I’d consider this under raid releases. Also the proponents of this change you’re asking for have been full of themselves from the start.
I can’t imagine giving some of the strongest pve specs their bis sigil is a smart move either… you all have downplayed that.
I don’t think this qualifies as raid releases, but I understand what it is you mean. Despite a lot of the fecal flinging that this thread has comprised of, I think it’s difficult for serious PvPers to not be passionate about this item as the strength (or weakness, haha) of the Death Knight class in PvP this season is solely reliant upon this item.
If you had said this was the strongest pve spec 2 weeks ago, I’d agree. They’re no longer the kings of PvE - we’ll quickly see warlocks and potentially some other specs surpass them in tier 8.
In the best case scenario, PvE-wise, this trinket is only a 60+ dps boost for ~2 minute fights.
It literally DOES NOT MATTER how big of a change it may or may not be. It IS A CHANGE FOR PVE BECAUSE OF PVP, and that is an extremely stupid reason to make the change.
If you want a change for PVP, do it without changing PVE. Ask Blizzard to redo Death Coil in PVP. Ask them to make a separate PVP enabled Sigil. There are so many ways other than messing with the current status of PVE to get what you want without messing with PVE.
Its not rocket science ffs.
Its not even a change for pve at this point because we had valor idols in from p1. If anything this is a pve nerf that is going against precedent and it is being asked that we do not change pve or pvp by allowing it be available just like in p1.
Also its not like the idols/sigils are some insane item in pve that is hugely overvalued compared to alternative options. Obviously I haven’t simmed everything but the badge to dps gain ratio of the idols/sigils is more than likely within a single percent of other items. The most it would do is allow for those classes to have a slightly higher top end of gain that can be earned from getting hundreds of badges, but ultimately that is largely irrelevant by the time it would happen.
“It literally DOES NOT MATTER how big of a change it may or may not be. It IS A CHANGE FOR PVE BECAUSE OF PVP, and that is an extremely stupid reason to make the change.”
This is pure cringe, we’re talking about +/- 60 dps on 12 year old content. Myself and every other DK that enjoys PVP has a legitimate reason to be invested in this outcome because it directly impacts our personal success for the duration of the entire season on a MASSIVE basis completely beyond our control. You’re whining because this would impact you… how exactly?
“You’re only seeing this as DKs, but giving DKs such a substantial power spike that’s guaranteed is not really fair to every other class that has to deal with them.”
This is simply to ensure competition between DK players is based on their individual skill and not a 20% character strength delta between two players clearing the same levels of content based on a single RNG item. Most items such as a hardmode drop will be a 1-3% delta, which is perfectly reasonable. This only ensures fairness between DKs for the full duration of season 6, it will have absolutely no impact on your end of season 1400 push (good luck btw). We get it; you’re a loser who blames other classes for your personal deficiencies instead of taking responsibility, there is no need to muck up this thread with your irrelevant and pathetic whining.
“- leaving their competence and potential to push Gladiator or Rank 1 up to sheer luck alone seems unfair.”
This is all that matters. 1-5% deltas in character strength between individuals can be left up to chance/and as a function of the level of time/effort invested in the game as a reward. Nobody disagrees with that, nobody is asking for free candy, nobody is advocating for some free advantage only for DKs. This item is FAR more significant than a legendary with 1/25th the effort required to obtain, and should be universally available to ensure a reasonably balanced basis for competition and not left to RNG.
YOU. ARE. NOT. THE. ONLY. ONE. EFFECTED. BY. THIS. CHANGE.
I don’t give a damn how much DPS a DK gains. I care about what an entire 25 man gains from the change. Stop looking at PVE loot in a PVP setting. No one gives a damn about your PVP woes in PVE. Look for a solution IN PVP AND NOT IN PVE.
Why are you not raging about how they removed items from the vendor after setting a precedent in p1? This was a change that had an effect on pve.
How about the gargoyle nerf only work in dungeons and raids? How about make the increased ilvl items only work in dungeons and raids?
The “entire raid” gains nearly nothing of significance, because the sigil is NOT FREE in this proposal; it costs badges which have an opportunity cost which can/would be spent on other upgrades/gear by other classes at a higher priority anyways.
You’re literally just deluded, emotional, and you have no clue what you’re even saying. How could you possibly have such a strong opinion on this? If you really feel so strongly about this, try to make an actual argument for why this matters significantly for the PVE balance with logic and math like a human being without the pauses and clapping to emphasize your meaningless non-point like an intellectually deficient seal.
someone from blizzard needs to check this post out and issue a statement so we can know 100% whats going to happen.
but also this arbeaday guy probly cares about his 99 parses in decade old content LOL pathetic. dk already got changed in a horrible way for PvE. giving us the ability to buy a sigil wont make u lose to us in pve dont worry mr druid ur parses are safe!
Get blizzard to add it to arena shop for 2k arena points, problem solved, and then can have it so it only works in Arena/battlegrounds
Agreed, the sigil of the vengeful heart is a minor PVE upgrade, but a massive PVP upgrade. I don’t see why this can’t be made available for conquest emblems on the relic vendor, similarly to how Sigil of Awareness was made available in Phase 1. The logic behind the reasoning for putting the item on the vendor in Phase 1 hasn’t changed, its one item that changes one spell, dropped by 1 boss in 25 man mode only. In a limited time frame like an arena season, it may be impossible to get (especially if your RNG/luck is bad), and would put you at a big disadvantage vs DKs that are fortunate enough to have it (with the relic actually working properly). If people are worried about it being too easy to obtain P2 relics via vendors (assuming blizz would add every P2 relic to the vendor), they could up the amount of emblems it takes to purchase P2 relics requiring more of an investment by the player.
I’m fine with DKs not being able to have nice things, personally.
im fine with druids being unplayable for the rest of time, personally.
Give us a response Blizzard!
This was well stated - I would recommend people who are still struggling with this idea to refer to this post.
Is there another post that addresses this lol? Maybe thats why blizz left these items of the vendor, they couldn’t figure out how to even make them work properly.
Of all the haters and losers desperately gatekeeping something that wont even affect them in this thread, I respect this guy the most because he’s honest about his actual reasoning. Kudos to you Treespoon
You are very wrong, Sigil of awareness wasd available on the vendor since day 1 of launch. ive had it since the first week from badges. are you slow in the head
@Blizzard please respond. Ridiculous y’all are taking this to respond to this post.
The “logic” wasn’t logic. It was an oversight. There’s a reason the items were only available from the relic vendor and not the regular badge vendor.
Claiming that a mistake sets an unbreakable precedent is how selfish people perpetuate injustices. That’s a general observation on the rhetorical argument, nothing to do with the sigil specifically.
I don’t really care one way or another whether the sigil is available for badges or not. Our only UH DK got it from XT last night, so it doesn’t benefit me either way.
Loot RNG is a thing in WoW. We’ve all had to work around it or cursed the loot gods for not providing their bounty. At the end of the day, the absolute worst case scenario for UH DKs is they miss out on their expansion BiS sigil for an entire phase and season, then have it for the rest of the expansion. That’s a better situation than the rest of us looking for a specific PvE drop face.
Maybe this is the single most important pvp item in history and you’ll be useless for the whole season without it. Every season of arena has players who can’t be all they can be because a key item didn’t drop. Bad luck?
Feel free to make the fairness in arena argument. It doesn’t hurt to ask. But consider that just because you care about the issue a lot doesn’t mean that you should get your way. Maybe they should nerf the sigil so the value over replacement in pvp is greatly reduced instead? Seems just as valid a response.