The amount of Torghast you’ll actually need to do for raid-relevant material is going to be pretty low.
Plus you’re not going to have much to do between launch week and raid week, so why would you not just do Torghast anyways? I’m finding it difficult to believe you raid at any relevant difficulty and DIDN’T know the cloak’s strength would be tied directly to the Visions.
Then I would highly recommend you do not purchase shadowlands. I too despised visions. It was degenerate gameplay and a hamfisted way to force m+ down the throat of players who would rather do anything else in the game other than the garbage esports content that is m+.
It’s ok, you’re being babied and catered to by Blizzard.
Oh look, Ralph is still screaming that the sky is falling because he can’t get geared equivelant to Mythic raid gear within a week.
There’s people already clearing tier 8 on beta, so yeah I’m sure you’ll need full mythic gear to do. Totally.
Lol what? Unless you’re talking about WPvP, which if you are would you rather they bring back PvP scaling? Because that was clearly such a better situation.
And even in the days of PvP-centric stats this was still a thing.
Oh noes, you can’t spam keys and invalidate 99% of the end-game in a day. The horrors.
But fun fact, if you complete your weekly chores you still get mythic raid equivelant loot from your chest.
Welcome to WoW where 900 pieces of loot aren’t thrown at you for doing a single quest. Loot sources across the board were reduced because they got rid of the horrid RNG garbage.
A weekly chest reward for Torghast doesnt affect your raiding power…do you plan to PvP at gladiator level and run a 15 Mplus as well? Besides Torghast is already tied into your raid power through legendary item mats…sooooo.
We are not elitist and angry, we’re just heavily disagreeing with you with some facts.
When this has to do with this thread though?
We are not calling you undeserving peasents for wanting highest level of gear, in fact if you want it you have to get a guild and socialize with them, no one is preventing you on this.
Citation and evidence needed.
Still waiting on citation and evidence to back it up.
Again, Mythic Raid gear is not the only source for best gear and it varies for which class and spec you play, example during BFA that Fire mages needs that pvp thrinket to help them in their burst phase, Geti’ikku from Kings’ rest can sometimes sim higher for single target for Dps Warriors, Unholy (or frost 2H for prepatch) DKs, and ret pallies, these are my examples but they do not come from raiding, there could be more examples but it would be long of a list.
I like how raiders ENDLESSLY whine anytime they have to do anything besides raids, but when the entire rest of the player base HAS to raid, it’s ok.
Why do devs listen to these people?
Because you are the alternative. And nobody wants that
I got Mad World without ever setting foot in Ny’alotha. Just wanted to brag about that.
It’s infuriating.
lol not only @ raider snowflakes mass reporting posts, but mods actually taking them down
What posts are being taken down?
pooooor babies lol. MuH pOsTs!
1 “raider”=/=the whole community, raiders have been doing grinds since day 1 for minimum power gain, that is just what is expected when you want to raid at max level.
Who do you think was running 600-700 Maw of souls to hit their artifact “max level”? You think people that do that really care about the time investment of Torgash? Lol
When did you lose the ability to run your raid however you want? There’s oof casual guilds having chill raid nights.
Nothing is stopping anyone from doing any level of content but themselves.
Sadly humans have a lot of trouble when it comes to change no matter how good or just it is, the species is far too addicted to rigidity so the average person wil almost always defend the status quo which says a lot about the humans as a species
You could literally write this post and exchange ‘raiders’ with ‘M+er’s’ or ‘PvPers’ and it would still be true.
For the past two expansions PvPers have done nothing but ENDLESSLY complain about being forced to do M+ in order to be competitive in their content. And rightly so.
Let’s not act like this is a “raider” issue.
As I’ve said repeatedly… they need to separate the gear paths at the top, making dungeon tier bonuses (that only work in the dungeons), raid tier bonuses (that only work in the raids), and PvP tier bonuses (that only work in PvP). Ideally I’d also add a PvP stat to further separate PvP from PvE.
So long as the gear upgrades are the same across all forms of content… whichever piece of content is fastest/least effort to gear up in will be the de facto content and everyone else will feel “forced” to do it.
I don’t want to join a mythic raid guild because most of them are full of toxic players. I can deal with crappy gear, but if its really bad then I guess I’ll find another game to play. I know a few people who have refunded because of this, not because they’re casuals, but they’re also changing how M+ works. You won’t get mythic raid ilvl gear anymore.
This is the problem with these threads… The amount of misinformation in them is just staggering.
M+ in Shadowlands and M+ in Legion/BfA have TWO forms of loot acquisition:
End of Dungeon Loot Box:
Weekly Loot Box:
Currently, you get mythic loot quality from the weekly chest, not from the end of dungeon loot box. The ONLY thing they nerfed was the end of dungeon reward. And let’s be clear here… I disagree with that nerf. I think at most (if any) they should’ve brought it back in line with heroic, not worse. But seriously… stop acting like you literally cannot get mythic gear from M+… Because you can… which is why every serious PvPer and every serious Raider will still be doing… M+…
In fact, they BUFFED the weekly loot box via the great vault. As they’ll now give you a choice between up to 3 items (technically 9 if you do everything, but gl doing that) all of which will be mythic quality. This increases your chances of getting something you can use 3 fold.
So long story short:
And yet old wow classic has more players than ff14, and the wow classic community is by far the most pretentious arrogant community.
Yet she is right, BFA got surpassed by a lot of old MMO’s.
Easy, by not sucking, having competent writers, a story that made sense. Not as much identity politics, and not as many people crying over blonde hair blue eyed elves not being playable.
Do people have a hard time believing a genre that is not as popular as it was in the early 00s isn’t as succesful now?
Wow at best hit 10 million or high subs, they never went into 16 mill or so.
Thats actually very low, and not really that impressive.
WoW 
is not the most populated game or mmo anymore
Black desert online?