Again, I think we can all agree there would be some increase. The question is, would the increase in damage be so significant for the best players in most content that they would become ‘busted.’
1 Like
Except no, because they don’t need it, so why nerf damage and mobility?
I’m all for pres getting some range, but you can’t show me any evidence other than “players that can’t figure it out don’t like it” that justifies nerfing the throughput for players that actually can as it pertains to the dps specs.
It’s irrelevant if they’d become busted or just get “some increase”. Blizzard would have to adjust either way.
That’s your opinion, fine. I’d gladly give up something to never hear my Evoker say “I need to get closer” or “Out of range” when trying to do something my priest, mage, etc can do. Hell I can hop on my Holy Paladin or Mistweaver monk (y’know, the “melee healers”) that can still dispel and deal with someone standing in Narnia just fine. Oh and my Monk has double Roll, and feels incredible mobile because of it.
I have been playing Preservation this expansion, so I am approaching the range from that angle. It’s obscene and I regret choosing it as my main again this season because of this one simple factor.
2 Likes
We lose a mid-range class when there is no need for it to happen.
It would be like if a ton of people rolled warrior, then suddenly, all specs became 40 yard range because those people cannot deal with being in melee.
If evokers are to have 40 yards, give us another spec.
(And maybe end up with a class with two healing specs that isn’t priest.) First 5 spec class, let’s go.
It’s not an opinion, it’s factual based on the performance of the class across the entire expansion.
This argument makes zero sense. You consciously chose a class with 15 less yards than your mage and priest, but are frustrated that they aren’t the same?
This is basically the range equivalency of me making a rogue, speccing into acrobatic strikes, and complaining that it can’t do things my evoker can.
If double roll makes you feel more mobile than double hover, rescue, VE, time spiral, maybe you should be maining monk?
You know what they say about the definition of insanity…
Ofcourse it’s relevant. My entire reason for rejoining this discussion was your claim that it would make the spec busted. xD
Bliz would only need to make adjustments if dev started performing way above other specs. We may well see adjustments anyway on retail due to how well the tier set is performing in raids. Tuning tweaks should not be the deciding factor when it comes to class design if you ask me. What we should aim for is the most enjoyable experience playing the class.
And I do appreciate that what you enjoy is having the mid range, and there’s nothing wrong with you holding that opinion.
3 Likes
Bro, they’re mailing it in this season lol.
Again, we have zero data to prove whether it would be a minor increase or busted, it’s entirely conjecture.
What we DO agree on is that it would be stronger if it got more range, and if that’s the case they wouldn’t wait to see how strong it is, is this your first time playing wow? They never give massive design changes to classes without a give/take.
Again, subjective. You’re trying to extrapolate population trends based on a wow forum, which is asinine.
You’re literally arguing semantics based on ‘feelycraft’ intuition on what an entire playerbase wants for a spec based on people crying on a forum.
You’re also arguing semantics based on data that we can’t possibly collect until after a hypothetical range increase, and making your own assumptions on how strong it would be. The bottom line is that it would be stronger (as you’ve admitted, at least), and they would have to adjust to compensate.
None of this conversation that started before hero talents came out has even broached the fact that hero talents and the widespread access to spatial paradox will drastically improve our already insane mobility, as well as our survivability.
Thinking that tacking 15 yards onto all of that and not realizing that it would snowball from there is either willful ignorance or just the desire to disagree with me.
At the end of the day, the fact that the talent that replaced spatial paradox is a measly 5 yard increased range on ONLY helpful spells for aug is relatively conclusive evidence that Blizzard is happy with where the range is currently.
everyone gets spatial paradox next expac as an additional nerf to aug.
they would have to adjust to compensate.
They don’t have to technically, but it wouldn’t be a benefit cause we lose the mid-range aspect of the class.
And, if the power increase were to push us over, just as well, would an x% buff.
Then we still keep the mid-range identity.
Imagine a healthy survival hunter population, then Blizzard makes it melee because a small minority wanted it.
Ofcourse I am. And you’re doing exactly the same. xD It’s all feelycraft and conjecture until they do an actual poll or try it out. Season 4 is the perfect time for them to experiment a bit to see what happens. They could give evokers some sort of special scroll that increases range just to see what impact it has, which doens’t work over level 70. That way, if it doesn’t work, no issues in War Within. If it does and people love it, bake it in.
3 Likes
Show me where I made a claim on what the majority of players wanted.
And yet they clearly aren’t interested. MOP remix would be the place they would test this with a rune if they were going to, I’d think.
Here you go
3 Likes
LOL, this has nothing to do with me assuming what the majority of evokers want, but good homework bud 
.
This is literally me saying that the majority of threads on the forums are complaints. If you feel like doing a little more homework and tallying them up, I’d be happy to see the results and be proven wrong.
Were you not suggesting that you believe most evoker players would rather keep mid range and that it’s only the minority complaining on the forums who want longer range?
4 Likes
You’re halfway right.
I was simply saying that your reference to a vocal minority wad more likely to apply to those wanting more range specifically on the forums, as the majority of people on the forums are here to complain about what they don’t like versus defending what they do.
At no point did I say “the majority of evokers want x range”. There’s no way to know that, as these forums represent a drop in the ocean of the playerbase.
If people like it, it’s not a reason to keep it because it’s advertised as mid-ranged.
Why should my spec become 40 yards just because other people don’t like dealing with the mid-range concept that they signed up for?
2 Likes
Fair, I read too much into it.
Sounds like in a round-about way we are in agreement on most things then. I think the best way to solve the issue is using your idea of a toggle node for second hover vs 40ft range. Let the choices speak for themselves.
(I would probably very rarely take the 40 yard range except on those specific outranging fights because I just love the cast while moving trope way too much with 2 hover charges.)
2 Likes
Why give ret range on attacks then? They weren’t advertised as a ranged melee spec.
2 Likes
Ret is still functionally melee.
1 Like
If only disintigrate and living flame had 40 yard range, evoker would be functionally mid-ranged too but most of the issues would be solved. 
3 Likes
makes more sense for fire breath.
An occasional thing, not a central part of your rotation.
Just like how preservation evoker is like 200 yards factoring in TA.