Sylvanas: Warcraft's Anarcho-Syndicalist

[Ninh-draka (Ninh)]

@Weeven-illidan

The normal purpose of the Maw is to contain irredeemable souls. The fact that they’re not happy being there has no bearing on them deserving being there. Under normal circumstances, the fate of the souls in the maw is just.

Eternal Torment is morally unjust in literally every circumstance, especially now that a soul dying is an actual solution to a dangerous entity.

[Liuv-moon-guard (Liuv)]

Honestly? “Eternal Torment” might be more branding then reality. We know that souls don’t/can’t persist forever. Eventually they run out of anima and will “cease to be” at that point. That process can take centuries or millennia to play out depending on how much anima the soul has in the first place but we are still talking about a limited time span.

[Weeven-illidan]

@Ninh-draka

@Weeven-illidan

The normal purpose of the Maw is to contain irredeemable souls. The fact that they’re not happy being there has no bearing on them deserving being there. Under normal circumstances, the fate of the souls in the maw is just.

Eternal Torment is morally unjust in literally every circumstance, especially now that a soul dying is an actual solution to a dangerous entity.

Now that we know there’s an actual Hell where death ushers malevolent beings, we can’t know for certain we’re not ushering them to an even worse Double-Hell by destroying them. For all we know it might be hells all the way down!

More seriously, note that I worded specifically that I thought the purpose of the Maw is to contain irredeemable souls. There’s a big moral divide between a place designed to be inescapable and a place designed to inflict perpetual torment. My pet theory is that all the torture and suffering going on in Obleron (that seems to be the realm’s original name) might be the Jailer’s own personal touch after he got locked up in there.

[Evelysaa-moon-guard (Evelysaa)]

@Frankenfiend-the-scryers

So the everyone who dislike being in the Maw or tortured in Revendreth for eons will eventually come to love their suffering? Seems unlikely to me.

Probably not the Maw, but those in Revendreth can become Venthyr if they enjoy their time there. The Maw is a place for those who have broke the rules or will break them, a place to contain rule breakers is necessary. Societies must have prisons if they want to remain as they are.

@Frankenfiend-the-scryers

Whether Devos liked or disliked her afterlife is beside the point - that she could betray her duty as paragon of loyalty and swear allegiance to the Jailer shows that either the system and thus the Arbiter were wrong to place her in Bastion or that the system and Arbiter were not wrong but the system is none-the-less fallible in that the Jailer could so easily circumvent it to corrupt Devos in the first place. A ‘flaw in security’ cannot be so easily dismissed - if it is that fragile then that shows an inherent flaw in what is supposed to be an infallible system.

A fallible system being fixed could be why the events of this expansion are happening, just not in a complete overhaul as Sylvanas might be trying to achieve. The flaws are being fixed as we quest, almost like a computer being updated. It’s just that the Shadowlands is behind on its updates.

@Frankenfiend-the-scryers

If even the flaws are part of the design, then the Jailer is not in the wrong to try to overturn the system, as his attempts to do so are (by that logic) part of the Purpose. If the Jailer’s role is to undermine and highlight the flaws in the grand design, then instead of trying to preserve those flaws we should be working to accelerate that change to a new system.

The Jailer can try, but the Purpose isn’t to allow him to succeed. The point is to fix the system, not change it completely. The system can remain after the flaws have been corrected.

@Frankenfiend-the-scryers

Arguably that may be what we are doing anyways what with setting up a Court to rule over Revendreth instead of a single Master, bringing unity to Maldraxxus, and leading the Kyrian to question what their role in eternity really should be and if it’s worth sacrificing their memories.

Exactly.

@Frankenfiend-the-scryers

A great comfort to those who are not the eggs in question, but that’s not an egalitarian philosophy is it?

In this case, Sylvanas is the one who broke the eggs.

[anon27228360]

you couldn’t even get a blizzard employee to define anarcho-syndicalism even if you put a gun to their head

[Micâh-moon-guard]

Or you know…people will do what they do best. Overthink or make a situation far more complex than it actually is Shrug