The OP wants to play tank. Other hero pally comes in and says “YOU CAN DO IT”, but then says, “you’re not a tank, you’re a healer”.
Is this satisfying to the OP? Do you just like selecting an unpopular build, and will do whatever it takes to make it work…? Or do you actually want to BE A TANK? The advice you’re getting will not help you succeed as a tank, only as a healer in the spec called “Protection”.
If this is appealing, I guess I’m curious what exactly about selecting the “Protection” spec is important to you. Do you want to be a contrarian? Do you find the specific abilities on offer just suit your playstyle? I really can’t think of any other options.
i do nothing but randoms and i do fine hard to kill dont do much damage. we have a good toolkit to keep healers locked down cant kill them but we can keep them busy. just dont expect to be top damage or have the most kb’s
Are people who enjoy the in depth 5 head gameplay. Well at least it was in the old expansions. They really need to revamp tank design in DF.
They increased damage taken because double healer/tank or double tank/healer in Arena. Eventually they just stopped that from Queing. All Tank balance is a result of the mini game of Arena which is the least important part of PvP. They really need to keep Arena balance separate from the rest of PvP. There should be no PvP auras in WPvP either.
PvP should always be balanced around objective PvP and large scale battles. RBGs etc
I know someone’s going to come out and say they did but it’s not true. No double heeler tank was pushing any rating. It was nothing more than a troll comp.
Because they adjusted damage tanks take the season after when people were standing by graveyards for almost 10 minutes. Waiting for stacks to get up before they can even do a team fight.
To me that makes way more sense. People were posting on forums talking about how terrible it was to get a CTF map.
I will clear up the 50% Damage increase AND the 20% longer saps / stuns.
The first being added because end game of legion and through most of BFA up to the damage add, tanks also had the benefit of HUGE damge absorb through the “personal shield” everyone was taking from the Magnum Opus and later on the Azerite traits, and now similarly the Fleshcrafting from SL. Tanks with damage absorb = bad.
Which is equally ironic because the damage absord personal shield was put in place because the games damage scaling was all over the place despite some efforts to reign it in. SO 50% more damage to the spec’s (at the time) with the most health. That has been made close to a non-issue in SL PVP. I’ve only seen a handful of other players non-buffed at 100k hp in pvp, everyone else seems to linger around the 65k to 88k range as far as HP goes. Which makes the +50% damage taken over kill on a tank (except druids who can still HoT and trinket their way through anything)
With that in place it doesn’t take a whole lot of class skill to kill a tank still, time the shots, stuns, and it’s over in less than a minute.
Which brings me to stuns. 20% or 30% whatever its at now, was implemented to slow down the tanks self healing or force them to burn critical CD’s like LoH or major damage mitigation early. After than it’s just stun-lock central especially with more than one rogue around. Which brings me to point out that being extra prone to taking a lot of damage this forcing CD’s on major abilities isn’t really necessary, it’s compounded overkill, situationally.
I don’t want tanks to be so hard to kill 1v1 or even 1v5 that it’s not fun. Done a fair amount of that against druids in BFA and SL and it’s stupid. There’s a balance to be had and I think its with barrowed powers like personal shields / uber damage absorb removed from PvP unless its an actual class ability, which usually have long CD’s to balance out.
Second edge of that is I think healing collectively in PvP needs a nerf as a whole to slow PvP down just a little and force players to choose more tactical methods, as well as just cut down reliance on support like that as much. Because there’s A LOT of reliance on heals in PvP and I think it’s been fairly skewed like that for quite a while.
There’s a lot of dynamics in play with why Prot specs have gotten shoved into the mud so hard, but I believe its ultimately come from unwillingness to compromise, from developers wanting to keep certain game mechanics in play without actually having to put effort into thinking.
Tanks are great for epics, because they can lock down larger groups of players and spin flags. Everyone knows people are attracted to hitting tanks like flies to cow dung.
Ok but that isn’t the case anymore is it! One Dps can kill a Tank in the opener or 1 shot them. Tanks are often squisher than some Dps because while they increased Tank damage taken to an extreme amount they also nerfed Tanks passive damage reduction.
So since Tank design has changed this increase isn’t warranted anymore. When I play a Tank I don’t even bother picking up the flag… why would I? Let a Tanky Dps do it that doesn’t have the penalty.
Now if they want to bring back passive damage mitigation again and Tank Honor talents that reduced damage passively okay. However as it is the game has changed and it no longer works. Dps have way to much burst now and taking 50% increase doesn’t work anymore. Dps can just spec Tanky and fill that role which is a shame.
So the extra damage taken needs to be reversed so PvP can flourish. Lets actually have class roles again someday in retail. Not sure if DF can fix PvP if not at least we still have the old expansions where PvP was at it’s pinnacle.
Edit - I miss the old Honor talents and for reference these were removed in BFA that were really helpful for Tanks in PvP.
Hardiness : While above 80% health, you take 20% less damage.
Softened Blows : Any non-periodic attack that deals damage less than 10% of your maximum health is reduced by 20%.
So as we can see since these were removed the increase damage taken needs to be removed.
Well a lot of people on this forum would disagree with you. There are tons of tanks who will still say they are hard to kill. People still pick up tanks for RBGs instead of just running another DPS.
No. No they’re not, not in any scope of balance are they in a “correct” spot. Tanks are supposed to be a tough kill, hence TANK. Not forced into support healing, or DPS. They should be thick damage sponges for running objectives or holding capture points, and hit hard enough to give team time to support them with healing / kills.
For a fairly long run of WoW that is how it worked. Till barrowed powers started screwing that up and people started complaining a tank spec player was wiping the field in honor kills because they found a way to cheese doing absurd amounts of damage while also having a HP pool too large for the damage tables of DPS.
As it sits NOW, tank specs are extremely fragile bubbles that pop at the slightest breath. Which is wrong and not balanced.
If you’re one of those players who didn’t like how the dynamic worked before, WoW wasn’t a game for you. But times change and people want a quicker game. Fine, but there’s still ways to balance the game without breaking spec dynamics or relying on ridiculous damage absorb mechanics via Personal Shields, or giving one specialization a 50% damage debuff without increasing their health pool to keep PvP -playable-.
There’s a whole bunch of twisted mechanics convoluting what someone thinks PvP in WoW should be and it doesn’t even fit how it works in other RPG titles, not even remotely.
I don’t think the game should roll back to a ‘boring’ way of playing the game like it used to be. I think its fine to evolve game mechanics but it needs to be kept balanced. Getting sneezed on by an equally geared DPS class and losing just because of spec, is not balance.
If that is happening right now to a tank, l2p issue.
Tanks just want to be able to tank 4+ players and think they should be able to survive for 30+ seconds.
That is bad gameplay. It would be the moment someone caps a node they can’t lose it. Just leave a tank and a heeler add a node and it’s defended all game.
Even in a CTF I have not seen this season. A tank flopping over from one DPS. The issue is people who come here complaining saying that it is happening. When majority of people know it’s not true. Even the devs aren’t going to take it serious
Because it is. Pick up the class and do it yourself, gearings quick right now.
What game are you playing? Overwatch? Counter-Strike? Apex Legends? This is WoW, there are class mechanics. Throwing them out because it’s not “fast enough” means this isn’t the game for you. Go play a game with a faster game loop and mechanics that are geared for low attention spans / lower skill gates.
People who don’t play Tanks. Which are people that have no idea and don’t get a vote on the matter. So their opinion is irrelevant.
You are completely wrong! If Tanks were in a good spot right now there would be good representation which we don’t have. If their design was correct people like myself would be subbed and playing instead of quitting.
Tanks were in a great spot in WotLK and have gotten worse every expansion since then with wrong direction in nerfs and design.
I’ve mained Prot PvP since day 1 of playing WoW when I started in TBC and can tell you they are in the worst spot in history and need to be buffed and fixed.
Representation doesn’t mean anything. People flock to what is the number one spec all the time.
I mean, are you honestly going to argue that arms warrior is not viable? They don’t even make up 3% of the ladder.
You cannot go off representation as a valid argument. Because if you understand the player base they always go to what is overpowered for easier pushing.
I mean just what are people who play tank in arena? Looking for? The class fantasy is your hard to kill. So if you take what everyone else is arguing that is a tank they want to be able to tank multiple characters. If two DPS are on you, you should not be able to die.
Now in arena you have a healer and a second class. So the game should just forfeit because the tank is never going to die?
Or is it going to be an automatic 15 minute match waiting on dampening? The player base already spoke out. They don’t want arenas that long. They get extremely boring.
Let’s be real people who play tanks in PvP do it because they like the idea they are hard to kill. Tanking has always been brain dead easy. This just makes up for not being able to survive as another class. These are probably the same people who would play a warlock and just stand in the middle of the arena. Trying to freecast and complaining they can’t get anything off.
I am playing the same game you are. In RBG’s, I am not finding a tank picking up a flag and one DPS turning around and killing him. I’m not even seeing two DPS being able to pull that off. Maybe these are more competent players. So you can argue that it’s happening but at a decent level with competent players, it’s not.
Or maybe the game’s not for you. This is how the game is right now and you’re the one complaining about it. You’re saying this is not how it’s supposed to be but apparently to the devs and a lot of other players. It is fine. So it sounds like you are playing the wrong game, not everyone else.
That’s just as childish as you can get. “You’re wrong because I disagree”.
If played this game as long as you say you have. Then you should remember most of the changes and reasons behind it.
Majority of the people one of the changes which is why it happened. You can use the dumb excuse that’s why people are quitting .
Yes, people are quitting this game because a tank spec isn’t OP in PVP.
People do not play them because they are not fun and PVP because of their role. Very few people will find that type of gameplay fun.
That’s why you have people inventing new roles saying they are “disruptors”. Pretty much every single speck in class in this game is a disruptor .
If you don’t like your role, then do something else or move on to a different game. As you said, this game is not meant for you just by the history of the changes and what people wanted.
That’s just as childish as you can get. “You’re wrong because I disagree”.