Yeah I already asked this on another thread… according to some of the alliance Jaina never committed this genocide…that they think I’m crazy for saying she did when everyone who played back then in mists knows she did.
So does this mean we’re going to lock her in a crystal like we did to Illidan and realize she was only pretending to work for Zovaal and actually meant to kill him. Also since Illidan is watching Sargaeras I wonder if the illidari will ever train the other elves in their demon hunter ways… or…idk… start branching away from elves but they ignore orcs and humans who’d only be corrupted by the fel and not be able to fight it?
Maybe after Zovaal ‘gets away’ and decides he can’t be touched so he brags about playing sylvanas for a fool and turning everyone she’s ever cared about against her and idk feeding her boyfriend nathanos to his dog. Only to end up turning her back to her living elf self after stripping the banshee from her and keeping it as his new pet?
Oh it’s not crazy, just really really really really really really stupid.
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it…may be a tad stupid but what about we lock her in a crystal and take out Zovaal then make her pull a Bolvar and replace Zovaal and not end up a threat to anyone anymore. Would that be a better outcome…not redeeming her but it also isn’t us wasting potential by offing her like Gul’dan…who wasn’t even our Gul’dan…our Gul’dan got killed by the lord of the legion ages ago…the one we slaughtered in Legion was alternate universe Gul’dan but still. I’d rather not stain my hands with Sylvanas’s blood by being forced to off her just so the writers can appease the alliance after we torched a tree… because of saurfang not killing Malfurion…
It isn’t that it is is crazy for me. It is that I’m tired and done with the character. She is no longer interesting and me personally hasn’t been interesting since the end of Wrath. I want some other character to get some attention or spotlight for a change. We’ve been dealing with her bs for several expansions.
No it’s not crazy but she is.
% certifiable
She is a textbook narcissist and sociopath
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How often has it been done?
Also, she was a great defender of her people while she was alive. Wasn’t she forced to do horrible things after the LK fiasco? I know she’s in control now(right?), but how much of that is still driven by what she was forced to become?
Taliesen&evitel made a good point that the arbiter would consider all of that, and how she acted when she was alive. Which would make her deserving of a fate that is not the maw.
It’s not ‘crazy,’
It’s STUPID.
But, as for Sylvanas, many scenarios can be interpreted as redemption.
I bet Nelves “redemption” and loyalists “redemption” are gonna be very different.
For me, any scenarios that include ‘she did the right thing’ or ‘she had no choice’ are all redemption arcs.
Don’t care whether she’s gonna be dead or not.
That was just based on the specific wording if “deeds in life” didn’t include undeath. =P
I mean, she did a lot more than kill a tree: Blighted and killed most of Gilneas, burned Teldrassil, was behind Wrathgate, defied a Warchief multiple times (under Garrosh), enslaved and experimented on multiple people (including the Gilneans before Blighting them), Killed her own Forsaken when they were so close to what SHE promised them back in Silverpine (and that’s only one of MANY of the things she’s done to the Forsaken), etc etc…
At this point she’s more a dictator than Garrosh ever was…and according to the story devs he was meant to be WoW’s hitler. Not a new development either, even living Sylvanas considered her “soldiers” disposable arrows in her quiver…
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meh, I don’t really care. If I felt like the writers butchered her character, why should I care about the people she butchers?
I mean…you were one of the people she butchered no? She raised the current Forsaken against their will and said “serve me or die!”, Blights them as well on several occasions, kills one of her trusted advisers who was a Forsaken in BFA for “suspecting” he betrayed her (when it was baine), Baine betrayed her because she tried to turn a then Forsaken Derek Proudmoore into a suicide bomb, the Forsaken family reunion event later in BFA in which she killed and was going to kill Forsaken who after years were going to be happy with their families again etc… all of it not to the Alliance or an Alliance race, that’s just what she did to her own “people”.
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No, I would have benefited from her leadership, before she became the Warchief and lost her mind.
They weren’t the same. Besides, as a Forsaken you exist before the other “Forsaken” are raised.
The Humans kill other humans that become splinter factions all the time, I guess they’re also super evil… gosh.
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The playable Forsaken were raised with the others in Silverpine, not sure what you’re trying to get at, but it’s incorrect.
But the king or ruler themselves do not kill them no? Sylvanas promised she’d give the Forsaken a home and security against humans and living forces who wished to hurt them, and immediately used them to test blight among other heinous experiments and worsening treatment… there is no excuse for what she has done to any and everyone who ever remotely trusted her.
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The Forsaken came into existence when the Lich Kings control over the scourge faltered. Sylvanas and her Val’Kyr did not create the Forsaken. You’re confusing a quest you do, which raises “Forsaken” which is indicated aren’t as good revives as their predecessor.
It’s right on the wiki if you’d like to learn more about the Forsaken.
Also, it was just at tree, in just a game. There is excusing what happened because it never actually happened.
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While they were raised without consent (which is difficult to get from corpses to be fair), they were not given a “serve me or die” ultimatum. You are, once raised, not forced into anything.
To quote Agatha, the Val’kyr raising people in Deathknell
You are no slave, [name]. You are free to follow whatever path you choose from here.
Another quote, to a newly raised npc.
You are returned to life. The Banshee Queen asks for your service.
You can even see some of the reactions of newly risen Forsaken in the starting area. Running away and turning into a mindless undead, willfully joining, or laying back down into their graves. All are allowed and accepted choices.
The playable Forsaken is literally raised by a Val’kyr, that’s been the case since cataclysm.
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No, it hasn’t. My Forsaken character which predates that, would like to disagree. Lore Forsaken which predate that, would also like to disagree. They can both exist at the same time.
"After the Lich King’s death, a number of the more intelligent former Scourge members were accepted into the Forsaken’s ranks by Queen Sylvanas. Some of them, the Val’kyr, have brought with them a new age for the Forsaken: the ability to “procreate” via their necromantic abilities, bolstering their numbers. The second generation Forsaken are individuals who were raised into undeath by these Val’kyr.
The risen dead of the new Forsaken generation are given a choice of what to do after they are reborn. Some of them, such as Valdred Moray, accept their fate, and seem keen to make themselves useful and serve the Forsaken in death. The resurrected Prince Galen Trollbane seemed resigned to the fate that befell him and while not particularly enthusiastic about killing his former allies, he personally gave the quests to slay them for the good of the Dark Lady.
On the other hand, others do not react so positively. Lilian Voss reacts in horror to what she had become, and Marshal Redpath, not happy with his fate, attacks Deathknell after the transition. Some of the new Forsaken simply kill themselves on the spot. Dumass is perhaps the most extreme case of how the process can strip away rational thought and intelligence."-Forsaken, WoWpedia.
They weren’t given a choice, quite a few said “no” and were destroyed on Sylvanas’ orders if you do the Forsaken starting quest pre-lvl squish in Silverpine. Thus “Serve me or die!”.
Should probably read the things you’re quoting, my dude.
Sylvanas told them she’d give them a freedom of choice, she never honors this… being killed or serve isn’t much of a choice. (Especially when there’s a high chance of dying anyways in Sylvanas’ service…) That’s effectively like saying it’s a bank teller’s “choice” when a bank robber is holding the gun to their head and telling them to “Put the money in the bag!!”. Another thing is, don’t Forsaken and undead in general still have that manic period of about 2 days after being raised they need to calm down? If so the question is double loaded, because the Forsaken making the “choice” aren’t really in their right minds…
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I expect anything from now. Even Anduin saying Sylvanas earned a redemption, everyone else saying she deserves to be dead and she saying “I am dead already.”
Then everybody laughing, even the Jailer.
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