Just rerolled as a sin rogue. Currently running mythics and gearing up trying to get stats right. Everything I read says agi, haste, crit, mastery, verse. When I look at the top rogues in the world right now they all have mastery stacked up so much higher than haste. What am I missing?
stat weights are gonna be dependent on a few things, what azerite traits you’re running, and how much of a stat you already have. As always best to sim yourself.
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From http://www.ravenholdt.net/assassination-guide/
For stats you should be aiming for the following:
Single Target
Agility Haste Critical Strike Mastery VersatilityMulti Target
Agility Critical Strike Mastery Versatility Haste
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thats a general guideline depending on current tier.
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For instance OPs
raidbots(dot)com/simbot/report/kjBhztsSb8SJCZKF9SqoC3
Weapon DPS 8.91
Haste 1.89
Critical Strike 1.78
Agility 1.76
Mastery 1.70
Versatility 1.51
Off Hand Weapon DPS 1.03
And mine,
raidbots(dot)com/simbot/report/tiB7jr917tCCk6e22uP91d
It will vary depending on the gear.
OP specifically asked about Mythic+, which is a multi target encounter. The sim you linked is for single target. The stat weights are different. Just as PvP stat weights are usually different.
I assume the folks at Ravenholdt have done their homework.
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What about the raid right now? Are all the fights multi-target? I’m seeing so much mastery in all the top PVE rogues.
Oops, wrong toon.
There are add phases you have to deal with. But nothing I’d consider multi-target, except trash pulls.
The Ravenholdt guide was updated for 8.1. So, I assume it’s accurate.
When you say you are “seeing” so much mastery, are you looking at the actual mastery rating or the percentage? With my current gear set, my Haste rating is much higher than Mastery rating. However, the Mastery percentage is higher.
That being said, you can’t really single out a particular stat and just “stack” it. You have to use a sim to get optimal stat distribution. I personally like Ask Mr Robot. https://www.askmrrobot.com
It’s too early to start simming as I need to upgrade almost every single piece of gear on this guy at this point. I’m kind of just going off the bis dungeon guides and most of it is crit/haste gear. You’re right though, I was reading percentages and not ratings. I was confused.
I mean my mistake, but its as easy as switching the sim type. Also its never too early to sim if you’re trying to min max at that moment. My overall point was, not to follow some “expected stat weights” but to figure out your own, since your personal gear will dictate whats best. Instead of mindlessly following the stat weights of a guide.
Really depends on gear and talents. For example with Exange and 2x ss I sim:
haste>>crit>agi
but with Toxic blade and 1 ss
mast~haste>agi.
Haste has insane scaling the more you get and while running exang on single target. Once there is more than 1 target and any fight mechanic that keeps you from optimal exange usage haste will start to lose value pretty quickly. Its never bad but stat weights become much more balanced.
This answered questions I didnt know I had. With only 1 SS trait is it worth running exsanguinate? How about if I have 2 nothing personal and 1 SS? Do multiple nothing personal traits make toxic blade > exsanguinate? Also are pure bleed builds worth using in longer single target encounters? Or does the frequency of use on toxic blade put it ahead as well?
Ask Mr Robot can answer all of these questions.
https://www.askmrrobot.com
It allows you to sim all 244 talent combinations so you can see how they stack up.
There is a “Best in Bag” feature that will suggest the best gear based on the talents you choose. You can also lock in certain pieces of gear and optimize around those.
To bad ask mrrobot is almost always wrong. The person who writes it does a bad job at it as well.
If you want to sim you have to use raid bots. Ask mrrobot has been wrong since the start of wod from my knowledge. Like anywhere from 1-25% wrong
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I never used any of the sims before Saturday. Still trying to figure out what exactly I can do for it. That said I havent as of yet looked at what it would recommend.
However from my own testing this morning 1SS and 2 nothing personal and 2 double dose I got a significantly larger boost with toxic blade which makes sense taking the double dose into consideration.
My opener was garrote>rupture>garrote>vendetta>toxic blade>envenom>mut to 4 or 5> envenom> mut to 4 or 5 > rupture and then into the normal rotation.
I found this did the highest burst and even averaged out the highest for my set up as well. I didnt include vanish but it would be the standard time to do it as well as soon as garrote falls off.
With the exsanguinate talent I found that I couldn’t actually land as much burst or sustained and really I just crop that up to the idea that I have 4 traits that benefit from nature damage and only 1 from bleed. Even with drums and prepots I couldnt make bleeds out do it.
I do hope to get a full 3xSS build put together sometime so I can feel the gory glory that is the juicy exsanguinate builds.
You’d have to sim to get the most accurate answer. Short answer is they are close and toxic blade is likely slightly better in most situations and significantly better with 0ss. Toxic blade is also way simpler to use where as exsanguinate needs proper set up to actually gain you dps.
First off there is literally no point in using more then one NP traits (Nothing Personal), you’re opener is wrong also. Please visit the rogue class discord, Ravenholdt which can be found by simply googling it.
Heard. I was initially following the top parsers and replicating their openers for each of the fights and breaking down what they did. The nothing personal trait is definately becoming less and less popular. I assume it was likely that the it replaced a more popular old trait (maybe?) Since it was being taking 2 and even 3 at a time by the majority of top 10 parses on most of the fights before this week. Now more people have access to more traits and it will change.
Only have 1 weeks worth of saves to anything I put together the best I had.
There are still numerous top parses even on mythic running 2x NP. But I can accept that it is trash. I’ll hit up the discord and see what else I’m doing wrong. I know my timing on the opener was off. I was just playing around with it and found that one to yield the most consistant and highest dps for my set up I had. Again. My openers were just stolen from the top parsing rogues first 30 seconds of the fight (minus a vanish for testing).
Thanks for the info. I’ll check out the discord and git gud.
I run 2xNP and Master Assassin, as well as a few other people I know. Logs can be finicky, myself and everyone I know runs it because we are unlucky on azerite (aka it’s all we have). I don’t know of any rogues parsing orange that would run it despite other options.
If you’re looking at logs for help, it can be a good idea to scroll down a bit. Often times the top parses are cheesed or the fight landed in an awkward situation that allowed them to parse as high as they did. Of course kill time is also a major factor for Sin. Hell I’ve had the stars align and proc’ed both trinkets and all my azerite in 1 go of my opener, allowing me to burst to 94k ST. That isn’t normal, and the top parses on logs are often less than normal situations.
As the guy above said, check the Ravenholdt discord. Their website is a good start, and some of the more specific scenario questions can be answered on the chat. Of course as well, always sim your character, and running your logs through WoWAnalyzer isn’t a bad idea for some quick basic tips on what you may be doing wrong.
Do keep in mind however, even with a proper sim and gearing and a solid opener, probably one of the biggest DPS losses I see comes from improper CD management per fight and uptime on the boss and/or adds. As an example, blowing sprint on Gronk to move out of the circle, or popping Vendetta - and then adds spawn forcing you to waste a large portion of it; things like that will gimp you significantly. Hence why so many prog parses are garbage, people don’t know the fight well enough to time everything out.