I dont believe he was meaning to. LOL He was saying disc has the tools but has to sacrifice for it and the only person lolling at anyone is you. Shame your mind isnt open
you are the same as those people whose perception you are wanting to change. Its like nup if its not this black square then you get “lolled” at,
and because my point also covers
You are. You are inaccurate and leave out the full view.
Let me help you " they will tell you that disc is real bad but the problem with using this site for this purpose is that any time there is multiple diffferent specs of the same class the statistics will always make the worst class or specs look worse then they actually are"
What political party are you in and so we can not vote for you
Didn’t say it would? I don’t know why you linked a video from Dratnos either - did I not say earlier in this thread I’d welcome buffs? Who are you even arguing with?
Disc is an OK spec right now. It’s capable of climbing, community perception or not. This season doesn’t really require much damage, and that’s probably the second biggest problem Disc has outside mana management. So the spec is certainly OK. Will it be top meta? no. But it’s not weak at all.
People get caught up in the framing. I think when people say a spec is “ok” others sometimes take that as “no changes needed” and dismissive of any spec concerns. That’s why you see people exasperated when they point out issues and then people respond with “the spec is ok.”
On the other hand, when people say the spec has issues, people who say the spec is “ok” sometimes assume they mean the spec is “unplayable,” or “incapable” of doing dungeons.
It’s entirely possible for a spec to underperform and to need buffs, and yet not be terrible, unplayable, or incapable. That’s where disc is right now. As for myself, I wouldn’t characterize that as “ok.” But I wouldn’t characterize it as incapable or unplayable, either.
Why attach utility to a filler instead of a bankable cooldown, though?
Isn’t usually the point of utility its agency? Why specifically reduce that agency, or put it so in conflict with one of the few things offering rotational complexity, by moving the utility away from more controllable timing and greater burst potential?
Nope. The raw damage Ashen Hollow did was a case in point. It made virtually all other healers non-choices–except for maybe r shammy–but which also pumped high damage.
And yet in every key I have done recently it has been mostly locks, rogues, and hunters. There have been a few other classes that have risen to the top, but this is always how it is. It’s meta or nothing to a lot of keyholders.
I switched out to holy in Season 3 and suddenly the invites came fast and easy. That is still the case. People in this forum have contended that they have been removed from groups because of playing disc, not holy. Very very sad.
M+ will never be balanced because the group size is 5 - that’s mostly it.
There’s only one healer/tank, so there’s no picking really based on what compliments well - so long as most damage is avoidable, the best healer will always be whatever provides the most damage whilst still providing enough healing. The best tank will be the tank that does the most damage whilst also being able to stay alive.
Then DPS you need lust, you need bres (preferrably lock because gates/healthstones/summons - but if their damage is TRULY trash they could get kicked out), and the third slot is either rogue if skips are important or whatever spec has a damage profile that can do good AoE damage without sacrificing a ton of single target.
It isn’t raid where you need 1 of every buff required. You can’t compliment a throughput healer with a DPS/utility healer, etc.
So long as player opinion matches whatever is going in the +30 keys that season, it will never be balanced, and hoping for strong balancing is just not gonna pan out for you.
Im finding all this talk about priests specs very selfish. I want to discuss the real travesty of the past week. The auction house. The bugs and mucking around have cost me millions in gold. I want, ney demand aneurysm create a new talent tree for the auction house. Make me more gold.
A little tired tongue in cheek humor. Finished 8 days of moving house and sitting down with a bourbon. I salute you all
As the “do damage while healing” spec. You’re ruinin my immersion dude. Every healer has to stop dps sometimes and just focus on healing, sure. But when Disc has to do it, it kinda feels like the devs have failed to embrace the concept. and considering WHEN the Legion revamp to the spec happened, every honest person knew this new “spread atonement” style of gameplay, was not about embracing the concept. It was about handcuffing the spec so Certain People would stop complaining about Disc. It was about nerfing the spec while doing their best to appear as though they weren’t nerfing the spec.
as revealed by this comment:
The translated message here, from the devs to the players, is “you can heal better…if you give up on the core concept of what Disc is. Just Like We Did.”
furthermore:
You may have noticed dragonflight is going back to older style talent trees. We might wonder why this is, though personally i think it is due to the success of the WoW classic series. Newer devs are rediscovering the “talents” (pun time) of the original crew. And drawing inspiration from that.
There are lessons that can be learned about it. Such as, maybe disc used to be the easier spec. Maybe its not always possible to improve on an older idea, if it was a really good one. The devs were the ones who didn’t like Divine Aegis. Players of Disc (at least me, personally) at the time loved it. We loved the graphic. Then they nerfed that. Then they changed the mastery entirely because it was “too random” which basically just meant it wasn’t good enough at the start of an expansion, and it was too good by the end of it.
But the fact they changed it says something. They didn’t care about the fun of it. That didn’t matter. What mattered was they didn’t want to make it balanced, maybe they didn’t even know how to, and they didn’t want to admit that they couldn’t figure it out. So they just deleted it from existence.
All the people here saying that people should continue playing disc “for the challenge” as if The Satisfaction of Being Very Good At The Game is the thing that matters, should keep this in mind. The devs absolutely don’t care about your satisfaction.
If we’re talking about “easy specs vs hard ones” the devs opted for easy mode a long, long time ago. However difficult Disc may appear to be to play, the fact is, for them, its incredibly easy to balance now, i.e. its a virtually irrelevant spec in almost any content that isn’t top end raiding, and ok maybe they can spare one intern to keep an eye on the numbers during World First race, but otherwise the signals we’re getting is that they don’t want to think about the spec, and any time they are forced to, the result is that another absorb is deleted from the game.
And if that’s the case, if they are just going to make it heal like every other healer, if they are going to abandon the core concept of the spec, what is the point? Just what are they doing really? Why does none of the devs seem to realize, they just hate the spec and are causing players to abandon it? As the japanese would say, your feelings are reaching us. Yes they are.
But thanks for your posts everyone. As always, I can see people continue to have very strong views about basically everything. And as usual, I disagree with most of it. No I don’t think I’m better than you (whoever you may be). I’m just realizing, I probably won’t ever see the world I thought was coming, even though a few people at times in the past gave me a glimpse of what I thought was the future, it was just a flicker of brilliance and then it went out.
Well two things here. 1. Blizz sold the spec as half-healer half-dps. They still expected you to be casting healing spells. But 2. Disc absolutely has had times through the years where atonement makes up the vast majority of your healing even in small group content and your Shadowmend casts are taken down quite a bit. Last season and this season are two cases of that.
Also it was straight up meta through most of three expansions in raid content after the supposed “intentional nerf.” So that narrative doesn’t hold up.
That’s not what you should pull from it at all. The devs clearly wanted there to be a choice more especially with penance and that’s been a consistent thing since the start of legion. Clarity of Will used to be in the talent tree, remember. Shadow Covenant was a spammable AoE, etc.
The easier spec vs the easiest healing spec in the game currently is not really an identity.
I could care less if Divine Aegis came back. It’s probably an overpowered talent to just give random shields on all your atonement crits - and it becomes mandatory for every build - but it doesn’t really bother me. What I don’t think should come back, perseonally, and won’t happen unless Blizz completely loses their minds is the playstyle from WoD. People asking for a return to that era for Disc priest are just asking for a spec that could not be balanced and took little to no effort to play at an effective level.
Personally, regardless of what healer I decide to main come dragonflight - even if it’s not Discipline - I’d rather not see Discipline covering every raid mechanic with 3 buttons and otherwise using the rest of their kit as it comes off CD. It’s not fun to watch, it’s absolutely not fun to co-heal with, and it was never a ton of fun to play for me. It’s all the problems that Castle Nathria disc had, but also a toddler can play it. That sounds so greaaat.
You finally came out and said it. How do you feel. I mean you have hedged around it nicely but i dont think its been as complete as that before.
Tbh i had a lot of fun healing in cata. I enjoyed the archangel style of play. I enjoyed smite healing. But the world has moved on. That style has no place really in the modern game play. Smite healing as it was would not be enough to affect mythic plus, pws at a high level as it was would be ineffective in high keys nor would DA. Those people wanting these changes arent considering higher key game play and its affects.
I believe DF is on a right track of empowering our penance and with contrition, making it something we are less penalised when using defenively and i llike the chunky absorb on mind blast.
Im not against maybe some synergy with shadowmend, something akin to after a shadowmend your next def penance is boosted by X for example, for stronger ST heals.
It would be nice if the idea of talent trees actually meant people could set up their priest to play the way they prefer. Then maybe we don’t have to argue about what disc should be. It could be what works best for you, and what you enjoy.
I’d rather the trees allows for more flexibility to play different contents. Disc has been needing something to work better in m+ vs raid for a while. If we re-add old style disc in the tree, it’s just going to remove the flexibility that is needed to allow for 2 playstyles instead of giving 1 playstyle the flexibility that it needs all by itself.
This pretty much. We have been pigeonholed into raid because to make us good in keys makes us better in raids. With the talent tree, they have a chance if done right to make one side more key focused and one side more raid, and yes trying to add absorb style back creates issues and i really think would only help lower level stuff.
I fail to see and those people wanting it have not explained yet how their style will work in a BALANCED way in a +20 and up key
Currently the only drawback with 20+keys i have as disc is mana problems.
Other than that i dont have any issues keeping people up in 20+ keys. They just need to add m+ modifiers imo.
"Atonement healing is increased by 20%, but you can only have it on a max of 5 targets. When atonememt falls off the target youre refunded 0.5% mana. "
This one change would address all m+ issies without making them overpowered in raids.
I’d prefer if they bridged the divide with holy and let disc choose between more reactive healer talents and more shielding/atonement oriented skills.
It’d be nice to have 1 priest class again instead of holy and disc on totally opposite worlds that have less in common than hpriest does with rshaman or druids.
I mean you have hedged around it nicely but i dont think its been as complete as that before.