PS I played as Guardian druid last night at 2200mmr no voice and we slaughtered every team.
Couple things about me.
I’m a terrible melee player.
My positioning was garbo.
I don’t have a clue what I’m doing.
We beat MLP. I even stood out during dark soul infernal and ate a gpy during it and just traded skin and surv instinct and an FR. Was fine after that.
what comp did u run for guardian druid i wana try it
Of course it felt horrible having 4 personal stops for casts between bash, skull bash, roar thingy, and hm tauren stun. Big tough match looool. Every match we played my toolkit felt immense and I never had to worry about being CC’d because lol hi I’m a Derpian dwuid.
You claimed always having to do something but I disagree. My biggest plays were using insta root on a melee chasing my druid when they exited healer los or feral charging someone to stop a gap closer. Even if I failed those things it wasn’t overly important. I could always come out to heal my healer during big goes to stabilize him. Add in the extra 3 hots I could do to protect against shaman purge spamming.
Oh and the rotation is mindless. Literally just slap thrash out on CD and hit as many targets as possible. Maintain moonfire. Slam out big anima damage if stacked.
I dont even have nullification barrier. Don’t pretend that this spec is difficult. I’m sure I made some egregious errors last night, FFS I triple DR’d a bash for no reason and we never came within 5 ft of losing.
Yo I never said guardian wasn’t broken. I think it is. I think it needs nerfs. But just gonna pause for two seconds.
You talked about complexity of rotation: none of the classes ATM have a complex rotation. Destro included. Maintain immolate is the same as maintaining moonfire. XD
You also talked about how even though you didn’t know what you were doing you had roots, heals, hots, and stops. That seems like a lot to do, idk, maybe that’s just me. Not arguing it’s hard or anything, but I’m saying there’s an extensive toolkit to do stuff and I think that’s fun.
Moving past that, it’s okay to thing guardian is more busted than destro. I disagree there, but I don’t think I’ll ever convince you otherwise as it’s a subjective thing. However, not in any of your posts have you acknowledged that destro warlock is broken… And it is. It simply is, man.
Warlock has the same issue as guardian in that you have infinite stops, bananas tankiness, an easy rotation, and invalidated so many other comps. It may play a 12 minute damp game instead of a 14 minute one, but the difference is you HAVE to spend all of those 12minutes using stops on the warlock and you can still lose. Also there are times you can’t stop the lock at all because of all their CC. Guardian never kills before big deep damp. Warlock is dangerous 100% of the time.
I don’t think it’s fair to talk about bear being broken when you play a class that does the same thing but is infinitely more dangerous.
I don’t think there’s a single player on this forum who hasn’t gone from 100-0 in a coil or conflag root while their healer was in a bash or coil.
The point is guardian has access to all this, and sacrifices literally NOTHING for it.
So you REALLY keep avoiding the warlock thing here.
Do you think warlock is broken?
More than one person has pointed out several things that make warlock stronger than every other caster and you’ve chosen to ignore all of those comments and instead point the finger at guardian druids who are frankly just a melee version of warlock with less burst.
While we’re at it, I’m not sure what you’re on about by “sacrificing nothing”.
Guardian has no relevant burst (outside of anima, which is an essence thing more than a class thing and is still less than chaos bolt??) And is required to be in melee range on a target, and also next to their team to prevent more damage. Those ARE very real tradeoffs. The issue is that there’s too much hp in the game, so you can’t CC the bear and cross kill a healer. Which is what nahj and so many others were talking about earlier. Destro is literally just as problematic in this aspect if not more so because it’s dangerous from minute 0-end of game where guardian isn’t a real threat for 12+ minutes and can be ignored.
i cant tell if the pot or the kettle is winning
Arena forum better than Nflix.
Are the arenas fixed?
You don’t have ways to CC a guardian, so yes, you pretty much have to ignore it.
unfortunately we still in offseason lil whippersnapper
While we’re at it, let’s do comparisons:
Skull bash vs pet silence; okay, skull bash has a shorter CD, but is a shorter range and a shorter lockout. Also can’t be used while CCd. I’d take pet CS any day.
Bash vs shadowfury:
Same CD, longer stun, but not aoe. Requires melee, but not a cast time:
Seems like a wash there.
Roar vs coil:
30s vs 45 melee range vs 20 yds
Roar breaks on damage (including your dots and all of the aoe abilitys, so every button except two) and coil never breaks AND heals you and can be havocd?
I think coil is way better.
Now warlock still has a conflag root that doesn’t break on damage, an infernal I stand aoe stun, and a SPAMMABLE fear that still doesn’t instabreak on damage?
Let’s also not ignore that warlock has the best and most dangerous burst in the game bar none in infernal
Both classes have insane tankiness and self healing. Soul leech will always get full value as a destro lock (before we take mastery into account, or healthstones or gateway mobility) because you cannot ever kick fire or freely dispell immolate because of ALL the other CC they have.
And what does warlock “sacrifice” for this?
Again, I’m not coming at you. I’m just trying to understand how you think it’s not okay for guardian to do the things it does, but it is okay for warlocks?
Here’s the difference, I can’t stand on top of my team mates and they all take 20% less damage passively.
Also warlock damage is casted and can be interrupted or lined. Also, my healer has to spend much more mana while melee are hitting me and has to get drinks to win. Also, benefit of not being susceptible to poly DR’s.
I’m not saying destro isn’t as broken as fire mage, dh, rogue or DK but the competency level of all of those class is far beyond guardian druid players. Just watching them move around is painful and as long as they’re on top of their healer, positioning does not matter.
LMAO that’s what im getting at tho. Both classes make the game unfun- they force deep dampening and prevent people from playing their classes. They both need big nerfs. I’ve said that consistently throughout the thread. I said I’d get rid of sac aura 100% for bears.
Controversial opinion but I dont think guardian druids should be nerfed (other classes toolkits need to be increased to guardian druid standards), they are good because they have a huge toolkit, something that is missing on other classes, the off healing is insane but they get 4 off healing buttons, stuff to help your allies with dmg mitigation, they feel impactful to play.
Just increase the toolkit on other classes and keep the guardian druids in check. As long as their dmg is not bonkers keeping a huge toolkit is good for the game, lets players have a wider skill gap. I would say warlocks need to be a little bit less tanky and get port back, x2 coil is a little bit dumb but they could have for example wotlk shadowflame to kite more idk. Add changes like this to every class and you have a better game.
EDIT: Another example, warriors should have reflect baseline, disarm, warbanner. Priests should have swap baseline, instant void eruption baseline. Cyclone should be baseline, meaningful pvp talents could be a nature swiftness one that makes a cast instant every 30 or some stuff like that or give clone some extra range. Make grounding and skyfury baseline. Like this for every class.
Sure, sac is broken and should be removed 100% I agree!
and sure, warlock damage Can be interrupted, but you also have four schools to work with. and almost all the damage comes from a fire school you can’t interrupt (because then free bolts and cc) which also maxes out soulleech healing.
With that, you HAVE to run/line infernal or you die. No tanking that and with soulleech, your healer can freely run and drink. It’s not like you can reliably chase or stop a healer because the warlock will cc or kill you while you try.
But yeah I agree, Destro/firemage/rogue/DK/DH/Guardian all need nerfs.
If you removed PotP guardian druid would never see the light of day in arena. It would be hot garbage.
I think sac aura still needs to be removed. 50% of guardian druid damage is from brambles because all the damage they absorb with sac gets further reduced by brambles AND redirected to the original source which is pretty silly. If you take that away, you make their healing more reasonable and damage significantly less than a real DPS classes, which I think is more fair. Also allows them to be crowd controlled.
I mean it’d still have some relevance vs rogue mage because it still buffs 15% hp, has stops for mage, and can’t be Poly’d and can offheal gos (and isnt a viable kill target).
And that’s fine, because it shouldnt be good into everything.
Still waiting on you to weigh in if you think destro is OP and needs nerfs or not, though.
Why you guys are talking about bears.
Bug still isn’t fixed.