Ultimately this is all that matters, and that the narrative presents the Alliance as winning regardless of everything you pointed out and no where in the narrative does anyone consider anything thrown away or wasted, so this does not divide the Alliance. Unfortunately Blizzard has no actual sense of writing military narratives.
Which she is still wrong about, because each nation doesn’t act in their own interests to protect their own lands, as the Night Elves still participate in attacking Zuldazar and the Gilneans help in both Zandalar and Kalimdor.
Yes it does. Breaking hope was supposed to make them despair so much that all of the Night Elves wouldn’t fight back any more. And this is the opposite of that.
She literally takes back her bow and mount. Asides from the tome that describes the ritual, that’s all she discarded, and she took them back.
And she doesn’t really do anything substantial.
Saurfang didn’t see it that way:
- Nathanos finally spoke up. “And it will give you a chance to hunt Malfurion alone, Warchief.”
The look in Sylvanas’s eyes gave Saurfang pause. She was more annoyed than he would have expected. If the Horde managed to kill both Tyrande and Malfurion, yes, it would be a great victory that would weaken the Alliance, but the objective was supposed to be conquering the World Tree. That wedge would split the Alliance no matter who ruled the night elves.
“Festering wound” was the emotional rambling, as it demonstrates her focusing on the idea of a wound and is lost in the vague notion of it and doesn’t demonstrate any thought on how the abstract concept would actually split the Alliance.
And had nothing to do with the miracle of Malfurion’s survival.
Devolve is accurate, because it is non-linear thinking and just jumping from random thought to random thought.
And a natural emotion to be in when this happens is panic leading to spiraling thoughts of undesired outcomes.
And powers beyond the Alliance and Elune, as if the whole world was going to be out to stop her.
Which is, as we discussed, Sylvanas doesn’t actually come up with anything during all this internal monologuing.
And I’ve been arguing shows Sylvanas neither was able to come up with something during all that emotional monologuing, and burning Teldrassil did not end up splitting the Alliance.
See above. All that mattered was holding Teldrassil, and Sylvanas threw that away.
Which she was incorrect about, because Teldrassil was the means to their objective. Without it they could not split the Alliance.
It is emotional abuse, as she admits to herself that she is as much to blame as he is, but publically throws all the blame on Saurfang to displace it from herself so that she could hurt him.
Once again, see above on Saurfang coming into this believing that only taking Teldrassil mattered.
But showed no indication in a change of perception that he believed Genn would suddenly change from wanting to prioritize Gilneas to not.
He also recognizes this was always going to be the situation the moment his troops stepped into Ashenvale, regardless of what happened with Malfurion. He was regretting agreeing to the plan at all.
And, as she is also consistently wrong about what people would do, her being right about some things does not make her right about everything, which Saurfang was emotionally vulnerable enough to not see in that moment.
It is a mockery of his beliefs, because there would be victory or death, but without honor in either situation.
And now come “Safe Haven” he realizes Sylvanas is to blame for the burning of Teldrassil and all the aftermath, even if he does also bare responsibility for the war before then.
I do agree with you that he is right to be ashamed. But that shame also compromises him emotionally in that moment.
It is true that he has no excuses. But the fel haze is a different sort of being compromised. There’s a difference between what amounts to chemical substances getting in the way of your ability to think straight and your own emotions getting in the way of your ability to think straight.
On this I do not disagree with you.
Suicidal thoughts themselves are a symptom of being emotionally compromise. It is practically the primary medical indicator psychologists and psychiatrists are concerned about as a risk alarm.
Because people can be self-contradictory, same as people can be honest and liars and still be the same person. If you believe a person cannot be both calculating and impulsive I don’t believe you have a very broad understanding of people.
It is not the only way to split the Alliance. It was the only way that Sylvanas was going to with the War of the Thorns, though. Unless you’re right and it works out later on. But you’re not right yet, and could very well be wrong as you are presently. As I said, a conversion for the future, or never.
It is not a contradiction. Once again, if you think a person cannot control themselves one moment and then act in impulse the next you don’t really understand what people are capable of. It was just a bit of impulse control she had left, before she did not have any impulse control after her emotional rambling internal monologue.
And if they stay united then she’ll have been as wrong as she can be.
I would say we are.
We just covered the same section. You did give a rebuttal to my analysis, but you didn’t really present Sylvanas as presenting any way to split the Alliance in the middle of her monolguing, which is vagueness I interpreted as her not coming up with anything because she was emotionally compromised.
No, I’m bringing it up because your argument against my ideas doesn’t make them incorrect. And in such a case “that doesn’t make my speculation canon” is the only factor in argument from popularity.
The Night Elves are the ones you hold in question of splitting from the Alliance, as Genn fully supports Anduin’s actions in Zandalar. Shandris is the representative of the Night Elves there.
If Blizzard ever bothers to answer those questions I will let you know.
But given the switching of hands it is pretty clear that the Night Elves can purge the blight. This would be even more factual if the sides were to switch sides multiple times, most evident with Ivus, who would then get purged cleansed over and over.
Obviously my analysis would conclude that the Horde players are zoning in to the past for gameplay purposes.
I agree with you that it would be a desperation move that wasn’t actually thought out, or even more likely just another suicide by cop Alliance play by Saurfang.
Though as I said, Saurfang’s notion of honor is seemingly arbitrary, and we haven’t really been shown reason to believe it isn’t, given how inconsistent it is.
And they don’t die there, as amusingly the Horde actually helps Jaina, Genn, Shandris, and more survive Azshara.
Sylvanas calls Malfurion’s survival a miracle granted Saurfang’s hand, and then says that Elune probably stayed Saurfang’s hand, so Sylvanas effectively was saying Elune was the miracle.
But betting that miracle forces would oppose you and not expecting them to happen at the worst possible times is not planning for things properly. Hence, Sylvanas should stop betting against miracles.
Sure he could have, in that fighting against Malfurion while trying to hold Teldrassil would have been given meaning in its honor.
I don’t put faith in Blizzard for this at this point.
And I think Blizzard will even more ham-fistedly have everyone be at peace, just like after Garrosh.
Edit addition:
This was in an interview about Tides of Vengeance and the Night Elves leaving for Darkshore:
- That being said, while the Horde story is currently one of deep division, Danuser notes that the Alliance aren’t at each other’s throats. “The Alliance is like a family. Brothers and sisters can disagree, and things can get heated, but there’s still a deep and abiding love and trust there.”
And I don’t trust Blizzard not to go with “insane monster” part, because of Sylvanas in BfA.
Someone’s going to be dissatisfied with whatever comes next. I presented how I would not be dissatisfied, which yes, would dissatisfy the Horde players you mentioned, and even some Alliance players. But obviously I don’t expect a situation that satisfies everyone, so I’d rather see one that I prefer instead.
The point is we don’t have any new information. Newest information is not necessarily valid information if things can change since we last got that information.
I’m confused at what you’re confused at. I’m not sure how to make it any clearer than what I wrote.
This is entirely true, and why Blizzard does not actually have a chance to satisfy everyone.
And I do not trust Blizzrd to do that.
I’ll argue that the Darkshore Warfront, “Terror of Darkshore”, and all its related content was great. Just not enough.
I don’t think you’re wrong here.
Oh, I have:
It hasn’t been made important enough. This is what people keep complaining about, especially from things like the Horde being more concerned about the raising of Derek Proudmoore and the arrest of Baine than the burning of Teldrassil.
Um… but people who like Classic seem to consider it the correct route to play Classic instead of the current expansion to do away with those issues entirely.
Isn’t it? Wasn’t the point that people don’t want to faction identities to go away by letting all players play together instead of being divided between the Horde and Alliance?
That won’t ever be the case, because that would be splitting friends and guilds up, as Alex Afrasiabi said:
Allowing all players to play together would solve a lot of Blizzard’s issues, I believe.
The Legion Order Halls were ultimately unsustainable, as they couldn’t keep up with making that much content that only even smaller fractions of players would actually see any way, and why we ended up with the junk quests for the Broken Shore campaign because they spent all their time on the Order Hall Mount quests.