To help alleviate the queue times for everyone, I suggest greatly increasing the relative power of tanks and healers until you can figure out how to challenge them in a way that is fun and doesn’t drive them all to quit the game or swap to dps.
Balance is of secondary priority to fun.
Tanking is the easiest role in ff14 dungeons and it feels fine. It’s still not popular there, but at least you don’t look at them in your list of maxing specs and feel dread.
I think reducing enemy damage would be preferable to increasing player power. Or increasing player health bars again.
Of course, they also need to balance the different tanks and healers better as the top performers blow the low performers out of the water currently.
Could not possibly agree more.
I like playing WoW. Historically, I’ve played some of every role to within +/- 3 key levels of title range every season.
I’ve not been this averse to playing tank or healer ever since the introduction of M+.
Healers universally feel like they’re just lacking power. When I’m playing one even with a properly executed ramp, and in keys as low as 12’s it feels as if my group is dead if I’m a SINGLE GCD late on executing my CD.
Tanks? Lol at this point, we are just pushing people away from playing the role altogether. Prot paladin has mana issues, we’re nerfing prot warrior going into the next patch, BrM just isn’t getting touched… And again, like healers, if you’re a SINGLE GCD late you could be globalled, OR if you use a defensive a SINGLE GCD early it won’t cover both necessary tank busters.
Meanwhile we have DPS like DK, rogue, warrior, ret, mage, warlock, ect that are essentially unkillable when piloted correctly, and the free-est timers in the history of M+.
WHY are we putting EVERYTHING on tanks and healers?
Devs, please take a look at SL and DF. Compare.
We had:
NPC casts on CD from stuns/stops
Strong tanks
Strong healers
5sec death timer
Substantially less leavers.
Completely agreed. Tanks and healers have to play at such a higher level compared to DPS, where mis-timing a single CD can make or break a pull/boss/key.
When I started healing in SL, my throughout CDs were used for “oh shi-“ moments. Now, I have to use them basically on CD. And they must be rotated properly, else I won’t have them available for the next major damage event. And if I have to use one early to cover a mistake, it causes a domino effect because then it means I won’t have it for the next event.
If a DPS fat fingers a CD or messes up their rotation it might mean their damage slightly decreases that pull or boss, but it’s very unlikely to cause a wipe/brick. Plus, there’s two other DPS to help make up for any loss of DPS. This is not afforded to tanks or healers (at least in keys).
Making strides to drastically reduce the stress involved for these roles would make them more appealing to play. Oftentimes I will hop on with the intention of doing keys, but after one of them I’m so burnt out I don’t care to keep going.
Another thing they could look into is to simply make the roles more rewarding. Guaranteed loot, bonus valorstones/crests, SOMETHING.
White DMG from mobs needs to go way down. Tanks die so quickly from white damage and any player without a cheat death basically gets one shot by any mob. Feels insane honestly.
Only an insanely small subset of players like incoming spike damage. They should probably make them unhappy instead of everyone else.
Make healers have strong heals that can cost alot of mana. Give them the ability to save people, but make it best to choose your heals wisely to keep up with rot damage.
Make tanks have strong dps IF they are tanking. They should feel strong. Provide them ways to protect the party. Remove party def CDs from DPS.
Reduce spike damage, highly increase rot damage.
That would feel pretty good.
Except for PLD, I used to main it but I dread playing it now with how they’ve butchered it lol. The rest I enjoy.
So buffing our dmg until they figure out a new solution, which would likely involve lowering that power again, is the way to keep us playing long-term?
Power is more than just damage for tanks and healers.
Same thing though, if they increased our power – how do they “fix the tank/healer dynamic” in dungeons without later removing that power?
This is a short-term solution, not a long-term one.
Bandaids are useful for a reason.
But yeah. The real solution will be a little more in depth. But even if they never claw back the bandaid fix, it would be better than just not fixing it.
Except it wouldn’t impact “queue” times. You are trying to draw causation relationships between the two when the data actually shows that the number of completed keys to tank population is almost identical to DF S3.
The only real data we have for tank population would be raider IO right? So the ratio of population:keys will always be 1:1 because you can’t run a key without a tank.
Reports of longer queue times are ubiquitous this season, too. Anecdotally, if I ever go “active” on any platform, I get bombarded with requests to tank, which didn’t happen in seasons where I was playing a Meta tank or when I had much higher IO. There’s no denying this season is worse off in that regard.
No, that’s not true because you have x being the raw number of runs which counts all runs regardless of who was in it. Then you have the tank population that only counts each unique character. If there were less tanks then we would see a higher ratio of keys completed to unique tanks.
This is just based on anecdotes and confirmation bias.
That methodology wouldn’t bear out with capturing players who could/would tank but aren’t though. I see where you’re going with this, but because of the requirements for the group to form, I think the selection bias here would occlude any measurable impact on the ratio of unique tanks : runs, because the assumption that those tanks would then “fill the void” would, itself, alleviate the tank shortage, if it was true. It’s a self defeating metric.
Anecdotal reports aren’t great, but they are the best we have right now.
Well a big difference between ff14 tanks at end game and wow tanks at end game, is that tank rotations in wow are boring, and in some cases like protection warrior’s and guardian druids as big examples you either use rage for survability (mandatory) or damage. Which makes the specs feel even more boring. At least in FF14 you aren’t trading resources for either or and get your cake and eat it too.
I literally stated that we have numbers. You do have better data, but you are choosing to ignore it. The fact that the raw number of runs in relation to the unique tank count being the same as DF S3 means that the change in difficulty didn’t play a factor. It’s a perception issue with confirmation bias.
DF S3:
TWW S1:
That only shows that active tanks are similarly active. It doesn’t capture any tanks that are inactive, and if anything, it proves that active tanks aren’t filling the void. (Showing another example of this fallacy).