The Ballad of Roachman (A dire PSA for Trade Chat sellers)

I’d like to share a cautionary tale for anyone that sells goods and services in Trade Chat regularly. The report system abuse has gotten out of control. This will be the full story, but I will have a tl;dr at the end.

About a month ago, early into Season of Discovery, I set out on a business venture. I’ve never been good at making gold, but I decided that selling cross-faction items could be something for me. I was willing to put in the time and the travel to make it work, and I had a friend to help me courier them. I decided that the Neutral Auction House just didn’t enough traffic, especially in this phase at level 25. Not many people travel to Booty Bay on the Wild Growth server yet. So, I had the idea that if I could cart these items to Stormwind myself, I would have a much easier time selling them. Even at a small markup, it would be worth it for someone to buy these items rather than trek all the way to Booty Bay for them.

And what was my cross-faction item of choice? Cockroaches of course! I saw an opportunity. Cockroaches are probably not most people’s pet of choice; they’re kind of yucky and creepy, but I knew I could use this to my advantage. I embraced an alter-ego, Roachman. Roachman’s sole purpose would be to live in Stormwind and sell his Cockroaches. Because roaches are so odd and unsettling, I was able to use some very quirky pitches to grab people’s attention.

Before long, I had amassed a cult following. I would get whispers from people that enjoyed my creative sales pitches. Things like “I don’t want a roach but I love your pitches” or “LOL”. These messages warmed my heart. And yes, there were some detractors. Many felt that my prices were too high at 5g. When you consider that these pets were selling for 3-6 gold on the neutral AH, and I was saving you a trip to Booty Bay, I felt my prices were fair. And believe it or not, yes, I sold many. I’ve had people that bought multiples! I’ve even had several people pay me MORE than the asking price, because they enjoy my act. And before long, my freind had joined me in the RP, as my son, Roachboy. But just when things were starting to really kick off, we were hit with our first hiccup.

Now, our sales pitches vary from silly, to creepy, to downright bizarre, but never have they ever been vulgar, obscene, or even offensive to anyone but someone with a phobia of bugs. Yet, I had received multiple in-game warnings telling me that this was “not how World of Warcraft players typically communicate”. Despite this, I pressed on, confident that I was not breaking any rules. But about 1 day later I receive my first 7 day silence on my account. This means I cannot talk or invite anyone to groups in game. I can use party chat if someone else invites me, or in guild chat only.

The reasoning for this Silence? Abusive Chat. Again, I’ve said some odd things, gross things, creepy things (I am selling roaches here!), but I have NEVER said anything that I would consider “Abusive”. When I pressed Blizzard on this, I was given two offending chats. The first, a creepy pitch about a roach crawling in someone’s mouth (okay, a bit too invasive and nasty perhaps) and the second, one that I do take responsibility for. I was sent a whisper by someone saying that they were going to touch my ****. I sell Cockroaches, you can guess what they said… I responded with “Don’t touch my ****, roach!” To me, a joke, but inappropriate language nonetheless. I find it hard to believe that this person, who was also clearly joking around, reported me themself. Personally, I believe that I was reported by many people in Trade Chat, probably people that don’t like my humor, my prices, or don’t like ANYONE that posts regularly in Trade. I think that Blizzard went through chats after the fact (even private DMs) and picked the worst offenders. And fair enough, I was willing to accept that I messed up and crossed the line.

Roachboy carried the torch while I was silenced. I stood around for moral support, and business continued. When I was finally able to help out, business was booming! Everybody loves their roaches. And if you’re wondering, a Cockroach is genuinely a very cool companion pet. They fly behind you, and the animation while RP walking is particularly cool. They are the only invertebrate pet and they’re very realistic. Roaches have 3 phases of locomotion and the Cockroach pet exhibits one of these phases in their idle animation, where they are only moving their antennae. I feel that for half the price of some Spider Silk Slippers, it’s a really cool pet to show off to your friends. ANYWAYS:

Disaster struck soon after… I was now hit with a 7 day suspension. This time I wasn’t even able to log into the game. I was crushed. After the silence I had been extremely careful. I no longer made jokes about roaches in mouths, and even took out some of my more edgy material. Again, I pled to Blizzard and I was eagerly awaiting their response this time. I was dying to know what they were going to charge me on this time. Where was the smoking gun! But alas… they gave me no specifics this time. Genuinely, the actual GMs that responded to me were very informative and helpful, it’s just a shame that they couldn’t give me more info. I was told " The problem with humour is that for some it can encourage sales, for others it can cause offence, this is a tricky line to follow." And I understand that. My issue is that the line needs to be clear. I don’t feel it’s appropriate to be penalized unless something I’ve said has actually violated TOS. If something that I said could be clearly depicted as prejudiced or vulgar, I would wholeheartedly support their decision. But I don’t believe that’s the case. Still, I get it. If I’m going to be telling “creepy crawly” jokes about Cockroaches, I’m going to be toeing the line. I told myself that from here on out it would have to be unimpeachable. G rated jokes only and nothing about orifices or roaches clipping your toenails for you (I’m sorry!). I’d like to point out that aside from that one DM, I’ve avoided the OBVIOUS joke one could make when selling these pets… But then disaster struck AGAIN!

This time, Roachboy was hit with a silence. Now, my son… and IRL friend, Roachboy, is Mr. Goody Two-Shoes, at least in my eyes. While I might be more edgy and disturbing with some of my creepy Cockroach sales pitches, Roachboy has always been very silly and lighthearted. At worst, his messages are off-topic or pointless (like random animal facts). I was floored. At this point there is a clear pattern going on. Let’s go back to the “detractors”. I accept that I am not everyone’s cup of tea. My sales pitches can get repetitive, and a lot of people seem to get genuinely angry that my Cockroaches are overpriced in their eyes. I will see messages saying that people put me on ignore, or I will get mean whispers. I’ve even had people invite me to groups to try and scam me or to bully me. I would say that this is NOT the majority. I see FAR more messages of support or people that enjoy what me and Roachboy do. I see the same spam in Trade Chat that you all do, and most of it is boring and uncreative. I try to not be spammy and to not post too often, to avoid bothering people.

I can see that I’ve put a smile on a lot of people’s faces with my creepy crawly companions and my humble Roach Family. But I’m very concerned about the future of what I do and for others that hock their goods in Trade Chat. It seems clear to me that there is an automated process by which players are getting in-game warnings, then a silence, then a suspension. I fear that my next hiccup will result in a month or longer ban. At this point, I am afraid to say anything in Trade Chat at all. There doesn’t seem to be a clear reasoning from Blizzard as to what it takes to get a ban. I believe that with enough reports from grumpy people, abusing the system, Blizzard will use any justification necessary to uphold the decision. I believe that the low level GMs have a “no overturn” policy on the automated system. I would understand these account actions if they were for “spam”, but “abusive chat”? I just can’t accept that. Weird? Disturbing? Gross even? Sure! But abusive just doesn’t sit right with me. And especially not for Roachboy. My boy is innocent!

If you’ve made it this far, thank you for taking some time to hear my story. I would be tempted to give up the Roach Business for good after what’s happened so far, and Roachboy may not have the will to make it either. But I recently watched the Wonka movie, and it has inspired me to press on in the face of opposition. I feel that the haters who abuse the report system are like Slughorn, Prodnose, and Fickelgruber, who conspire against us. And, frankly, Blizzard are acting as the corrupt Keegan Michael Key (lmao). I genuinely hope this doesn’t come across as a “I got banned for nooooo reason you guys!” kind of post. I understand the reasoning… mostly. I just worry about the implications of what’s going on for anyone that sells things in Trade.

TL;DR: I believe that people who sell often in Trade Chat rack up reports from random haters until they get an automated ban from Blizzard, and they don’t seem to be doing anything about it.

  • Roachman
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Uh that person would literally be reporting themselves for harassment/abuse as well if they reported you after sending that. If they didnt also get a ban for that, insane.

Yeah idk I would have guessed it was mainly just spam reports from trade, but someone saying that should not be able to report anyone who says the literal same thing back. Thats some pretty janky moderation.

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People were asking where you were. Assuming this is the roach seller from wild growth server. That’s pretty messed up man. These automated bans are out of control. Guilty until proven innocent.

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Yes, Roachman is level 1 so I can’t use him as my forum character lol

When I was leveling this hunter it was back during the epidemic of chinese hunter bots, and people would walk up to me and stare at me for a bit and some would even whisper me and ask me random stuff. I guess trying to figure out if I was a bot too? I seriously thought I was going to be hit with an automated ban back then.

I’ve noticed they will invite you randomly. I think they do it hoping you’ll accidentally kill stuff for them lol.

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Sad you got this kind of treatment, too many ppl today born without a sense of humor. But I did enjoy reading your story. Nice change from all the crying and screaming in here.
Roach on, Roachman.

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Welcome to WoW post 2016. This has been an issue since Blizzard made reporting a simple right click back in WoD. Before that if someone wanted to report a player they basically had to fill out a form, so most didn’t bother unless the person they were reporting was actually truly worth the effort. Now its just 2 or 3 clicks of the mouse, and even better still your punishment is automated as well (even if people deny this with nonsense about squelching vs a silence).

At the start of Dragonflight I was selling Blacksmithing services in trade chat, telling people to send me work orders for belts and wrists. I wasn’t even giving some elaborate sales pitch, just a simple “Send me a work order for x item and commission me y amount of gold”. After a few days I received my first behavior warning (for language). I thought this was odd as the only people I’d really type any swear words around were guild members who I know wouldn’t report me because they all do it as well (not to mention whats the point of a language filter in this game if its reportable anyway). But I was making over 1M gold a month, so I didn’t really care. After about 7 warnings I decided to go to the CS forums (a mistake) and see if I could find anything there about if I’d get punished because either people in trade couldn’t stand that the chat was being used for something other than politics or sexual preference (I play on a server known for being very lgbtq friendly on retail) and would report me because I was actually using trade chat for a trading service. I was told that as long as I’m not swearing (never was) that I’d be fine. After a few months I stopped really playing retail, but I have no real doubt I’d have been silenced/suspended if I had continued to play, all because of salty players who either didn’t like me selling in trade, or just other crafters angry that I charged less than them.

Fast forward to SoD and I decide to sell the Echeyakee pet tame on Wild Growth (I’ve seen OPs sales pitch and am not surprised in the slightest that they got reported even though nothing I ever saw them type was against ToS or the social contract in any way) and after about 2 days I receive my first behavior warning for, you guessed it, language. I just roll my eyes and continue to post. I’ve made about 250g in around 5 days or so, I’m not going to stop using trade chat to sell something even if it means I upset people that just want to argue about Joe Biden/Trump, VC/DM, or spam Thunderfury/Murloc all day. I’m also at this point currently awaiting my eventual suspension for doing nothing wrong or against ToS, because this is just what its like to try and sell something in WoW these days.

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On a side note I believe the reason you get warnings for language to be one of two things. Either people are too lazy to move their mouse a few pixels lower when reporting to choose “spam” instead of “text-speech”, or more likely they believe a language report results in getting squelched faster than a spam report does.

I believe language is the preferred choice when trying to get an EFC dc/d in WSG so I’m going to bet its the ladder (I’m not condoning this by the way if it wasn’t obvious).

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Yep, and you shouldn’t have to tip toe around either. Selling a unique service like a horde specific pet tame with summon included for 5g is not something that should be bannable.

People are salty that you aren’t just doing everything for free (nobody in their right mind would set all that up for free) and just click report. I imagine all the people who sell summon services get warnings/temp bans all day long too.

The reality is, the only way you’re going to make a lot of gold quick is to offer a unique thing (like selling roaches on a roachboy, or selling a unique tame service).

Anybody can fly to menethil and mindlessly kill murlocs for pearls.

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The argument I got into with people on CS forums was mostly about spam vs language. They all agreed that my post didn’t have anything wrong with it, but most of them were obviously suspicious of any behavior I may have exhibited outside of my service and that could be the reason for my reports (its the internet and most people lie so I don’t blame their skepticism). My real problem is trying to figure out what would be considered spam. In classic I believe trade chat is 100% unrestricted with how often you can post unlike retail with its 2 posts per minute limit, but even still I only post about once every 2 minutes or so, usually alternating between Echeyakee and Raluk tames. But in a game where you can freely post as many messages as you like in a channel what is considered spam? Is it once every 10 seconds? Once a minute? Five minutes? With no rules in place “spam” is whatever the individual defines it as. I personally could consider “spam” to seeing the same service posted more than once an hour (an obvious exaggeration but my point stands), while someone else may consider something to be spam if its more than once a minute. The best answer I’ve gotten to this question is that spam is whatever the community decides it is (which is just a non answer). Unfortunately Everyone is different on what they consider to be spam, so as long as Blizzards stance on this remains “whatever the community decides” then theres never going to be an actual answer and things like this will probably just continue to happen unless Blizzard reverts reporting to how it used to be. Personally I think you should have to fill out a form to report someone. If they’re not doing something that bothers you enough for you to spend a few minutes of your time reporting them to Blizzard, then it seems to me they aren’t doing anything that bad in the first place and your simply using the report feature to troll, be vindictive, or as an alternate ignore list.

I just wish there was more protection from Blizzard against the more frivolous reports and frankly I wish there were repercussions for the players abusing the system

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Things were so soooo much better with live GMs.

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The reports should eventually stack up enough to trigger a manual review imo. And it wouldn’t take somebody more than a couple minutes to see that no rules were broken and clear the reports. I don’t know why there isn’t a GM position anymore that handles stuff like this.

Imagine if blizz hired GM’s. 4 straight years of mass report abuse. They’ll never fix it tell they start getting shamed on X I guess.

At this point I think most companies are relying on AI to become advanced enough to replace basic work like reviewing reports, taking orders at fast food restaurants etc.

Well they shouldn’t spam so much, just sell on the AH or advertise in general chat or something where I don’t need social interactions.

Social interactions in an MMO? gasp

Maybe try turning chat off, or just don’t play an mmo if you don’t want social interactions. Assuming of course this isn’t a troll post.

I do like using ‘Immersive’