Rune of power needs to go

Classes Mage
162

We would not get a 40% buff, but something closer of 13% which is actually its bonus * its ideal uptime ratio.

But there is absolutely no meaning talking about little numbers now, because the other changes, new additions and removed options will also impact the whole balancing of most of the spells. Could be more or less. Balancing is out of question for now.

What I don’t want is the CONCEPT.

40% damage over 10sec is a concept that concentrates our overall in microburst phases while crushing our non-burst damages to the ground. and those roots prevent nice and cool plays like replacement during GCD and make us dependent of boss mechanic RNG and addons and/or absurdly perfect knowing of the fight. an exigence that most of DD spec have not at this level because Most (nearly all) of them will be able to switch target/catch up and mitigate the loss of damage and maintain an OK Dps where when mage loose a rune he instantly loose most of his potential damage over the next minute.

All of this troubles, for the most unsatisfying payoff. I don’t enjoy my feet rooted in a pizza just for a number increase in Details!

RoP interracts with none of our class or spec mechanic, it is here like an intruder. It doesn’t make our rotation different by itself, it’s just a self root for no gameplay satisfaction.

I would totally pay a part of the overpowered burst we have for some good constant damage.

I’m not against challenge and “hard to master” aspect at all, never been. But :

  1. RoP is a fake skill cap which confuses skill and ability to click install on an addon
  2. RoP is frustrating
  3. RoP has no satisfiying counterpart. Most of guys who claim enjoying it just actually enjoy that this mechanic allow to make abusive difference in WarcraftLogs when RNG is good to you.
  4. Not easy to learn because of how abusively weak you are when you begin and don’t understand it is the most powerful CD because of the inexistant feeling of power it carry.
  5. I totally prefer to play DOOM Eternal Hell mode if i want challenge.

If they would replace it with another risk/reward mechanic, they HAVE to make it make sense, be fun, be rewarding, and they should keep an eye on how much a good player can outrun a newbie, because you are not going to find a new public with numberbullying just starting.

I’m both passionated and very frustrated personnally.

3 Likes
163

It’s clear you don’t understand that classes with burst profiles are preferred over steady damage profiles.

When you only raid at a normal/heroic level it doesn’t matter but when you raid at a mythic level it does matter.

164

They could simply buff the Combust/IV/AP or think up of a rework that would allow us to stay a bursty class while ensuring a fun and rewarding process.

Combustion could for exemple trigger a Meteor each time you land a pyroblast.

I love big boulders.

1 Like
165

same. RoP is terribly unfun

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166

I do agree Rune of Power is uninteresting. I also think Incanters flow is not great either. One thing I wish they would explore is the resource for mages. Why do we have mana bar when in most situations (exluding Arcane) its basically worthless. Have a blue bar because ‘Class Fantasy’ is a very weak class fantasy. I would like to see that overhauled.

9 Likes
167

Putting more into arcane charges as a more powerful resource would be a good way to go, imo.

3 Likes
168

I will absolutely agree there. Hampering movement for a small amount of time is inconvenient but it’s not often a massive drama, especially for Arcane which is already pretty turreted. On the same page, it’s not some galaxy-brain achievement to use it “correctly” aka when DMB tells you.

But you are also correct in stating that for a very large amount of players it isn’t a fun ability, and with no competitive alternatives (yes I know IF exists but it’s also a massive dps loss in comparison) it feels even worse. The fact that Blizzarr considers it a class-wide dps cooldown rather than something specific to replace an existing cooldown just makes it feel bad.

I also agree with this, however the concept of a fantasy wizard has been altered significantly to come up with Mages. DnD wizards for example are knowledge seekers who gain power through learning. There’s a little bit of that in Mages (moreso Arcane) but most modern concepts of wizards (eg: movies, Diablo etc) don’t fit that bill. In reality we’re closer to Sorcerers - raw power due to inherent talent rather than book learning. Like I said, ROP somewhat fits in with Arcane but nothing about it (lore or mechanics) syncs with Fire or Frost.

Yeah no. As a standalone cd it is very boring, and honestly for me it just makes Frost feel slow outside of it. The current iteration of keeping IV up 100% with IP/TV makes it feel even worse. The fact that both IP and ROP made it into DF is a big red flag for me.

I mean sure, depends on how you want to define ‘choice’. IF is not even close to competitive for any spec, so it’s barely a choice at all. Having it as a base tree talent also removes a lot of that choice. No player is realistically going to give up on 10-20% dps from a single talent. My personal choice is to not play retail while it remains the only viable option.

Ah yes, the age old “forums are the vocal minority” when you disagree with something. These forums have been filled with ROP complaints since Mists, and I barely recognise any names that were posting back then. Statistically yes, people are more likely to complain than compliment however even if you take that into consideration I would wager that there are still significantly more people who dislike ROP than those who enjoy it (and more likely 50% who don’t care either way or just take IF because lazy).

It definitely would, but that might not be such a bad thing. Arcane and Fire currently have so many things stacked in their burst windows that they do 50% of their damage during burst and then have awful sustained for another 1-3 minutes. Frost is definitely less bursty and less reliant on ROP but it’s still well ahead of IF. If ROP were removed, it would only take some very minor tweaks to the specific classes to adjust their burstiness.

If they have to keep it, make it an Arcane talent that competes with other dps cooldowns like AP, Surge, TotM etc. Problem solved.

2 Likes
169

Maybe i’m wrong here. Frost is the spec i play the least, because i prefer arcane and fire specs fantasy. However, a haste bonus generating FoF every $s is still way more interractive and interesting than a rune boosting flat damages. But it probably could be way better, i agree. Just not as much unfun as RoP.

But at least, Combustion is very very cool.

170

Actually, current [Icy Veins] roots us in place way more than [Rune of Power], because if you have too move a little outside of firing your instant spells, [Icy Veins] falls off. Frost is currently a turret spec, at least in raids.

171

Allow you to move a bit if some condition are met though.

You can keep a backup FoF for that case, especially when you know you could have to move.

172

You don’t need to be doing “competitive dps” when out in the world.

RoP is a bit annoying to use at first but once you get used to it it’s actually not that bad considering you don’t need to press it now.

Then why isn’t it as big of a deal over at altered time?

It’s because the main people that have issues with RoP are the people that don’t understand how to use it properly.

1 Like
173

When it comes to burst, some of that is design but also the players have chosen to build all in on burst. Many people follow meta builds, that doesn’t mean its the only successful path, but that is what the players/teams want, a controlled high-burst window.

Slotting IF into a burst build will certainly be sub optimal, What might be a better option, is to bring a build that complements IF and is built out for sustain damage. Players can already do this in game and choose not too.

I know people have discussed improving IF, but it can never service both roles of burst and sustain. ROP or something like ROP will need to exist to give players agency in the damage profile they prefer, I feel if the option was lost the result would be a water down class and your meaningful tree choices, wouldn’t synergize.

Currently Frost has the tools to reduce its cooldowns, making ROP free. This has not always been the case and unlikely to continue to be the case. Personally knowing that free ROPS is available at a break point is exciting and keeps me thing about new builds if I can reduce my CDs.

Blizzard recently stated that they are building a game for players to clear dungeons and raids and not the numbers game. I am not so sure a rebalance is in order when the skill is filling its role, however I think its fair to ask for QOL improvements to range, movement or even the damage and duration have helped.

I think a disconnect is every mage that doesn’t like ROP wants something different from it. How is removing it and adding its damage into your major cooldown any different from just removing its movement restrictions ?

“Places a Rune of Power on the ground for 12 sec which increases your spell damage by 40%?”

1 Like
174

I don’t care about the top 1,5, or even 10%. The game should not be designed and balanced around the top player, it should be around the median player. If mythic raiders love a talent and everyone else hates it, its a bad talent. If a paly style is preferred by mythic raiders and everyone else hates it, its a bad playstyle. This is probably the number one reason WoW keeps losing players. This whole argument about RoP is probably a microcosm of the wider issues facing WoW.

7 Likes
175

Actually it should.

Games should never be balanced around low end players EVER.

If bad players dislike as talent and everyone else doesnt care then its a fine talent.

Its not a playstyle that “mythic raiders prefer” Its literally how the entire specs are designed.

Its an argument made by very bad players t hat dont understand class damage profiles or even class basics.

176

It most definitely shouldn’t. I’m agree with both parties on several arguments in this thread but this is just objectively a bad take.

Designing the game for the 1% is the surest way for it going under unless it’s a whaling game.

6 Likes
177

We can agree to disagree but evidence shows that when you dumb down games for bad players the majority quit playing. That happened in WoD with the pruning.

Not true at all.

178

No, it shouldn’t. There isn’t a game on the market that survived that strategy without going full pay-to-win/whale model.

I agree. Its just as bad as balancing around the the top. That’s why I said Median.

True. Has noting to do with this conversation. Players at all skill levels hate this talent

5 Likes
179

Every game that has catered to bad players has had player bases drop because of it.

No. You balance around the best players. You dont balance around the 50 50 players because good players would be unstoppable.

That’s an exaggeration. The only people posting here about disliking it are mostly bad players. This conversation doesn’t even come up on Altered Time because its not as disliked as people think it is.

180

Dumbing down is different from designing for the 1%.

It’s fine to have stuff for the 1%, but you can’t only cater to them.

4 Likes
181

If you arent balancing the game around the best players you are dumbing it down.

I never said cater. I am saying you balance around them.