Stormwind and Ogrimmar Questions

Good day! These capital cities really have layers! As a new player, I’m finding it very complicated to keep these cities in their “normal” state. I’m unsure exactly what this means or if any "normal’ states actually exist for either of these cities. Anyhow, I’m finding that with many expansion introductions, that all appear to pop up for new characters at 10th level, phasing will occur that shifts the cities out of their normalcy. Various NPCs, objects, and other details are likely to be missing depending which version of the cities my character is seeing. The questions that I’m having here are only relating to expansion introductions that pop up at 10th level for new characters. Phasing is likely far too complex and complicated to dive any deeper than this here.

As far as the multitude of expansion introductions that do pop up and become available at 10th level, can anyone, possibly, point me to a decent guide that might be available to will outline exactly how far new characters have to progress each expansion campaign to see these capital cities being in their “normal” state? Most specifically, I’m hoping to discover any details to where Stormwind and Orgrimmar aren’t going to have critical NPCs missing that offer various in game features and services (bankers, auctioneers, profession trainers, experience eliminators, etc.).

I’ve attempted to start zero of the expansion campaigns, but some pop open very repeatedly and are known to place items within my inventory. Starting any new characters out in Exile’s Reach also seems to trigger phasing changes to occur here beyond the basic tutorials (completing, either, the Alliance or Horde tutorials, getting the mounts, and getting the Hearthstone to finish them).

I had thought that I was well along my way here, but something is still amiss for multiple characters that I have. I’m likely quite mistaken here, but I’m thinking that my main hang ups here are for the BFA and Shadowlands campaigns. I mentioned that progressing the BFA campaign as far as unlocking teleportation hasn’t worked for characters that start out in Exile’s Reach. I’ve been able to see the cities in their normal state with characters that start out in other areas, but I haven’t seen how it’s possible to revert either city to normal here. The Shadowlands campaign, too, is looking to be far more drawn out than a standard introduction here. How far am I going to have progress this campaign?

Note: I’m wanting to do all of these things much longer term for each of my characters, but I had rather haphazardly accepted multiple quest pop ups that became available at 10th level. Before I get too far invested into even more characters that will lose access to a variety of services and features, I’m hoping to find out exactly what I’ll need to do (or avoid doing) to see each of the capital cities in their normal state of affairs. Any feedback, suggestions, or pointers to any guides that I’ve likely overlooked would be greatly appreciated here.

Stormwind and Orgrimmar are a complete mess because of phasing, No argument there.

Phasing is because of the passage of time. Different people and events are there at different times

https://warcraft.wiki.gg/wiki/Timeline

Different people in the Warchief’s Chamber, or stiiting on the Throne of Stormwind, at different times.

And differemt Chromie Times, or different quests, throw you into different times,

The devs really are reckless with this. They really don’t seem to appreciate the alienating effect it has on people who have not nailed down mental maps of the sequence of events.

I’ll give you all of that.

But you have the wrong concept when you say “to see each of the capital cities in their normal state of affairs”. There is no “normal”, or, more correctly, they are all normal. Each appearing or disappearing person or event is normal for the time your character is inhabiting while in the city.

When you have quests from two different times, they come into conflict, and you may not see characters from one time because it conflicts with the other.

You say you have haphazardly accepted lots of quests. Abandon all Stormwind quests except the ones for the Chromie Time you are pursuing. Or abandon them all, and re-take the ones you want.

You need only one timeline to level from 10 to 70. If you are exploring multiple timelines, I recommend making a separate character for each timeline. On each character, take ONE quest from Chromie, and follow that.

Shadowlands is … peculiar. An exception. I would recommend staying away from that one until you have time, and a clearer understanding of how the game works. It is one, massively long, forced, linear questline with no opportunities for choice.

You don’t specify what your problem with BfA is. I’m not aware of any.

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Thank you for the reply. The main problem that I’m finding with characters that I’ve started out in Exile’s Reach is that they don’t have access to many of the NPCs in Stormwind. New characters that I’ve started out in traditional starting areas haven’t had the same NPCs go missing from their beginning. I’m unsure how far new characters that start out in Exile’s Reach need to progress the BFA campaign to see any of the missing content from Stormwind. For characters that start outside of Exile’s Reach, I’ve been able to do the very beginning introduction quests for the BFA campaign (up through unlocking teleportation) and had Stormwind revert back to normal. This doesn’t appear to be the case, though, for new characters that start out in Exile’s Reach. I haven’t fully tested Horde characters yet, but I’ve heard that they have similiar phasing mishaps when starting out in Exile’s Reach. Does anyone know for certain how far exactly new characters that start out in the tutorial must progress the BFA campaign to see the missing content?

Thank you, too, for clearing that up about the Shadowlands campaign. I’m not too far along into any new characters yet, but for one character that I had help turning leveling experience off with, I’m finding it to be pretty lengthy. No doubt, it would likely be improbable to progress that campaign far enough to see the missing content in Stormwind before reaching 30th level? I’m wanting to “park” some of my characters at 30th level to work through the expansions that, by default, cap out at 30th level now. Then pause again at 45th for those expansions, 60th for those, etc. I’m sure this is pretty niche as most players are likely wanting to reach max level asap. Having the only experience eliminators available go frequently missing is problematic for anyone in my shoes.

Edit: Regardless of using Chromie time or not, every 10th level(+)) character that I’ve tested so far has had the same expansion quest campaigns popping up for them. They’ve also appeared to have the same quests offered to them from the “recommended content” and the Hero’s Board. I’m unsure if there would be anything within my control to actually limit what quests might pop up for my characters.

OK, we are mashing together two things here that I think should we keep very separate

  1. “characters that I’ve started out in Exile’s Reach is that they don’t have access to many of the NPCs in Stormwind.”

Please specify which NPCs, so I can track them down. You mention Experience Eliminators being gone? That’s weird.

Under Behsten I see the comment

At the beginning for BFA content, this NPC is out of phase with the intro content. Once you have completed the intro quests to get to Boralus, Stormwind Keep will return to it’s normal phase and Behsten will be accessible again.

Which, ifit made sense an expansion or three ago, should not make sense now b/c Dragonflight is now the default starter timeline. :scream:

I am familiar with some of the phasing screw-ups in Stormwind (and one throughout the EK and Kalimdor that I don’t understand at all) but I hadn’t come across a difference between a character coming from Exile’s Reach and a character coming from normal zones.

ER was originally introduced in BfA …I wonder whether characters coming from ER still begin in BfA timeline? they shouldn’t, but …

 

  1. Levels, and What you should aim to be doing

Chromie Time (talking to Chromie and selecting a timeline) does two things:

  1. It scales mobs to your level in that (and other) expansions
  2. It gives you a starter quest for that expansion

If you are out of Chromie Time (you can also ask her to return you to current timeline) then mobs have a “natural” range of levels that they revert to

Mobs in EK and Kalimdor ALWAYS scale 1-30, regardless of Chromie Time (but there are weird differences we don’t need to get into here)

Mobs in Outland scale from 30-35 when out of Chromie Time, but 10-70 when in it.

… and so on.

In Chromie Time, each expansion will give you FAR MORE XP than you need to level from 10-70. If you start at 10, you will probably be about half done with the continent when you hit 70 (Shadowlands, again, is a bit weird., but this is true for all the rest.)

So I’m not sure that parking a character at 30 to start an expansion is going to work well. If you start an expansion at 30, you will likely hit 70 a quarter way into that expansion.

And when you hit 70, you are forced out of Chromie Time, and so the mobs in each expansion resume their natural levels, which will be much lower than you except for maybe Dragonflight and Shadowlands.

Thank you again for the reply. What I had meant by “parking” the characters at 30th, 45th, then 60th levels, is that I would use the experience eliminators to disable leveling experience for the characters at these points. Again, something irrelevant to most players, but I was hoping to avoid overleveling just about all of the earlier expansions in this way. I realize that using Chromie will scale some of the content further, but the first three expansions, at least, all cap at 30th level by default. In theory, it should be reasonably possible for a character to earn all of the achievements for these expansions within these levels. A handful of achievements actually require being within these level ranges (Herald of the Titans, etc.).

I had played very briefly when Shadowlands was current and I recall various NPCs, at least, going missing from Stormwind during different phasing points. I certainly don’t recall having this many issues with it, though, and I had started several characters in Exile’s Reach and worked them through the BFA campaign up through unlocking teleportation (basically, an extra quest or two after reaching Boralus).

The NPCs that go missing (that I’m aware of and have always ended up missing at the same times) are Behsten (experience disabler), Harrison Jones (archeology trainer), and (I was looking up the other missing quest NPC that I know of when I came across this post: “An Urgent Meeting” - A massive phasing issue in Stormwind Keep - Gameplay / Quests & Achievements - World of Warcraft Forums (blizzard.com) ). It seems that patch 11.0 removed the “An Urgent Meeting” quest from the game. Any new characters that start out in Exile’s Reach are currently and permanently stuck with this version of Stormwind now. I had filed a bug report, but I was certain what might be causing the issue. It sounds as though this other player is quite certain, though, and it would fit within what has happened to each of my newer characters that has had this issue. Thank you.

OK.

One thing to try, on your Exile’s Reach character.

  1. Abandon all quests.
  2. Go to Chromie and ask to be “returned to the current timeline.”

It may not work, but it’s worth a shot.

I’m tempted to level a character to 10 in ER to check, but I don’t have the time at the moment.

I have the same issue. I Tried abandoning quests, completing BFA/Legion intros, playing around with chromie time and nothing works. Even tried it with a couple new alts with the same result. Every time I go into Stormwind Keep I just see Anduin sitting there surrounded by other NPC’s. I’m locked out from doing anything in there.

Who are you looking for in Stormwind? Behsten?

You do know he is almostinvisible in a side room? (just checking …)

Behsten yeah. I checked multiple times to make sure I wasn’t going crazy but he’s definitely phased out. Archeology trainer is missing too. I’m almost positive it’s related to the Urgent Meeting quest like OP mentioned when completing Exiles Reach because it’s not an issue on my characters that did traditional starting zones.

Abandon all hope of sanity, those foolish enough to read this.

Consider it one of those insane Lovecraftian journals found in Innsmouth, ranting and hinting at great horrors, written by someone who disappeared, and that drives its readers mad.

 


 

OK, I took a character through Exile’s Reach (or Cardboard Island as I prefer to call it; I have no respect at all for that place.)

I completed the dungeon, got on the gryphon, arrived at Stormwind, and IMMEDIATELY flew off to Stormwind Keep…

… and there is Behsten, offering to pause my XP. :+1:

Also, Harrison Jones is lecturing in the library as usual.

Turalyon is on the throne.

All is well with the world.

 


 

Now I have come back in front of Captain Garrick, at the gates of Stormwind.

She is offering me the quest Welcome to Stormwind

and an option to skip the city tour and choose a Timewalking Campaign.

 


 

So IT IS NOT Exile’s Reach that phases these characters out!

I’m tired. I’ll follow through the sequence later, or tomorrow, to find out where the phasing happens.

(Reminder to self: Terokkar realm)

 


 

I took the Welcome to Stormwind quest and took the tour.

The quest The Dragon Isles Await popped up.

Now Anduin is on the throne, with Genn and Jaina and Shaw around.

I Abandon the quest. It auto accepts again as soon as I exit the keep.

I fly away and Abandon again, then log out. When I log in, it auto-accepts again. GRRRRR. This quest is like something nasty on my shoe I can’t get rid of, can’t scrape off.

I go talk to Chromie. She offers me Timewalking campaigns, but not to return to the present. So I guess I’m kinda-sorta “there”, for some value of “there”. But it must be the DF tineline, not the current timeline, 'cos Anduin hasn’t gained the weight and got the suntan yet.

I pick Wrath timeline, and log out.

Log in, back to the keep. No change: Anduin, Jaina, Genn. No Behsten. No Harrison.

I go back to Chromie, ask her to return me to present timeline.

THAT ACCURSED QUEST AGAIN! The quest The Dragon Isles Await auto-accepted.

At this point I want to kill something. This is maddening.

 


 

Can I trick it?

I do that quest and the next. Chat with Wrathion, Turalyon, Toddy, Dragonkin on the side of the Keep. I Abandon the next quest, and beeline for Chromie.

This time I select Pandaria.

Oof, I’ve tricked it, but it doesn’t seem to do me any good.

I should be meeting Varian, but the occupants of the Keep are still there: Anduin and the gang are there, and so is Wrathion and his Dragon Isles group , but no Behsten, no Harrison, no Varian.

If I really was a new-ish player wanting to get on with the game, I’d be spitting blood about now.

Ok, let me make sure I have given it every chance to allow me to progress with Pandaria. Leave Stormwind, go to Goldshire. Log out. Log into another character. Log out of the game entirely. Wait 15 minutes.

OK, that did something. When I came back and entered the Keep, I got the starting cutscene for Pandaria, and someone to turn the quest in to outside the Keep … but Anduin and the gang are still at the Throne (which is pretty weird considering I’m being sent to look for him on an uncharted island in Pandaria.) No Harrison, no Behsten. No Varian. Wrathion and his lot are still hanging out on the edge.

This is a complete mess.

I abandon the Pandaria quest and log out.

Well, I try to log out. My game hangs. It’s been doing that irregularly for the past couple of weeks. It just hangs when I try to log out. No exceptional CPU or memory numbers; it just hangs the game. I End Task and start again. This does nothing for my confidence.

I Abandon the starter Pandaria quest, talk to Chromie, ask her to return to present timeline. No change at the Keep.

There HAS to be a way to get back to Behsten.

Enough for now…

 


 

Thank you for the further testing there. I had just created a new Alliance character two days ago that started in Exile’s Reach and I ran him through the full tutorial (Stormwind part, included, so I accepted the “Welcome to Stormwind” quest, rather than skip that part). I haven’t tested the new character fully to see if going through the full BFA campaign might work, but I did take him far enough through that one to unlock teleportation to and from Boralus. In the past, that had been enough to fix the phasing that occurred in the Keep that caused these completely unrelated NPCs to go missing.

I had submitted another bug report for this, too, but had pointed to the removal of “An Urgent Meeting” being the cause. It still may be, but, just for our sanity’s sake, I’m wondering if it might be possible to start a new character in Exile’s Reach, work through the tutorial up through entering Stormwind, but then completely skip the “Welcome to Stormwind” part? I’m meaning would skipping that part completely cause the phasing bug not to occur? Still hoping that the devs can look into it, but, in the meantime, would this be a workaround for not having a new character getting completely stuck here?

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I realize that using Chromie will scale some of the content further, but the first three expansions, at least, all cap at 30th level by default.

All of the expansions will cap at 70 IF they are accessed through Chromie. You have to speak with them to select which expansion you want to play through. Only that expansion will scale to level 70. You still might not be able to finish all quests, especially in East Kingdom/Kalimdor, before 70, but the rest should get you fairly far.

Mobs in EK/Kalimdor top out at 30 (except the Cata zones) and there are a LOT of quests in EK/Kal - more than any of the expansions - especially when you consider both Alliance and Horde sides. so I don’t even know how many characters you would need to cover all of those while still getting XP.

Ofc, your characters would stop getting XP at … 33? 35? as the quests and mobs go grey., so it might not be so bad to continue with them.

 


 

On with the saga…

BTW, Mannad, I am way past doing this to help you. You have found your way around anyhow. I actually want to find an answer to the disappearance of Behsten, and it is INFURIATING.

Continuing The Search for Behsten

I had dropped all quests. Having taken the quest for DF, I completed the opening two quests and didn’t take the third from Wrathion’s coffee-klatsch.

My quest log is blank.

Some Wowhead comments suggest thet solution is in BfA. Certainly, the gathering at the Throne suggests that.

I went to Chromie and asked for BfA.

Back at the Keep, I met with Anduin, Jaina, Shaw im a side room, saw the vision of the fleet. Took the quest to meet Jaina in the harbour.

Went to Goldshire and logged out. Waited 15 minutes. No change at the Keep.

Took the skip from Jaina at the docks. (I really didn’t want to go through the jailbreak sequence AGAIN).

Took the tour from Taelia. Met Cyrus. Handed in The Old Knight. OK, so, story-wise, Jaina and Genn and Shaw are now in Boralus. I completed and handed in Sanctum of the Sages to create the portal to Stormwind.

Back in Stormwind, Jaina and Genn and Shaw are still standing round the throne. No Behsten. I do the 15 minute thing again. No good.

Back to Boralus, I complete the quest in the Harbormaster’s Office, take Tiragarde Sound (which was the only zone quest available to me … odd - is that a new change? if so, why?) and hand in The Ashvane Trading Company.

I log out. Or try to. Again, End Task. /sigh

And as I wait my 15 minutes, it occurs to me to wonder WHY Behsten is phased out for the BfA intro. There is no reason for it.

BTW the 15 minutes thing is because the game keeps your context for a while after you log out or disconnect. This is good if you disconnect during a fight or instance, because it lets you continue where you left off, and not be sent back to the start.

So much for BfA, at least for now. I have completed the intro, and it doesn’t change a thing.

OK, I’ll try Dragonflight. Back to Chromie, pick up DF timeline. Gather expedition, take ship from docks, arrive at Wild Coast.

Notice that I also need The Obsidian Warders quest. Why did Chromie …UNFGGGHR!

/sigh

OK, back to Stormwind. Back to the accursed quest To The Dragon Isles!, where the badness started. Ya na kadishtu nilgh’ri Y’ai 'ng’ngah

OK, I have worked my way back to Wingrest, rescued the explorers. met Sendrax. Do the 15 minutes thing.

No change.

I ask Chromie to return me to current timeline. No change. I am now 15. No quests. Log out. I will try again at some point.

 


 

It occurs to me to check that I didn’t miss something in Boralus, so back I go.

The map still doesn’t offer me another zone, which is still odd.

“Risky” Liz wants me to chase pelts in Haverford, and Overspark wants to hunt for Atlantis Mechagon (Really??). No other quests. Nothing for me on the Ship. No WQ, because I don’t have the Heart, ofc.

Hmmm … the portal to Silithus is there. So I pop through, but neither Magni nor anyone else has anything for me.

If you are still interested, check Stormwind Keep again.

It appears that with the new patch, they have introduced a bug that doesn’t allow people to start Dragonflight.

Which is very bad, but the silver lining for you is that when I bring my test character to Stormwind Keep, Behsten is now there and ready to lock my XP.

So you should be able to do it now.

Thank you for the update. I hadn’t checked back with a couple of characters that were stuck here. I’ll have to see if the bug was fixed now for any characters that might have started in Exile Reach. Pretty trivial matter, I suppose, but outside of the hunter charming the named bear, perhaps, is there anything really unique that any new characters can permanently miss out on by not starting out in Exile’s Reach? The newbie items sets and such all appear to have alternatives with identical cosmetics. I’ve run through the tutorial now with enough characters that I’m pretty sure that I’ve collected all of the cosmetics available.

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Just the cosmetics. And you’ve got those.

I don’t like Exile’s Reach. At all. I think it’s a really bad zone, cheaply done with graphic assets scavenged from Warlords of Draenor, so I call it Cardboard Island. It DOES provide very specific starter lessons to players, and that’s its purpose, but going through there twice is at least one times too many.

The real downside of going there first is that you miss out on the introduction and feeling of your race. This matters more or less depending on the race, I suppose, but for many races, their starter zone and backstory sets you up with a sense of your character for the whole game. For me, I can immediately think of several races that greatly influenced how I think of my characters, especially Night Elf, Blood Elf, Tauren, Undead. Humans are pretty much humans, but Westfall (second zone for hiumans) set up a contrast to Stormwind and Ellwyn. And many of the other races are really NOT Human. The Goblin starting area is a hoot! though I’d hate for a truly new player to start there and think the rest ofthe game was like that. :rofl:

So I would suggest that if you have any characters under 30 that started off in Exile’s Reach, that you might take them to their race’s starting area to get some feel for their background.

I have enjoyed playing different timelines on different characters. But, as a story-driven player, it’s a TON of lore to take in. I always feel pulled to play the latest expansion but, there is sooo much to do in all I missed!

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