Source of RMT gold - Players buying materials from bots

[Bloomsday-sulfuras]

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

But bots dont go away and the gold supply that currently exists doesnt go away either.

Both will be reduced greatly without GDKPs around.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

So when everything settles people will still pay bots for gold

They will have less incentive to do so as they will require less gold.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

If the demand for gold goes down inflation slows and those items the bot is vendoring for a static price? Those are worth more for longer. And when inflation picks up they can just farm materials to sell to players. It doeant fundamentally change anything besides inflation rate (because in a gdkp world they farm raw gold for longer, but not forever).

Nothing written here makes any sense.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

The same players buying gold will buy less gold for a higher price.

The worst case scenario here is that people buy about $20 worth of gold every few weeks or so to cover the costs of consumes. Now lets compare that to the hundreds of dollars worth people spend weekly buying gold for GDKPs.

Which scenario do yo think would make for a better game?

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

And before you say the price is trending down, it always trends down because of inflation (even without bots boosting it). But it is actually higher today than before the announcement

[Bloomsday-sulfuras]

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

And before you say the price is trending down, it always trends down because of inflation (even without bots boosting it). But it is actually higher today

I have no idea what you’re trying to communicate here.

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

The worst case scenario here is that people buy about $20 worth of gold every few weeks or so to cover the costs of consumes. Now lets compare that to the hundreds of dollars worth people spend weekly buying gold for GDKPs.

The number of people spending $20 every few weeks in your example (not that I agree with the numbers) will be an order of magnitude higher than the people spending hundreds of dollars weekly, LOL what? You clearly dont gdkp and only see the reddit posts about epic gold pots.

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

Checking out for the night.

[Jarnock-moon-guard]

Bro just use a loot system other than GDKP. Use Regular DKP, or something.

The world isn’t ending just because you can’t buy BiS raid gear anymore.

[Bloomsday-sulfuras]

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

The number of people spending $20 every few weeks in your example (not that I agree with the numbers) will be an order of magnitude higher than the people spending hundreds of dollars weekly

How do you know? Do you really think people are buying gold illegally to buy consumables for their weekly BFD run?

Even if I granted you this, what would be your point? You are not communicating it well at all.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

Checking out for the night

Probably for the best. The reality here is that you do not have a solid grasp of basic economics including supply, demand, and inflation. A productive conversation about the benefits of restricting GDKP is therefore difficult to have. Nonetheless, Blizzard has made their decision and something tells me that your feedback isn’t going to sway them.

[Oblivinaties-mankrik]

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

This is yet another fallacious false equivalency. The reason you immediately pivot to these types of responses is due to the lack of logic behind your stance. You are not able to defend your stance at all, which is why Blizzard went the direction they did.

blizzard didnt give us a chance to defend ourselves actually

[Moosë-benediction]

2 hours, later, still replying in other threads

remember, gdkp still banned on the 8th, and your 4 day menty b over it changed nothing.

[Bloomsday-sulfuras]

@Oblivinaties-mankrik

blizzard didnt give us a chance to defend ourselves

Except people have been criticizing GDKPs for years now. You’ve had the entire time to defend yourself. You weren’t able to do so. That’s not due to lack of opportunity, that’s lack of capability.

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

Do you really think people are buying gold illegally to buy consumables for their weekly BFD run?

No, just like they arent hundreds a week.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

Even if I granted you this, what would be your point? You are not communicating it well at all.

The point is you dont need whales buying hundreds of dollars of gold a week to sell gold. You are acting confused, but it is your line of questioning that got us here.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

Checking out for the night

Probably for the best. The reality here is that you do not have a solid grasp of basic economics including supply, demand, and inflation. A productive conversation about the benefits of restricting GDKP is therefore difficult to have. Nonetheless, Blizzard has made their decision and something tells me that your feedback isn’t going to sway them.

So far you’ve suggested that unlimited gold will somehow not result in runaway inflation and earlier you used the argument that economic principles dont apply to a video game, but yet somehow are simultaneously critisizing me for a lack of understanding of the same principles. And you failed to resoond with any content in this personal jab.

You are arguing in bad faith and it shows. If you care to actually respond to my last post let me know.

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

@Moosë-benediction

2 hours, later, still replying in other threads

Are you stalking me now? Creepy dude

[Ziryus-pagle]

It’s going to be super amusing when none of the prices on the AH change and the people whining about inflation can’t blame GDKP.

[Moosë-benediction]

if you reply on a thread, you get a notification whenever anyone posts in it

im sorry if it bothers you i have just as much time and energy to keep hammering you about your pathetic cope as you do to keep posting ridiculous pro rmt loot system BS.

[Bloomsday-sulfuras]

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

No, just like they arent hundreds a week.

Well Blizzard, the people with the numbers and data, disagree with you there.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

The point is you dont need whales buying hundreds of dollars of gold a week to sell gold.

Ok? Not a single person has ever suggested otherwise. People have only said that restricting GDKPs will make it so whales have less incentive to buy gold.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

You are acting confused, but it is your line of questioning that got us here.

Yes, your strawmans and inability to keep up with arguments is confusing. My line of question did not lead us here, your reliance on fallacious logic did.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

So far you’ve suggested that unlimited gold will somehow not result in runaway inflation and earlier you used the argument that economic principles dont apply to a video game, but yet somehow are simultaneously critisizing me for a lack of understanding of the same principles.

Can you quote any of this happening? Did any of this happen in this thread? With me?

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

And you failed to resoond with any content in this personal jab.

1. Not a personal jab
2. It’s a summary of what this discussion has been so far and why you have failed to convince me, others, and blizzard.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

If you care to actually respond to my last post let me know.

I’ve responded to every post you’ve replied to me with.

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

No, just like they arent hundreds a week.

Well Blizzard, the people with the numbers and data, disagree with you there.

No data was shared, what are you talking about?

No one is spending hundreds a week on gold in SoD. There would be no point. Even $100 is more than enough to buy everything for the entire phase.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

The point is you dont need whales buying hundreds of dollars of gold a week to sell gold.

Ok? Not a single person has ever suggested otherwise. People have only said that restricting GDKPs will make it so whales have less incentive to buy gold.

You suggested it when you said removing gdkp removes the demand for gold. You’ve said it again here and I’m pointing out that you don’t need whales to have a demand for gold and in fact with gdkp gone a new market of folks that previously had gdkp income opens up.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

The worst case scenario here is that people buy about $20 worth of gold every few weeks or so to cover the costs of consumes. Now lets compare that to the hundreds of dollars worth people spend weekly buying gold for GDKPs.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

You are acting confused, but it is your line of questioning that got us here.

Yes, your strawmans and inability to keep up with arguments is confusing. My line of question did not lead us here, your reliance on fallacious logic did.

Nice try but it is your scenario that you invented when confronted with the idea that players would buy less gold for a higher price (due to slowed inflation) and not necessarily impact bot profits.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

• Not a personal jab
• It’s a summary of what this discussion has been so far and why you have failed to convince me, others, and blizzard.

Bad faith argument and you know it. Attack the person and not the idea = personal jab

[Moosë-benediction]

you don’t need whales to have a demand for gold

i know a dude personally who spent $20k+ over the course of vanilla gearing out like 5 toons, meanwhile someone buying consumes would maybe spend 50-100 dollars a month max. so you cant tell me people who want to buy gear dont buy more gold. They do, ive seen it first hand

this is one of the reasons i am so virulently against GDKP, i have personally seen how much money/gold just one big whale can pump into the system through them, let alone the tons we have now.

[Bloomsday-sulfuras]

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

No data was shared, what are you talking about?

Blizzard looks at data and feedback when making decisions like this? Do you think they just came up with this idea from nothing?

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

No one is spending hundreds a week on gold in SoD.

1. How would you know?
2. Maybe not now, but what about in the future? We’re still in phase one.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

Even $100 is more than enough to buy everything for the entire phase.

I’m curious to know how you would know that.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

You suggested it when you said removing gdkp removes the demand for gold.

I never said removing GDKP removes the demand for gold. This is you failing to read. I’ve only ever said it REDUCES the demand for gold. That’s because it does.

This is an example of you strawmanning. You have invented an argument and position for me that I didn’t make myself so you can make a point against an argument no one made. Obviously people will still need gold for things even without GDKP. The different that you are incapable of understanding is that they need considerably less gold.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

Nice try but it is your scenario that you invented when confronted with the idea that players would buy less gold for a higher price (due to slowed inflation) and not necessarily impact bot profits.

I’m not sure what this is in response to but it is clear to me that you don’t know what inflation means and why it happens.

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

Bad faith argument and you know it. Attack the person and not the idea

You were not attacked. Your ideas lack of understanding of basic economic concepts was.

@Oblivinaties-mankrik

(post deleted by author)

Please only respond on one character Bergelmir.

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

Blizzard looks at data and feedback when making decisions like this? Do you think they just came up with this idea from nothing?

Youre making an argument and using data neither of us have seen to say that blizzard’s data supports your claim.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

I’m curious to know how you would know that.

Im tracking gold prices ever since the draconian policy was announced

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

I never said removing GDKP removes the demand for gold. This is you failing to read. I’ve only ever said it REDUCES the demand for gold. That’s because it does.

This is an example of you strawmanning. You have invented an argument and position for me that I didn’t make myself so you can make a point against an argument no one made. Obviously people will still need gold for things even without GDKP. The different that you are incapable of understanding is that they need considerably less gold.

You literally said that billions of gold could be produced because without gdkp there would be no reason to buy it. Nice desperate bad faith attenpt to spin it tho.

@Bloomsday-sulfuras

@Bergelmir-fairbanks

Nice try but it is your scenario that you invented when confronted with the idea that players would buy less gold for a higher price (due to slowed inflation) and not necessarily impact bot profits.

I’m not sure what this is in response to but it is clear to me that you don’t know what inflation means and why it happens.

Convenient you forgot what your position was and somehow that mean im confused about mine.

[Bergelmir-fairbanks]

@Moosë-benediction

i know a dude personally who spent $20k+ over the course of vanilla gearing out like 5 toons, meanwhile someone buying consumes would maybe spend 50-100 dollars a month max. so you cant tell me people who want to buy gear dont buy more gold. They do, ive seen it first hand

I didnt say that, I said they will still buy gold. And even if they stop completely (a ridiculous claim) this policy strips MANY people of an income stream (running GDKPs) and now they’ll consider buying gold to replace this income.

You’re talking about a tiny, tiny fraction of the players (close to 0) and I’m talking about a typical player that runs gdkp because they dont enjoy farming. Bot farmers would gladly sell to a larger audience versus chasing a mythical $20k whale they will probably never find, especially in sod.