I don’t get the struggle against Sanguine Depths. In terms of maneuverability, yes – you don’t have a lot of room to move around, but the bosses really aren’t that difficult. I’ve seen so many keys break at the second and third bosses and aside from the occasional lack of skill, I don’t understand why. It’s basic mechanics 101. You have a beam traveling around the room and an add that pops up from time to time, but the majority of DPS think it’s safe to split the damage and then completely forget there’s a beam traveling around in a circle. Beryllia is even easier. You don’t need three orbs. You can probably make due with two. The swirlies will always come right after that, which is only a problem when people group together or they stop moving.
Spires of Ascension is where the difficulty lies, not because of difficult boss mechanics but because number of mobs in each trash pack is significantly larger than what you face in most dungeons.
Why do people with such high IO scores and a noteworthy record of past runs through Sanguine Depths have trouble with this dungeon?
What you consider hard is rather meaningless to the effective diff of a instance.
Spires is not hard as the avg groups do not hard issues with it. The trash pack sizes mean rather little to most groups that use at least one meta class with uncapped aoe furthermore multi. Spires fail rate remains rather low overall. Nw for example is higher looking at raid io most weeks for example. Dos is also. Spires is mid level diff at best no where near the hardest. While dos and sd for most affixes by completion rates are consistently the harder two for Fort weeks sd and top for tyr. Obv there is some variation based on affixes. If going by highest comp even dos and sd with top make up the hardest with spires behind them so mid diff by that comp also as per raidio.
SD is hard since the avg group dose have more issues with it.
In the end difficulty is not set by what you think should be hard but what has been shown to be via the real world.
Yes in a bottle you can call anything not hard but fact is on the real world when looking at the numbers sd remains the most challenging run with the highest fail rate.
As for why people have issues with it I firmly believe it is a lack of practice. As sd is avoided as it was unreasonably hard pre nerfs plus had bugs that make it unpredictable such as the guant all pulling at “random” now known to be a result of a enchant. People avoided the run and never practiced it add in no real loot item to really get people want want to farm there you have no reason to be there other than for ksm. As such you do the run a few times to get ksm than avoid it. As such the run is not mastered at the same level as the other run as such even if in a bottle the run post nerfs is not that bad it’s effective diff remains among the highest due to the avg group not being practiced among other reasons.
The wow community decides in the first few weeks which dungeon they’re going to avoid. No matter how many times it gets nerfed, a good number of people will continue to avoid it for the rest of the expansion.
Cathedral or eternal night
Shrine of the storm
Sanguine Depths
It stays hard for them because they never practice it.
Executor Torvald will destroy a group that isn’t thinking 5 seconds ahead. Although I would’ve never thought you could feign death out of castigate and I’m probably not the only one.
People don’t understand that “gauntlet” doesn’t mean “you must do all of this without a break at all ever.” Yes you might have to kill 2 extra gargons but if it means you can do the fight with 100% healer mana instead of 10% healer mana it’s worth it.
And then the third boss is extremely problematic for certain healers on certain weeks. Having to move for a long time to collect the bubbles at a time where healers would much rather be parked is a problem.
If I were to change something in there I’d start by widening the hallways a bit and then seeing how that affected completion rate on a few affixes. That alone would make it easier without nerfing it to the ground.
Sir, your highest SD in time is a 14. 11 on tyrannical. The issues and scaling that “high io” players are concerned with do not apply in those key levels. Unfortunately, many people come here for advice on 15 keys and people apply strategies and answers for 20’s which cause more problems then solutions.
You don’t get the struggle because you’re 1250 io and have never done SD above a 14. You’re not doing the content at the high level that people complain about. We’re 7 months into SL and you’re still doing 14s and starting forum threads like that gives you any seat att the table. Words cannot express how dumb you are for saying the 2nd and 3rd boss are easy when you’ve never killed them on tyrannical above key level fricking 11. ELEVEN. I also looked at your WCL and you’re bad in raid too, all greens and grey parses. It’s always the people bragging about how easy things are that are the worst at the game.
You don’t even have KSM, stop starting forum posts talking about M+ balancing when you only play at key levels that are faceroll.
There’s your answer btw, people who are saying SD is difficult are actually doing it on high keys. you aren’t.
I hate it at 18 but it’s not impossible but was funny when all my friends got a sang key ranging from 18 to 20. Let’s say that was an interesting week.
The top end complaints are valid. Those valid complaints have resulted in many nerfs to the instances to make its highest completion and amount of teams on that comp level on par with DoS now and only 1 level behind the avg and 2 levels behind the best, as per raiderio. So it has reached a point where thou it remains the hardest run it is no longer an outlier. As such its reached a point where the balance can be called acceptable if not only slightly to hard now, based on affixes. IT is still significantly lower than the others on sag and storming weeks largely due to lack of kite room. Is it a issue that a given run becomes harder with given affixes I think not norm, But as SD dose see significant drops vs the others on those weeks a slight nerf in regard to storm/sang there may be warranted but beyond that the run is fine. Even than I would wait till seeing the run with the new seasonal affix before doing anything.
They’ll never touch a dungeons design based on affix issues. SotT wasn’t fixed for explosive, SoB wasn’t fixed for bolster (although the players found a way to make it the best affix, even though the strat was pretty hard and it was still miserable without that), SD won’t be changed for sang. I don’t think it should either, sang was nerfed to be pretty chill this expansion and it is no where near as bad in SD and it was in TD.
Never say never, esp with blizzard. Blizzard has in the past changed many things people have claimed will never get changed. There always is a chance.
Thou I agree its not likely to happen and I agree with not doing it hense why I directly stated that in my post. Thou in this cast sag/storm might be to much in that run and may be addressed I don’t think its likely but it would be the most I would expect to happen the run overall is no longer a outlier.
Blizzard has done EXACTLY what you have just claimed they wouldn’t do and even just recently. They changed how SD works to deal with grev. The shield during the guant now removes grev this is a rather significant nerf to grev within SD. A clear change in the instances design for a affix exactly what you said would never happen.
As said thou I don’t think anything should be changed till the new seasonal affix is out as that alone is going to massively change everything.
Kinda tells me you’re doing low keys if they are surviving with 2 orbs. Once you get higher people usually play better and also bind SKULL so you can mark quickly for focus target.
Yep skull is shift plus v for me as a tank to mark every pull I feel it’s needed plus f1-4 for world markers to toss out if going to los or want the party to go to a set spot or otherwise for easy communication such as pointing out a pat or to ask for CD on a given pat to quick. While I got a bar for every other mark to do with haste.
In higher keys speaking of orbs people even pre run talk about x using immune on the first orbs y on 2nd so there is more orbs for the others allowing people to get 2/3. I myself use spellwarding on the heater for the 2nd orb phase since they can CD the first allowing them to not move to get ahead on healing for that part than third if it happens everyone personal or healthstone. As the op feels only 2 are needed with no other cordination shows he’s doing low keys plus doing it when overgeared.
Not even close to what I was talking about. That boss has a bleed that is removed by the shield, it was a disconnect that it didn’t remove other bleeds (grievous and necrotic)(You would also never risk missing the mechanic to clear grievous). That’s vastly different then making sanguine 50% its current size.
They’ve said recently that they’re looking at storming, but when they change it, it doesn’t mean they changed it for SD, it’ll be a global change.
My point is that we’ll never see specialized changes. TD was absolutely brutal on sanguine weeks, the mob density and floor structure required a ton of pre-planning to be “just OK”. No changes until SL came out. By comparison, you have (outside of just after skips) tons of space to drop pools. On top of that, the duration is so short that sometimes you have the first pool disappear before the pull is over.
What r u talking about. Have u done sd 15+ and be on? I just healed 17+ as pugging all the way here. Not gonna go in there again at least for this week affixes.
I think the main problem is that by the time you reach a +15 Keystone, the demand for perfection in Mythic+ is to such a high degree, you really can’t afford to have anybody messing up. When you have people accidentally pulling trash, not interrupting critical spell casts, not switching to adds on boss pulls, not dodging mechanics that are easily avoidable, then the likelihood that you’re going to time the key is slim at best for reasons that you can’t really control. It’s a lot easier to time these when you’re doing so as part of the same group of players, but when you have to pug from the Premade, you’re rolling the dice.
Not one person asked for a reduce of sang size by 50% thats something out of left field. If you read I vary specifically mentioned at most a slight nerf (that I feel is not needed at this time but may by warranted) to sag within sd only (via an adjustment to the instance), a 50% nerf globally is no where even close to slight, 50% that would be a massive nerf and something that is not even remotely relevant to the topic at hand. Asking for a massive nerf when at best a slight nerf would do is asking for it to not happen so obv it wouldn’t. Furthermore this would be a nerf to the affix (and as such effect everything) not a change to the instance for the affix so also completely different than the subject at hand.
The shield removed ONE bleed and specifically mentioned what bleed it removed on the tooltip making it clear it would not remove all, massive diff between a mechanic removing a single bleed and all. The effect removed a perm bleed that was made to be removed with the shield. It not removing grev is not a disconnect in any way. Them changing it to remove grev is EXACTLY what you said they would not they changed a core mechanic of the instance to do something different than what it did (remove a SINGLE bleed) to remove all bleeds for no reason other than to deal with some affixs. You claimed they have never changed a instance to deal with an affix and that is exactly an example of them doing so.
You wouldn’t miss the mechanic to remove grev no and never said you would. Said its a significant nerf to grev which is is. You already use the shield at the start of every pull in the guant + when the mechanic happens as you don’t risk missing it by doing so. As such the bleed lasts at most 30 secs this is a massive difference than it potentially never going away if the healer falls behind. ITs even more massive for necrotic that would never go away on its own otherwise.
We have exactly seen specialized changes the above example is one. You giving examples of where they did not make changes is only that an example of them not making a change in that case it is NOT evidence that they never make said changes as you claimed. It is not even evidence that they wont do it again in the future it is only showing that they rarely do that kind of changes nothing more but that is not being contented in fact outright said they rarely do but rarely is massively different than never.
As such your post they never make changes is proven to be untrue. They rarely make specialized changes but they DO make them when they deem it necessary. Your examples are only case examples of where they did not nothing more.