I’m at work so I’ll keep this brief but I’d like to just post a rant near to my heart.
While BFA has been riddled with plot inconsistencies the one that really pushed me over the edge was the raising of these two. I can understand death magic making you different, I’ve looked into it enough given my love of Scourge lore. But for them to do an immediate 180 from being righteous defenders of their people to happily working with the Forsaken to finish their people off is infuriating.
I have multiple problems with this but I’ll boil it down to two:
1: If they aren’t doing this of their own free will then it opens the same can of worms that the ghost of Arthas opened in Legion with the frost death knight artifact special. The one where you saw visions of him, more specifically the one where he questioned whether or not you ever really had free will.
2: Thy really did do a 180 and just immediately turned on their former friends and allies. How they whine and bemoan the alliance on failing them doesn’t make them sympathetic it comes off as pathetic. I hate hearing or seeing them in the warfront because they don’t shut up about how hope is dead and that we failed them.
It’s dumb. All dumb. I hate this.
TL;DR: Nothing new, I hate the current writing just like you.
It really doesn’t make much sense on its on, but their refusal to change more and likely means it supposed to set another story point down the road.
Maybe they kill Sylvanas, maybe they rejoin Alliance start training dark rangers as anew class, maybe they are the ones that lead into the next expansion like Gul’dan.
Perhaps all of the above.
In the end it really just sums up all that is wrong about the story, things need to happened in order for the future plot to be set up. Story cohesion be damned.
Sira and Delaryn didn’t deserve the plot points they were assigned to. Without the ‘ElUnE AbAnDoNeD uS! We aRe FoRsAkEn!!!’ crap, they would’ve been enjoyable characters to watch unfold. But I guess that’s just the way the cookie crumbles. Hopefully big B learned from this blunder and it’s the last we’ll see of this.
Well … we’ll see. Sylvie has shown that she is perfectly willing to subjugate the wills of those she resurrects into something more convenient for her own with Derek.
She also did spend like 4 expansions torturing Koltira Deathweaver to find a way to “alter his will to make it more convenient for her”. She may have failed to break him … but maybe its about time for Blizz to actually capitalize on that long forgotten (dead-end) plot point (after all, her “research” into that Elven DK would absolutely explain how she learned to resurrect elves with her Val’kyr, but also “convenience” their wills to fit her own personal objectives).
EDIT: That being said … that still yet-to-be-seen quest involving Velanora will likely tie into the Forsaken NEs in some way. I also suspect it will attempt to (to some minor degree) give some differing perspectives for the homogenized mass that is the Dark Rangers.
Those two either need to be put down or quietly shipped off to the same planet Medan is currently training on. Preferably the former. Such a dumb plot.
These two will be back in 8.3 when the focus is turned to Sylvanas’s end game.
While their living kaldorei kin have totally achieved vengeance against the Horde for the mass murder of their people, neither Sira nor Delaryn have got their revenge against the mean kaldorei, or Elune or Maiev who abandoned them. Their hurt feelings still need avenged!
Don’t forget they were personally murdered by the same people.
Really the only half way decent option they have left is to just go back and say there were mind controlled or stripped of their will in some way. They will get flack for a retcon, but it is better than the mess we have now.
You would probably need a couple pages of them to really do justice to this particular mess.
I suspect they wanted a reason for the horde to remain around Darkshore that they thought rising Night elves makes sense… just the execution made it terrible.
My bet is it was more, ‘Oh, guys!! Two words, Dark Rangers! Cool, right. People will love it.’ And they just slapped them in without really thinking it through.
That and the history of the Forsaken raising people has been a bit messy since it started. I get the feeling that they want them to work like the scourge, which used mind control. But they don’t want it to be mind control because players developed and fixated around the idea of the Forsaken being against mind control. So, they write the story in a way that really requires mind control. And then they try to spin something that says it is not mind control.
Oh, I agree for myself. But you know there would be a lot of people that would complain. If I was in their shoes, I would still think it would be worth it though.
Yes, and all they need to do to fix it is say the raised nelves are mind controlled. The motivation of these elves willingly fighting their people is the only issue with the whole thing, but with mind control, motivation doesn’t matter anymore.
Yeah but if they do that the Forsaken lose the only thing they have left that still separates them from the Scourge and nobody in their right minds should trust them.
I’m convinced that most of the forced lore we are getting in BFA is nothing more than preamble to set up the next expansion which will no doubt have everything to do with the Shadowlands and all things undead.
Helya is alive, Bolvar has a daughter, Vol’jin got raised by who knows what, Bwonsamdi has a boss, and if I had to guess I’d say Sylvanas will probably disappear while we are fighting Azshara. The new dark ranger stuff is them shoving it into lore so they can justify using it later on down the road by pointing back and saying, “FORESHADOWING”.
That line was crossed with Derek. If it’s ok to raise Derek as a mere weapon for war, why not the night elves? They just need them to replenish their forces in Darkshore, after the moon goes dark and the Elune powered kaldorei start going on the offensive. It doesn’t mean mind control will be used on normal Forsaken citizens.
I believe she meant inherently mind controlled rather than forced. Up until recently we just assumed all Forsaken/Death Knights had free will, and now many of the undead as well. But with a lot of these recent happenings we can’t be sure anymore. That’s why I mentioned the Frost DK artifact stuff in my original post, that’s where this all started to become a question.
I always thought they could get out of it, not by admitting their being mind controlled, but revealing that all along then bodies were being possessed by banshee. At least that’s the last thread I’m holding on for this story to make any sense.
This is from the same company that has SEVERAL quests still available ingame where you kill people, immediately raise them into undeath, and have them rise swearing their new hellish existences to the Banshee Queen. Also, they immediately attack their former allies.
“BuT iT’s NoT mInD cOnTrOl”
-Blizzard
At this point, the story delivered through the game and the story delivered through the books are two different timelines. Seriously, the Cataclysm Forsaken quests make it abundantly clear that Sylvanas brainswashes all new Forsaken.
![:frowning:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/frowning.png?v=6" ":frowning:")