Sorta Kinda like the No Changes

WoW Classic WoW Classic General Discussion
25

What exactly do you think a Paladin in a raid that’s 17/16/16 is going to do given that each tree is designed around performing a different role?

Some of what you’re talking about isn’t just changes to the Vanilla formula, it’s completely gutting the system and making a brand new game out of it. You wouldn’t even be able to accomplish some of the thing you want under the current Vanilla formula just due to how things work.

It entirely defeats the purpose of Classic, even in the context of “Classic, but with a few tweaks”.

Plus given that Blizzard can’t make every spec in BfA feel unique while also being good at both PvP and PvE and not have garbage talents, I’m not sure why we should ever think that they could do it in Classic when you’re also asking for hybrid specs to do the same thing.

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26

personal experiences> not true

well, that conversation ended quickly. such a shame too.

you clearly dont want a debate or rebuttal, factual or not. by personal experience or not. so i will leave you to talk to a wall. <3
just nods, telling them they are right as they walk away

just to add; its memes like this, that create the illusion of what viable means or what it doesnt mean. bm has always over shadowed the majority of other classes, even its other spec’s. if this was never the case, it would not be the ONLY spec that gets nerfed 99% of the time. by whiners who have no clue how to play against a bm. its even more hilarious when you find that a lot of them are even whines about bm being top when it comes to dps- in RAIDING. in their own groups. if you want to see bm as a meme, a joke, more power to you but dont think for a moment that your lack of humor can be forced as a meta.

MM> has never once been nerfed> ‘viable’
Surv> has never once been nerfed> simple class redesign/change> ‘viable’
BM> nerfed every 5 seconds> class redesign/change> ‘never viable, even before any of this happened’.

:rofl:

27

No. No changes. If you want a bastardized version of it, you and the people like you can campaign and beg blizzard for 8 years like we did to get classic announced. But you can not have our project. Its not for you. Its for us.

So go campaign in general for your… vanilla++ or whatever it is you are describing. But its not welcome here.

28

It’s not a joke, it just wasn’t a pve spec.

It was sub-optimal for 5mans because at 31/20/0 it impacted your CC ability. Again, not bad, just sub-optimal.

As for raids, look, I gave you concrete reasons why it didn’t work on raids. I don’t know what else I can tell ya. I raided as both a hunter, and a healer.

  1. Targeting pets, or even seeing their health, was difficult if the hunter was not in your party. I never saw raid frames that made pet targeting easy, certainly not any I ever used on my Druid.

  2. In the event that healers had raid frames that allowed them to see your pet, your pet is the lowest possible priority for heals.

  3. Pets couldn’t get resists high enough to survive aoes in vanilla and the pet abilities to mitigate AoE damage didn’t yet exist.

  4. Mend pet in vanilla was a channeled spell, with a short range, didn’t heal much, and didn’t do it quickly, and was rather expensive.
    (480 mana for 225/s over 5s 20yd range)

  5. Many bosses cleaved. A slight turn of the mob by the tank meant your pet either got one shot, or you had to call him off move yourself and then send your pet again. You could mitigate the amount of time you’d have lost by standing at 8 meters, but that brings us to…

  6. Most bosses had AoEs of some kind, a lot of them were avoidable at max range, so, as a ranged class, you would have been expected to stay there.

Could a BM hunter beat a Marks hunter on a fight with no AoE? Sure, all things being equal, that could happen. But in a typical fight, you’re either ressing your pet constantly and losing a bunch of dps or you’re constantly repositioning, healing, and calling back your pet and losing a bunch of dps.

29

Except uh, we have had people ask for stuff like flying and LFR, so it isn’t hyperbole.
As for the rest of your changes your basically talking about a whole new game in general. That is not the goal of classic.
If I wanted a new game i would wait for saga of Lucimia or pantheon.

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30

A blatant lie. On good days, Pets will be 10% of a 20/31/0 hunter’s DPS. You could push that to 20% if you went 31/20/0 and had perfect conditions (no cleaves, little to no AOE) but going full BM would hurt your overall DPS hard and hurt your raid’s DPS (bye bye Trueshot Aura for melees). You’d have to be either naked or AFK meleeing the boss for your pet to do 50% of your total damage.

Another blatant lie. Most people never bothered with having pets out in raids back then, let alone speccing BM.

Come on now. At least the other guy has points and actual experience while you argue from “muh feelings” and that one time you got carried through a raid as a BM hunter.

BM is terrible in raids for many reasons, some of which were listed by the other poster.

  • Pets scale from levels alone. A fresh lvl 60’s pet and a full T3’s pet will have the exact same stats aside from the 50AP bonus from the T3 set bonus. This alone makes BM atrocious for DPS as BM.
  • Pet AI/pathing is usually atrocious. Using Dash in melee range, pathing inside cleave radius. At least it looks like this was mostly fixed in the demo.
  • Pets are weak as hell. A few ticks of an AoE or 1-2 cleaves from a boss/mob and they’re dead. It’s not too bad on fights where you have only frontal cleaves or rain of fires but it’s nearly impossible to keep them alive in fights with melee aoe or regular raidwide damage.
  • Practically no healers heal pets.
  • Again on the scaling, BM’s talents buffs this static pet while MM’s talents buff your overall damage which scales with your gear. It’s a no-brainer finding out what’s better.

It’s one thing to be misinformed, it’s another to say blatant lies that might leave some starry-eyed newbies thinking BM is viable in raids, let alone twice as good as MM. They’re in for a rude awakening. It’s not the first time you’re spreading misinformation either.

31

should look up the term Viable.

i can sit here and list MANY things (most of which pro balance players complain about) where every class and spec does not preform exactly like everything else (aka homogenization) but why would i do that?

because i dont care. my ability to play my class and spec, my ability to destroy people in pvp and my skill when it comes to getting things done (mechanics)- has nothing to do with your opinion, nor any meme or joke.
the asinine, wet pups is what got us retail to start with. so what if i have to work a little harder than someone else- i dont see the problem.

but as i said in my other post- this conversation ended when you told me that my personal experiences were not true/never happened. and i have nothing left to say on the meta argument, either.

ps; how did your rant about absolutely nothing, turn into a full on educational course on how to raid? let alone as a bm? you got some problems. you should look into that.

:wave:

while im getting things done, you all can wipe over and over because of how much you are a failure and then fight back and forth about your inability to take responsibility for said failures. points over where retail is waiting

pss; since my achieves were screwed by blizzard, because i deleted my old vanilla characters (kicks self), i will gladly link what i can, to show i did raid as a bm and seem to be one of the only ones who advocate for actually KNOWING what you are doing. unlike others.

32

Dude, where have YOU been?

:cocktail:

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33

Stuck in his own delusions that melee hunters are going to be a thing in vanilla.

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34

which in turn, invalidates any complaints over in retail about survival no longer being long ranged (now being melee). just because people post in two different forums, doesnt mean their contradictive attitude is justified.

a person cant have a problem with a melee hunter and then come over here and demand people accept that a melee hunter was viable/a thing.

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35

Go play bfa. Get that trash out of here

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