The whole don’t rez and don’t try notion has worked really well in classic in getting everyone to not try/afk/basically win trading for fast games.
The idea of denying them HK and honor is dumb; for one it doesn’t matter to us the honor they get. Second of all this is exactly what they want, 6-7min stomps.
If pugs actually stopped giving up instantly they see a helmet and delayed games more, you’d win more games. As a solo queuer your HPH will always suck, might as well bring down the premades as well.
It doesn’t go for both sides, getting GY camped for 20 minutes or however long a premades wants to is not fun. I’d rather end the game quick and roll the dice on not getting a premade in the next game.
I’d rather get a 20 hks in a 4-1 AB loss that takes 12 minutes than get 5-0 capped in 5 minutes and get lucky to get 4 hks. Pugs are hard to coordinate against premades though. And more often than not, trying to disrupt a premade doesn’t do anything except feed the other team a little more honor.
I pugged a bit of WSG last night with my alliance alt. In the first game, it was against a premade and we tried and we got one cap at least, we almost got two but they repicked pretty well. The next game was against another premade that wasn’t very good but most of the team just sat in the middle farming kills. When a mage did bring the flag all the way back to the base he was told to drop it so the game could end.
A lot of the times against a premade the pug will just get camped at the GY or otherwise but sometimes you can get real games. Not every premade is all that great, so I agree with you.
WSG has no match timer. A premade can farm the GY indefinitely, literally with no time restrictions whatsoever, before deciding to end the game with flag caps. Players stop rezzing to force a match end.
I agree that, for WSG, once a graveyard gets camped like this you may as well stop rezzing.
For the most part, a PUG can decide at the start to try playing or just farm kills (in the flag room, etc) and go from there. If the premade doesn’t look great the pug might as well try IMO.
My premades would sometimes try to bait them out by leaving the graveyard temporarily or camping them from the bottom so they would rez more and give us more kills, because most of the time when a graveyard is camped they stop rezzing as they should.
I don’t feed an enemy premade more honor than they deserve. That just helps to inflate honor on their side and hurt everyone else that solo queues. One of your points is that we don’t compete with them… that’s true, but the rest of their faction still does, and you’re making it harder for them by feeding their premades. I’m sympathetic to alliance solo queues since they are in the same boat as us. I’m not sympathetic to the selfish premades that want to max every week and not share a single drop of honor.
Also, we want to get to the next normal match sooner, not spend more time being camped at the graveyard. If everyone stops reviving, then they have no one to farm, and will have to end the match. If you keep reviving, they’ll sit on the third flag cap for 10m just murdering everyone that spawns. Blizzard should have given us an honorless buff in BGs to prevent this. But they didn’t. So premades just farm the graveyard and kill ya the second you pop. No thanks.
This is another reason I prefer AB. If they 5 cap, the match ends quickly. if they don’t 5cap, then you get bonus honor from reaching 400p before it’s over. This is a win/win. WSG however is a lose/lose because they’ll never let you cap a flag.
They’ll extend the game to farm GY until the honor DR catches up while their druid is running the flag. It’s better HPH for them to farm until about 60% diminishing return on the honor per kill.
Even then, what you said is also true. They’ll do it just to do it and ruin the PuGs time that much more.
The worst they’ll extend is that they wont try as hard to run the flag ASAP since it saves maybe a minute or two to pop rocketboots/trinkets/swiftness pots etc, maybe a slower class will run the flag so the druid can pick up some HKs.
They’ll still run the flag the entire game, which is absolutely not extending the game, it’s just the minimum time it takes for the game to end.
Unless they’re being toxic, in which case not rezzing isn’t going to stop them since the goal is probably making you /afk.
Premades want games to be as fast as possible believe it or not. They’re not trying to grief you…they’re trying to fill an honor-quota. The best way to piss them off would be to slow them down, but giving-up and ghosting them isn’t “showing them.” When you do that you’re giving them exactly what they want, their bonus honor and the next game to queue up for.
They have plenty of incentive if the other team is rezzing. Most premades don’t want to fight other premades so if they can sit there getting a nice chunk of free honor every 30 seconds they will.
Just like how pugs have every reason to end the game quick so they can get another roll of the dice at not being matched against a premade. Premades have the opposite incentive, it’s to their advantage to not leave a game against a pug if they’re being rewarded for staying in it by GY farming until diminishing returns kicks in.
A premade that is GY farming in even WSG is getting what? a couple hundred honor every 30 seconds before diminishing returns kick in? That’s a hell of an incentive to do so and not have to risk fighting another premade.
It takes about 7 minutes to run the flags, that’s about 6-7 kills per player without extending.
You get ~440 honor for a full team wipe. Extending the game will give you the 30% 20% 10% values assuming they are rezzing completely each time. Or 200 honor for 2 minutes. And that assuming you are farming 10 fresh players.
I’ve run into a couple premades that are toxic, but mostly graveyard pressure is used to control the pace of the game – as in make it go faster. The only issue is that the losing team has zero control over the end of the game in WSG. They have to wait for the final cap. Ghosting removes a distraction from finishing up and moving on. There is no reason to ghost in AB. Put your boots on people and fight.
That said, Ally, you give up way too easily. At least make a go of it. I pug and I premade and I just can’t think of a time when the Horde didn’t give us a try.