There’s been a lot of talk about scaling, it’s impacts and all sorts of problems. As someone who’s been playing since 2003 undead Alpha, I’ve seen my fair share of problems in PvP - WoW’s current state has got me thinking about what could make PvP a bit more fun.
Here are some thoughts -
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In retail WoW: Stamina, Strength, Intellect and Agility on each item slot are the same depending on the item level. As such, when a character enters a battleground each item equipped scales to the maximum item level for that season. From a base power perspective this will “equalize” the playing field. It will also eliminate the problem with players who are grossly under powered in battlegrounds causing losses. Unique weapon/armor effects would also not work in PvP (sorry, but no. Let’s just leave it to class abilities).
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Secondary stats could become customizable. Think Diablo 2: You get a total sum of points you can allocate, then you can freely add them to Crit, Haste, Mastery, Versatility up to a designated cap, then redistribute elsewhere. As some classes are designed to work better with different secondary attributes, Blizz could design the cap differently per class (spec if necessary). This would not be done on a “per item” basis, but as something for your character as a whole. You open a PvP window and distribute points (again like in D2). You could reset them and redistribute after a match was over if you didn’t like your allocation.
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Versatility should become a “defensive” stat only and should not add to damage. This would create a choice between adding “damage” with other stats or adding “defense” with Vers. If you want to sacrifice defense for damage; that’s on you.
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Tertiary stats like Leech & Speed could become “PvP enchants” on items that only work in PvP OR you can simply distribute tertiary stat points similarly to Secondary Stats (again up to a cap).
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Trinkets would not work in PvP. We already have a wide variety of “trinket like” PvP talents anyways.
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PvP Rewards are mounts and really cool cosmetics (spell graphics, visible weapon enchants, unique PvP transmog armor, etc.)
Why these ideas?
- Make PvP more about “skill” over “power”
- This would make PvP more “alt-friendly”. No more worrying about fresh level capped players or boosted characters entering BG’s becoming free kills.
- Scaling and player power is more uniform; Blizz can control stat maximums, while also providing a feeling of “choice” via secondary stats.
- We know everyone is going to pick “the meta” and copy/paste the best stats from something they see on wowhead or icy-veins anyways, but this further balances the playing field and still makes it skill over power.
- Most importantly: You can’t “buy” pvp power. Currently, you can pay to have people run you through content to get high ilvl gear, and then jump into PvP. This would go away entirely.
Would love to hear everyone’s thoughts!
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I think there should still be gear progression, but much more streamlined and separate from PvE. As in you have gear that is absolutely BiS in PvP and you buy the stats that you want with the currency you earn over the course of the season. Basically WoD. It has worked before.
Maybe I’m thinking in casual PvP terms, but to me the idea of removing gear element completely doesn’t fit WoW. I just don’t want all the PvE craziness that has happened in BFA. But I still want some gear to earn. It gave me joy to see my alts grow in power as I was buying more and more conquest gear.
I can see how it can be a pain for competitive players, maybe ranked only can have the template system? And I admit, It was kinda nice to be able to play alts right away in Legion, but at the same time I never played them much because I already saw them at max power and I lost interest. Just as I don’t see the interest of playing a couple of quick matches in Overwatch. I need that power journey over the course of weeks.
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That’s a great point. Maybe as you “rank up”, you get to a “new bracket” of power. Allocate more points, get a higher ilvl equivalent. That way you still feel like this is a progression of power. Your skill gets you into a higher bracket.
I would love to get the tBC dispel magic back.
I like your ideas a lot, especially the leech/speed PvP enchants, but they seem kind of complicated compared to WoD’s gearing. And they don’t really address wPvP, which was a major reason why people hated the Legion system.
Also I’m worried that making Vers defensive instead of both would fall into the MoP PvP Offense/Defense trap, where more PvP Defense let you do more damage to people that stacked PvP Offense.
Fair point on World PvP, as I don’t want world PvP to feel gimmicky, like those situations where your health and other stats increased when you had PvP gear on out in the world.
How about this as I feel secondaries/tertiaries could use a revamp in PVE as well?
What if higher iLVL gear simply afforded you more secondary/tertiary stat allocation. Choose where you want to put it? Then you could do this in PvP and PVE.
In BG’s/Arenas it levels out primary stats, but in the world it doesn’t. If you put Warmode on, it’s going to roll you out with your PvP secondary/tertiary allocation rather than your PvE allocation.
I wonder if the code for reforging gear like we had in Cata is still in the game. If we could reforge 100% of secondary/tertiary stats that would be huge.
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Back in Alpha WoW in 2003, they had a system where with every level you got points to add to a primary stat. That system sucked, as it affected primaries, but I could totally see something like working with secondary/tertiary stats.
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When i see these words, I think “better class balance” but perhaps this statement is just too broad…the whole “Meta” concept trumps the idea that this is even an acheivable goal.
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If a player’s efforts don’t matter then you are turning this game into “Overwatch” I enjoy that game, but i like this one better. Perhaps a “new player queue” instead?
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Classes should be better balanced in PVP, sure.
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This, by definition trumps “skill over power” if every spec of every class isn’t viable then you have already failed in your goal. Shunning of “nonmeta” players(in PVP and PVE) is already a source of grief for those of us that say for instance only play MM hunter.
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This is irrelevant to your argument, if you want "new players to be just as strong as people that have “been through the grind” then who cares if someone pays for it? Effort is meaningless in the world you propose.
On one hand, you despise people for taking the easy way to gear themselves (guy with a big paypall account), but on the other, you want to just REMOVE all of the effort entirely…how is that not the same thing?
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Back in 2005 when you could grind out field marshal and grand marshal status also came gear that was at least close to pve viable.
Pve gear like bwl (tier 2) was pretty sick in pvp but most pvpers never completely dominated despite being powerful, because pvp back in those days require skill to go with it.
Today’s system in place is carrying low tier players to places they have no business in, its also true for arena to more than before. Pve i cant comment on as much as i havent been a heavy raider in end game since wotlk.
Skill is absent because gear is winning the battles, thats the issue in pvp.
You are grossly misrepresenting how much more powerful person in BWL gear would be to someone that JUST hit max level in Vanilla.
It wasnt terrible difference like today but very noticeable on casters like mages, locks, and priest. Thats not to say they were invincible to a lvl 60 guy in blues.
Seriously, just un-delete the WOD PvP gearing system and we can all rejoice.
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Gear progression and skill-based PvP aren’t mutually exclusive. Look to cata, MoP, and WoD. Just keep broken PvE items and effects out of PvP. The importance of skill in PvP depends wholly on how classes are designed.
Lol…good luck selling this idea to the basement dwelling “gear progression” crowd. When you lack skill you hide behind gear and hence want gear to be exclusively gated by grind. Sadly this what most of WoW community is.
I’m all for the idea of skill over power on the condition that the classes are balanced. Else this ain’t gonna work because then people would just be winning because of the class they play. And if it’s between winning because of the class I play or because of gear, I’d choose winning because of gear.