Why cant casters have more disarms to counter their stuns?
We need more balance for melee vs. casters bring back more disarming of melee
4 Likes
Range have way more CC, than melee do. Furthermore, just you being 5 ft away is effectively a Disarm.
Also, complain about Leather classes over-preforming, not melee as a whole. Plate classes are vastly different from Leather classes.
2 Likes
Warrior’s have 2 charges and a leap. They have 1 stun, 1 disorient and a 15 second no CD low cost slow.
Mages are the only class that can get away from that, but they have to spec into double Frost Nova, and double Blink.
rogues have sprint, move faster while stealthed, shadow step, cloak of shadows, and a constant poison that slows. (or an ability that’s part of their core rotation)
Pallies have 2 stuns, blessing of freedom, Divine shield, and the ability to use the mount for 3 seconds. (twice if you talent it)
Monks are broken as it is… They have the best mobility in the game.
Druids have two dashes, two charges, a stun and a root. They can also break out of snares, and have travel form.
Death Knights have an active slow (which is more powerful than the most powerful mage slow), and the ability to pull you to them. They also have wraith walk to increase speed by 30% and a pet leap/stun.
Demon Hunters have 3 dashes, a leap back (which if you turn around mid jump can throw you toward the caster) Double jump which is faster than running, and another leap with their meta ability.
Lets talk about the casters now.
Priests have 1 fear.
Warlocks have 1 fear and 1 stun. (They have to talent into another fear OR a highly telegraphed teleport.)
Druids have 1 knock back, 1 root, and can talent into a stun.
Hunters have a pretty good slow, and a leap backward. They have a speed boost, but it slows them if they get hit (All melee have some sort of ranged ability. Even if it doesn’t deal much damage) and they have traps which have to be triggered on the ground in order to take effect.
Both Arcane, and Fire mages have 2 frost nova’s and 2 blinks. (the most mobile caster)
Frost mages; like monks with their mobility; have the most kiting potential. They have access to a lot of slows, 3 frost novas, an extra root, and two blinks.
Melee have significantly more ways to deal with casters than casters do with melee. Not to mention Melee can attack while moving. Casters; for the most part; can’t. Aff locks can, but they can’t use their filler, or UA. Hunters can, and so can fire mages. Other than that, they have to stop moving in order to do anything. Which in turn gives the melee the opportunity to close the gap.
Edit: Mages do have sheep, Druids do have roots, and Cyclone, Shammies do have Grounding totem, and Warlocks do have fear. But they all have DR, and either have a short duration, long CD, or break from damage. A Warlock can’t stop a warrior mid charge because they got hit by a DoT tick, but if you chaos bolt a feared Warrior you’re going to break that fear.
Melee slows also can’t be broken out of without some sort of shield or trinket ability. (Pally shields, as well as DH Netherwalk will break slows. Mage Iceblock… Stuff like that. Big CD abilities.
So yes, casters do have things that will keep a melee away from them, but it comes with heavy caveats that you can’t really compare them to the abilities melee have to get to the casters.
Edit 2: Druids do have mobility, but they’re not damaging you while they’re in travel form running away. They may have DoTs on you, but in BFA Druid DoTs are worth significantly less than they have been in previous expansions.
CAN a druid get away from you? Sure. Will they be doing anything while they are? No. Can any melee class catch up and STILL attack while running after the druid? Absolutely.
9 Likes
What are you talking about? You know you casters strip most of warriors based skill utilities and was turned into talents? Remember Gag order? Caster complaints took away warrior’s mechanics because of pvp.
1 Like
Is the warrior really going to complain towards the warlock about CC counters?
Imo, casters lost too many options to get away in the prune.
Frost mage has the best chance due to it’s kit being very good at stalling, but the loss of deep freeze makes them have to work kinda hard to beat even a mediocre warrior, lacking any really reliable Cc for actually finishing a fight instead of resetting.
Casts don’t hurt like they used to, and most of their ability to control the momentum of a fight is gone. It’s 10x easier for a DH, war or rogue to pressure a shaman than the other way around, for instance.
6 Likes
Complain? More like stating facts since this did occur during MoP when casters hated warriors.
lel at complaining about pally mobility.
6 Likes
Whether you feel it’s good or not, the abilities stand for themselves. You have an immunity to slows/roots/snares, you have your bubble which makes you immune to slows/roots/snares, and you have your mount ability which literally gives you a 100% Speed boost.
Going up against any caster that isn’t a frost mage, you’re going to catch up to them. Once that happens it’s REALLY hard for that caster to shake you.
it kinda feels like you’re really downplaying caster mobility/cc and making melee cc/mobility sound a lot more dramatic than it really is.
warlock fear is an amazing ability to deal with melee, along with infernal, shadowfury, and a choice of demonic circle or one of the best sprints in the game.
priests are admittedly slow without many options.
mages - if you let a melee stick to you that’s a you problem.
hunters have plenty of ways to kite, run around, and escape.
I’m not saying that there isn’t a disparity between melee and ranged, but it’s not nearly as dramatic as you’re making it sound.
4 Likes
Don’t forget that Warriors also have an AoE disorient.
Casters tend to have “sustainable” CC like Polymorph and Fear, but those require cast times. Versus things like Storm Bolt, Kidney Shot, etc that have either a cost or cooldown.
The problem isn’t really the fact that melee has CC, it’s just that interrupts are crippling to casters. Affliction warlocks especially are 100% reliant on Shadow school magic, so if any of their abilities are interrupted, they are out of everything for a while so it’s effectively another short-CD CC on them. Destro is a little better because if they get locked out casting Immolate, they can fear. If they get locked out casting fear, they can chaos bolt. Except if they are hit by another CC instead, then the cycle of being a punching bag continues.
4 Likes
wait what. warriors have 2 stuns? And two charges.
my talent tree makes me pick between two charges and my classes only stun so where is this whole nother stun coming from?
7 Likes
Intimidating shout. It’s not a stun per sey, but it’s essentially the same thing. It stops your character from performing any action for a period of time.
It’s a tricky balance because wizards are still very strong in any organized and rated PvP.
is not a stun. I would support disarms however. All melee classes except for paladins and DKs can easily keep up with a ranged. As a monk casters being able to cast from 40 yards away is a complete non issue.
Leather classes over performing… in PvP? Have you fought a geared ret pally as a leather wearer before?
1 Like
A ret paladin has no place complaining about other melee lol. I thought that was strange too
I used to have a disarm… they took it away. It make me a sad little priest.
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Why not quote the whole post where I say “It’s not a stun per sey, but it’s essentially the same thing. It stops your character from performing any action for a period of time.”
My warrior would like a word with you lol
Excuse you, CC is my job.
1 Like