The biggest issue facing this class right now is the pet res cast time, which is the biggest indicator we’ve gotten in years that no devs actively main hunter lol
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Yeah, that rez time is really dreadful. Takes forever and is incredibly easy to interrupt.
When two out of three of the specs actively rely on pets for either damage or focus generation, not being able to reliably keep them up is a problem.
Lol, very eloquent, but you’ve got this backwards: there are many hunters here who liked Survival the way it was before WE got something taken away from us. I’m just asking to restore it and create a 4th spec for melee, or convert BM to melee as it should be.
You’re entitled to you opinion but your argument is hypocritical and childishly presented.
Wrong. The pet res is fair and adds consequences for losing your pet. It was op before. The biggest issue with this spec is the dependency on pets for focus, along with a bunch of broken disorganized talents. You know there’s a problem when you have 3 AoE talents on the same damn row, or abilities like Viper’s Venom on the same row as Alpha Predator, despite the fact that it can’t function without Alpha Predator.
If you’re having pet problems, use a fox like me. People have such a hard time killing him and just waste time while I shoot them.
Because trap specs required a brain and tactical awareness as opposed to just being another 2-3 button zombie spec. It added an element of guile to the spec that has been sorely missing. It’s more of a PvP thing, but it works in dungeons too.
Immolation could and should be so much more. Have you ever seen that mechanic in Visions where you get lit on fire and run around screaming? PERFECT special effect and mechanic for a fully armed Immolation Trap.
Freezing trap never changed but Snake Trap should be baseline. Chakrams actually aren’t that bad. I’m having fun using them with my ranged SV mash up spec.
Well no kidding, we have a lot to complain about right now. BLizzard literally did NOTHING with our spec. They’re out of ideas, so we’re telling them what we want here in this thread. My idea is just one of many.
As for your solution, it’s just a contributing to something that’s already boring, underplayed, and broken. Not everyone is a damage charts zombie.
Pet was never even remotely OP. Ever. It was not a complaint from anyone ever. (For melee survival that is.) Pets are annoying to some folks but that’s moreso subjective opinion than anything.
The res time is only good if the pet can survive with maintenance. Pets were always relatively weak for SV they just weren’t the focus. Good comps at higher level would obliterate a pet and we’d have to use turtle to Rez pet because even 2 seconds was not ideal.
4 seconds with a weak pet is obnoxious. It doesn’t do much for pve; so I could care less. But for PvP it’s insanely bad.
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There was literally no consequence for losing your pet. That’s why it was silly. You can sustain your pet pretty easily in most engagements if you pay attention and have an attentive healer. Granted, my brother’s druid HoTs stacked well with mine, making it easier, and my pet is a fox so he’s hard to kill. Hell, I even call him back behind a pillar and bandage him up sometimes. Works real fast when stacked with Mend Pet.
In the rare occasions where people are stupid enough to attack my pet, I just withdraw him and take cover while my teammates beat the crap out of them.
That being said, Survival should be getting focus off of DoTs, not the damn pet. I don’t even know why we’ve become a 2nd Beastmaster spec, but I’d take Lone Wolf and MoP Survival over this nonsense.
For the sake of argument. The consequence of your pet dying was you lost cc, focus generation and a damage ability. Oh and sac.
With a good team it meant you’d be sacrificing a lot of time or you’re only immunity just to get a pet back up (even with 2 second Rez).
Which then led to lack of a defensive for your actual character which would then just flop over.
Just my thoughts; and experiences from seeing some high rated pvp. I’m a 2200 Andy so I don’t say much.
LMAO you guys were willing to humour this guy and here he is defending the 4 sec pet res. Do you guys need any more proof he is utterly out of his league?
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Oh I totally get that, but I just felt it was too easy to get the pet back. I feel people, including myself, should pay for making mistakes. I’ve gotten into the habit of preying upon my enemy’s desire to kill the pet first. It gives me uptime while they’re bungling around trying to kill him.
I haven’t bothered with arena much beyond skirmishes in quite some time because honestly find it stale and repetitive, but I’ve had enough battles to know how to string people alone by the nose.
Says the raid carebear who talked his way out of a duel with me hahaha. I’ve already warned you to stay on topic, now you’re just spamming. Not my fault you’re not crafty enough to keep your own pet alive. And you’re an MM player who’s all gear, no tactics, what would you know? Enjoy the nerf when it hits.
You’re literally clueless about pvp. The only place it was “op” was when you were using pets to soak mechanics in pve. That could have been addressed in other ways like making the pet ineligible in the first place.
Killing surv pets was a strategy in BFA too, and most of us made a point of not telling people about it because we were fairly rare and it wasn’t immediately obvious to non-hunters how deeply it impacted us.
Surv hunters will face severe viability issues in threes this season almost entirely due to the pet res cast time.
The fact you think there’s no problem with this is a solid indication you don’t actually play survival (the version we have now) enough to be positioning yourself as a provider of solutions. You don’t even know our struggles. You only know your wishlist which seems to be;
“make survival ranged again”
and
“make BM melee”
The fact you don’t see the rampant hypocrisy between those two statements is troubling. Your brain is broken.
Do you know literally anything about pet classes or abilities? Lmao
Let me just pull out a FOX in arena, that’s not a problem at all!
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Put your money where your mouth is and duel me then. Look if you can’t even keep your own pet alive then that’s not my problem. Sure it’s annoying when the pet drops in a high pressure situation, but my beef with pets is the overdependency, clunky mechanics, and the terrain bugs that cut me off. We’re not BM Hunters, so what the hells is a pet doing at the core of our rotation?? THat’s why I say it should be BM.
No kidding, and it was just as stupid then. I’ve been well aware of the idea since they first implemented it and I capitalized on it when people tried to kill my pet. There’s a million ways to get them off your pet or take advantage of their attention lapses.
If you knew the pet abilities you’d go with a fox or something that can dodge. It’s either that or go for a tank pet who can’t give you Master’s Call, and that’s even worse.
Really? Then why does “Wishlist” focus on DoTs being our focus recharger. Maybe because I am aware of the problems.
Just because I figured out ways to overcome the issue that you’re blowing out of proportion, doesn’t mean I don’t see it. It’s a big part of why I want this pet crap gone.
BM hunters are based on Rexxar, who was THE original Beast Master in Warcraft III. He had medium range throwing weapon attacks, but he did most of his fighting up close and with his trusty pets. This is why the model for BM that I came up with is much smarter and more fitting.
According to my Spy addons stats, I’ve killed you 3 times.
Your fox doesn’t have an MS debuff, which puts you at a disadvantage against any healer or hybrid, a massive disadvantage.
A leech pet is also better at staying alive than a dodge pet is.
Stop scribbling in your drool.
The only reason I ever bothered to level my ‘deep often randomly rerolled and rarely past level 10’ hunters was the addition of a melee spec.
Sure, it is basically the FFXIV Dragoon mixed with a dash of a Guild Wars 2 greatsword ranger (save for the part about still having to have a pet - MM got GW2’s Soulbeast spec).
But that’s why I love it.
You’ve got 2 other ranged specs.
There’s no other good ‘high mobility fast 2-handed melee class’ in WoW. Arms Warrior, Ret Paladin, and Unholy DK may be 2-handers but they’ve got a very different feel and frankly all feel like variations on each other. Survival feels unique.
The only characters I leveled in BFA, for the entire expansion - were 2 survival hunters. Alliance and Horde. Raided on the Alliance one. Which was a big change for someone who’s entire time in WoW since 2006 was tanking with some healing.
But Survival hunter is just pure absolute fun.
Keep the design EXACTLY as it is now.
Only boost or nerf numbers as needed to make it comparable to other specs as the lifecycle of the expansion goes on.
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I think it’s only clunky and flawed because you’ve got your ranged and melee priority reversed there.
If you stick to melee as much as mechanics allow, there’s a very smooth flowing rotation to the spec where everything just seems to consistently line up at the right time.
2 physical ranged specs compared to…
13 melee specs
9 caster specs
6 healer specs
6 tank specs
the game didn’t and doesn’t need more melee, it’s over saturated with melee as it is.
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I think that side of the argument is stale at this point. Although I agree it’s highly lopsided.
I do think they missed the mark in shadowlands to bring in a new caster class. Too focused on systems everyone hates.
I still hold hope they’ll bring back RSV back so I can play both survival specs. I just have a feeling they are intentionally not bringing it back because of ranged balance for an instant cast range spec. Even though they did it before.
Also did the noob ask for a duel? LOL
Doesn’t even remotely know how the class plays. Would love to see him get schooled or do it myself.
You on later Xidane? I could use some comedy in my life.
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Another excuse-maker, huh? Typical Horde, always hiding behind a group. I do recall bumping into you when you had insane gear—and group of 12 or more other Horde against just me, so yeah you most likely got a shot in during a mass ganking. Epic… As I recall it took your team 5 minutes of constant pursuit to actually catch me.
Except you don’t have Master’s call and get torn apart. GG. You know leach gets cut down to nothing in PvP right? See this what happens when you don’t actually fight your own battles, you don’t know stuff like that. In situations where I need MW (Mortal Wounds), I use a hyena. A cunning pet with MW.
I did do that for all of BFA and it’s possible to maintain it, but irritating because I like fast, on the go ranged attacks more than having to crank up my focus with a pet. My current setup is an experiment.
Bring it on, tough guy. You’ve got a massive gear and covenant advantage but I don’t mind a challenge. I know everything about it, not my fault you guys lack nuance.
Ah making excuses already on the first week when nobody has gear or really anything from covenants.
Not surprised at all.
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Sounds like you’re making an excuse. Duel: Yes or no? I’m currently suspended in chat for the game, but I can still add you and we can square off for a few rounds. Don’t lower yourself to the level of these Horde cowards, follow through with your boasts and duel.
Me stating your gear advantage isn’t an excuse, it’s a fact. We’re not Horde, show some integrity and admit that you have an advantage. That being said, I’m still confident that I’ll win.
That’s never a good sign.
I will say there’s exactly 1 part of the thread’s original claim I can concede. The ‘general consensus’ part.
Look at warcraft logs and the amount of logs coming in for survival hunters is amazingly few. We’re an extremely rare spec choice.
I still think the spec is exactly where it should be right now. I think a lot of that rarity is just due to this whole new playstyle being added to WoW 12 years into the game. It doesn’t play like other melee either - it’s more like a hybrid between WoW and more modern MMOs in how it plays. I suspect that limits its appeal to mostly players that have had a history of wandering off to other games to see how much better melee is handled there as opposed to here.
Which is, frankly, why I like it.
They almost did this when they added monk - added a healer and a DPS that played more like a modern MMO, but they took away the DPS before Pandaria even launched by giving it back auto-attack, and then took away the modern healer when they nerfed fistweaving at the end of that expansion.
So… maybe you will get your wish in time. But at least for the rest of this expansion we have a semi-modern melee DPS in WoW still.
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