It was easy, it’s just BC was announced, guilds wanted a break, needed to cut the fat to 25 etc.
My vanilla server had very few people in t1/t2 - aq20 and zg was much more the end game on that server.
So - I’m really not familiar with any of what I am seeing in classic. Pretty much every 60 is geared and has BIS items from the latest content.
Bosses hit as hard at 80 as they did at 60. Also someone did the math based on dps numbers at the time and TK had 2.5 times more effective HP or something like that. Naxx 10/25 was the MC of WotLK
Few months yea 6 months is to short of time.
and it will be cleared in classic within hours of launching by many many guilds.
remember it it also took guilds 154 days to kill Rag in vanilla… 5months!.. classic has only been out for 3 months 1st rag kill would be in another 2 months time lol.
August 26th to February 25th is only 3 months? What kind of math did you learn in school? Classic will have been out for 6 months tomorrow.
2 Likes
I’m sure there are some principles from quantum physics that was applied there. Math was never my strong suit.
I remember taking 6 hours to kill Patchwerk, downed him on a Thursday at 4am, I had to be up for work at 5am. It was at that point I decided I was done. We got about half the raid cleared, got some loot then I started a horde rogue and haven’t looked back at alliance since.
I was the first player and one of only on the server with Widows Embrace healing mace so that was cool. We got that in the first week I think. -Liq Paladin. Frostwolf, guild Release
a lot of the difficulty of original Naxx didn’t come from the bosses themselve, but from classic-era woes…
no Xfer / slow level’ing made recruitment a B****, the top 1-2 guild on every server would continuously poach from everyone below them ( willingly or not) , an issue only exacerbated at the famed 4 horsemen.
no catch-up gear also meant gearing up a new recruit could take months… your older raider would get tired of clearing BWL for the 50th time and hop to the more progressed guild… creating a neverending viscious circle.
Classic raiding is also infamous for the rather long list of consumable( and world buff) one can farm to double if not triple his performance… which burned out many raiders.
WoTLK had catchup gear ( not that it did matter since it naxx was the first tier), lvl’ing became faster, consumable were more reasonable ( and obviously some bosses were retuned, like not requiring 8 tank for 4 horsemen in a 25-man raid format…)
That being said, many mechanic of WoTLK naxx and original naxx stayed the same, and were handled the same ; WoTLK KT’s dark fissure isn’t any easier to dodge than the classic one, heigan dance is the same, thaddius polarity mechanic is the same and so on. stuff like anub rekhan DoT doing sooo much damage doesn’t really matter since you’re not supposed to get hit by it / there’s 8 healer with nothing else to do than watch you / the boss should be dead before his 2nd cast…
And this right here is telling. Most guilds today, even the more casual ones can kill Rag within a minute.
That’s enough DPS to kill Patchwerk pre-Enrage, while in Tier 1 level gear, and dungeon blues (a lot of raid BiS right now still involve random Blues)–imagine what we’ll be doing in AQ40 gear, going into Naxx.
Much, much easier. This is a good summary. Some bosses were 1/3 as difficult when scaled up to 80.
mmo-champion. com/threads/2339130-Naxxramas-60-vs-Naxxramas-80-difficulty
WotLK babies are still going to say it’s because “players were bad” or “people were on 56k dialup”
Near the end of TBC when we first heard that Naxx was going to be removed from EPL and moved to Wrath content as the first raid, I went with a 25-man raid group who had done everything but the new raid (Sunwell) and were pretty much geared to the teeth. One of the more memorable wipes is that room full of mobs getting to Heigen.
Fast-forward to us being level 80 and entering Naxx. We blew threw that, we blew threw pretty much every wing. It was a very weird feeling because it didn’t seem like it had been tuned up.
We knew the mechanics in both cases. We were the same skilled people. Our gear was actually on the pre-raid BiS end in Wrath compared to the post-raid BiS in TBC, and we were ten levels OVER rather than at level.
So I think scaling was the big flop there.
1 Like
Possibly first for the good guilds. You see what Rogues are doing right now in BWL gear? The sub-min kills of Broodlord are impressive, but the 5th highest DPS Rogue got his kill in 1:26 dealing 970.5 DPS for the fight. The cutoff for purple parsing is 741.2 DPS. So even if a Rogue is only pulling 600 sustained DPS, which would put them well into green parsing… a guild with 30 DPS averaging around 600 is going to kill Anub before or during his first cast.
AQ40 is going to just make the DPS numbers go craaaaaazy.
Iirc the biggest issue was timing heals between priest, druid and pally for hateful strike and Mana issues. The core fight itself was simple and today would be considered nothing if properly geared
Obviously Naxx will be easier than it was in Vanilla. Everything will be because the server talent pools are bigger and there are detailed strats everywhere and guilds are using a lot more DPS warriors in classic than were used in vanilla. There will also be a lot more time spent clearing AQ & BWL when Naxx releases than there was in Vanilla.
But it wont be easy like MC or as easier as BWL was, simply because talents and items wont be predating what they were for naxx content.
Naxx also takes a lot more time to clear, so unless guilds plan on clearing it over 2 days, those 2 hour world buffs will be long gone long by the end of Naxx if it is cleared in one night … making the classic trend of prebuffing less of a factor for naxx than it is in MC/BWL.
Having a bit more gear is gunna be a factor yeah, but Naxx will be at its original difficulty. While they never directly nerfed raids the 16 debuff limit, and all the class and gear reworks made the early raids significantly easier. I’m pretty sure all the class reworks were done by 1.11. Naxx will actually show how much better players are now than they were back in the day because we’re not significantly buffed going into it.
I’ll reserve judgment on the the “players are more skilled today” argument till Naxx is out. Obviously it won’t take 3 months because we know the mechanics, but if Naxx takes top guilds 2 or 3 resets I think it’s safe to say top players at the end of vanilla are roughly on par with top classic guilds now.
I still think that the biggest difference in classic - by far - is the amount of DPS warriors being used. For some reason the DPS warrior meta didn’t catch on widely enough or fast enough in vanilla… and considering they happen to be the top DPS, that’s a huge deal. In my vanilla servers top horde guild for naxx I dont think we had more than 2-3 DPS warriors … whereas in classic we have 8-10. That’s a lot of top end DPS being added, in place of warlocks and hunters and generally fewer healers (because you dont need as much healing when things die faster).
Naxx 40 in classic wow:
Cleared in an 1.5hour after release
I think it’s more the fast enough one. Dps warriors were a meme until BWL at the earliest. Most people.viewed warriors exclusively as tanks until it was too late for huge numbers of people to reroll.
I think you’re right with both healers and hunters. Hunters don’t scale well and the move further down the list as we get into later raids. However I’ll disagree with you on locks, because they have opposite problem. We’re not good now, because we don’t have spell hit, but later on locks are great. We don’t get any hit from talents like mages do. Even in BiS out of BWL we top out at 4-5% hit. Once ZG is out and warlocks can reliably get 10-12% hit we outdps non-ignite mages regularly, and in general casters scale very well in later raids. While speedrunning guilds are running 10+ dps warriors now, later on you’ll see alot more casters in those groups as their scaling ramps up.
10 man nax was really easy, lfr is harder now. lfr actually wipes a lot these days