Silvermoon is coming. – However, what you got was the Undercity being rendered completely useless.
Sure, Sylvanas meant for it to be a trap or some stupid thing like that, but what really ended up happening? She threw away one of her biggest research centers, the place she developed the most Blight, a HEAVILY fortified city with an easily defensible lower half… All for a plan that didn’t work, then she laughed about it all the way to Orgrimmar while patting herself on the back.
Kinda really wish the Alliance just took the Undercity back.
At this point … I’m just hoping that if the Horde is meant to get broken down to its WC3 Foundation; that a stronger foundation (one that is more inclusive to the non WC3 races … rather than what it is right now (essentially the WC3 legacy races with the others stapled on) be built. I also have hopes for the future of Horde leadership … and for certain “Neutral” Horde characters to fully invest in the faction and its future (among them, Voss; Rexxar; and Gazlowe).
Essentially, Blizz set up a foundation for a new Horde story … one that is more representative of those VERY diverse peoples that comprise it now; rather than trying to desperately maintain what it ceased to be long ago (no matter how much some people may wish otherwise). The Horde is a young faction … its lore is not as rich as the Alliance’s; which means its past is not nearly as important as its future (this applies to its people just as much as the whole).
Night Elves get more representation than any other race other than humans(followed by Draenei), yet they are the Loudest complainers push all the blame on Humans overall.
Yes Tyrande not showing up in nazjartar was a massive misstep by Blizzard however I still feel that Jaina should have been there as well to assist. Genn was probably the one who was most out of place.
Problem is blizzard probably didn’t want to pay whatT yrande’s Voice actor was asking for her to voice a handful of lines where they have Voice actors for Jaina/Genn coming in every weekend.
Jaina seems to be everywhere though.
Rescuing Baine, Pursuing the remaining fleet AND defeating Azshara.
Enough already let some other characters do some work.
It doesn’t help either she is constantly going from one extreme to the other to suit the narrative.
I feel for this to Happen though they need something to drive them to rejoin the Horde and not stay neutral. Something like the Alliance Alliance attacking the Horde Unprovoked and doing some serious damage.
As a strange tangent … Azshara survived this little bout of 8.2 … which honestly renders Tyrande’s absence with a lot less impact (the villain that the NEs should MOST be active against is still at large). At the very least, at least the NEs still do have that opportunity to take relevance from THE antagonist of their story (that’s a far cry from the MU Orcs being allowed a chance at vengeance against the Legion; or the Forsaken being anything more than a footnote against Arthas).
I will stand by my point. The NEs have gotten a MASSIVE amount of content devoted to them (most notably in Legion); and “Human Potential” is a meme. However, BfA was NOT the time to dial back that relevance in any way…
I feel people were closer to the real problem back when complaining about burning Night Elves equating to Saurfang story about being sad. And it isn’t even really Humans in general. It’s just Jaina. I did not want to go to Kul’Tiras after the War of the Thorns. I did not want to spend my time solving Kul’Tiras and Jaina’s internal issues when logically my characters would have all stayed behind on Kalimdor. I’m not leveling any of my alts through it (doesn’t help that Kul’Tiras content was not particularly meaningful regardless). But when the story’s not been off looking for Saurfang, it’s been focusing on Jaina. Jaina and Derek. Jaina and Thrall. I had enough of Jaina back in Icecrown, and was tired of her even before that from Warcraft III. And even that was light in comparison to the whiplash that was Jaina in Mists of Pandaria, that Alliance questing in BfA was all about spotlighting making up for that and making Jaina stable again. But really, story really needs to move on from Jaina.
Teldrassil has been nothing outside of darkshore besides a vague reference.
Blizzard isn’t even milking what happened.
For all intents and purposes it may as have not happened as far as every other character is concerned now.
Which is extremely odd.
Why go through all that and just ignore it?
The latest cinematic was a testament to it, I almost missed thrall mentioning it but Jaina was pretty quick to minimize it to just a “we all have blood on our hands.”
I agree. I think there’s been… 2 cinematics this expac with no Jaina? Not to mention that for some reason, whenever Jaina is around it’s all about how Jaina feels, forget anyone else who’s involved they don’t matter.
Though I will always treasure the absurdity of Baine being all “I can excuse genocide but I draw the line at sleeper agents!” This is supposed to be my hero?
At the same time though … the point of WoT was to break any infrustructure that the Alliance could easily rely on to take back those territories. NEs are the exception, not the rule, when it comes to the general requirements for War (and if one thing has remained consistent in this Faction Conflict; its that the Alliance of EK has always found particular difficulty reinforcing the Kaldorei territories (and that was before the loss of Theramore … which further crippled that ability).
There is a part of me that likes the idea that the Alliance Power Fantasy isn’t SO extreme that they can just walts to the other side of the world and take back that territory instantly; but … who am I kidding? The Horde isn’t even operating in the same genre of fantasy as the Alliance in many cases … Its like we’re not even from the same World of Warcraft at times. The ONLY reason they haven’t been allowed to is Blizz handicapping them to let the story unfold the way they want it to.
![:frowning:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/frowning.png?v=6" ":frowning:")