Wait what? Where?
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Its a Demo thing, but my point still stands!
It’s just cool, ya know. It’s a video game and we are just trying to have fun but I just don’t see the fun on paladin anymore. We’re just stuck.
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Didn’t we used to have a version of Guardian of Ancient Kings that summoned a dude that mirrored our spells or something? Why can’t we have that back? It’d be badass to be able to summon an avatar to fight beside us! Like Brom but thematic!
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Omg, ok.
That sounds fun damn XD
Yeah we did have something like that. Always felt weird to me as an ability for Paly.
No strong feelings toward it or against it. I just feel that we’re past that.
I feel like their are many cool and thematic things (many mentioned here in this thread) that can be done that would be straight up cooler.
I mean there definitely are. I’m just saying it’d be kind of cool to have a Xuen of sorts that allows us to spread damage and debuffs around.
I just saw that justicars is still in the tree as an option.
Ohhhh man.
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Sounds like something Holy would use, not really Ret or Prot.
Idk, just nothing seems exciting. Auras are pretty lack luster, no game altering Blessings, and everything is just Judgement and Avenging Wrath modifiers.
Sanctified Wrath, Mad Paragon, Crusade, Divine Toll, Divine Resonance, Vanguard’s Momentum and Seal of Wrath have insane synergy. It’s an absolutely insane amount of incoming Holy Power and its going to be a crazy buff during wings. That’s not lost on me, but it doesn’t feel game altering.
Now, I don’t think the above things are going to stay as is, as I think its too much.
With Crusade and Sanctified Wrath, you’re already looking at 30+ sec of Wings.
With Mad Paragon, Divine Toll and Divine Resonance that is increased by at least another 5+ seconds.
With Seal of Wrath and Vanguard’s Momentum, that’s another 3-5 seconds.
That’s almost 40 seconds of Wings!
- I think Mad Paragon and Sanctified Wrath preform too similar of functions.
- I think Empyrean Endowment tied to Judgement is just lazy and not something you can plan around.
- And I think the amount of synergy this build (below) has, is going to force Blizzards’ hand in changing something.
(Note: You can swap HoH and Relentless Inquisitor for Ashes to Ashes and Empyrean Endowment or Virtuous Command and FR if that’s a higher dps gain, whatever.)
We definitly got some Talent work ahead of us, but it should be exciting to think of the possibilities to come…
- Of Dusk and Dawn
- So much cooler if that was 2h+Shield and gave way to using SotR and TV for all Paladins.
- Sanctified Wrath or Mad Paragon
- Likely to be changed - What’s an exciting button to replace it with?
- Empyrean Endowment
- Quite an uncreative talent for a cap stone.
- Exorcism would have been a better choice here. -.-’
- Divine Toll
- Imagine if this talent instead threw out 2 Judgements, 2 Holy Shocks and 2 Avenging Shields for all Paladins and Divine Resonance was changed to include 100% ringing clarity to offset the 3 other “main abilities.”
- Final Reckoning → Falling Sword
- As said before, how fun would that be to finally have a leap?
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Yeah, but they haven’t gone on full 100% hate mode and put Inquisition back in the tree somewhere. (Shudders.)
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That’ll happen in 10.0.01
SHHH QUIET! They’ll hear you!
Ret Paladins are the little brother of Outlaw rogues, so Slice and Dice… errr Inquisition is coming, don’t you worry!
Well if they allow Ret to Single hander whield and gave them Pistol Shot ect. We could then role play as Witch Hunter Captains.
We did. It wasn’t enormously popular, for a number of reasons. Firstly, it ran everywhere at 100% runspeed, so it lost tons of damage on a target switch. Secondly, it had a tendency to choose random targets (sometimes ones that weren’t even in melee range) and go running off after them, which kinds sucked in PvP if you were counting on that damage to put down a kill target. Thirdly, it was big and glowly, and made seeing stuff on the ground hard.
All of this stuff it correctable, of course.
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Paladin Dev: Hey, can I copy your homework?
Rogue Dev: Sure, just make it look different so that it doesn’t look like you just copied it.
Paladin Dev: Bet.
…
Combo Points = Holy Power
Sinister Strike = Crusader Strike
Ghostly Strike = Judgment
Pistol Shot = BoJ
Dispatch = Templar’s Verdict
Slice and Dice = Inquisition
Roll of the Bones = Seraphim
Dreadblades = Holy Avenger
Riposte = Eye for an Eye
Kidney = Hammer of Justice
Blind = Repent
Sprint = Divine Steed
Acrobatic Strikes = Seal of the Templar
We are just combat rogues with less tools.
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To be fair, Judgement pre-dates Ghostly Strike, Seraphim pre-dates Roll the Bones, and HoJ doesn’t take combo points.
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Lets not talk about all the abilities Paladins came up with that were given to other classes.
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What I’d do to fix the tree:
Retribution Aura: This ability doesn’t function as an Aura as it provides very little in group benefit. I think while active it should provide a low % proc chance to do extra holy damage to the raid. The proc chance and damage it generates goes up if someone in the raid dies, or a paladin in the party has Avenging Wrath active.
Divine Steed: They’re set on this, unfortunately. Seasoned Warhorse needs to be absorbed into Divine Steed and Cavalier. I’d like a choice node where either Divine Steed suppresses movement impairing effects, or where enemies moved through get knocked down for one second and dazed for two.
Avenging Wrath and Avenging Wrath rank 2 need to be consolidated.
Hand of Freedom is a baseline iconic paladin ability and should be known by default. Unbound Freedom needs to be moved from the PvP talents to the class tree.
Cleanse Toxins needs to be a choice node with the default, or Cleansing Light but on a 24-30s cd.
Turn Evil: This should be a choice node between Turn Evil and Evil is a Point of View. Turn Evil no cd. Evil is a Point of View 15s cd.
Judgement: Needs an option to either provide the physical damage taken debuff, or magic taken debuff.
Blessings: Can cast one of Kings = Stam + 5% and heals for 1% of max hp every 5 seconds.
Wisdom = Intellect increased by 5% and x amount of mana regen every five seconds.
Might=Strength increased by 5% and x amount of Leech or Versatility.
Between Judgement and Blessings mentioned above it would provide paladins, and in particular ret a viable option for utility, and for smaller guilds who cannot necessarily get all the buffs and debuffs an option if they have to PuG.
Aura Mastery in the class tree. Ret historically had access to this ability.
Cut down the two point and three point choice nodes. They don’t feel good.
There needs to be more horizontal movement through the tree, especially towards the bottom.
For the Retribution Tree it needs a lot of cleanup, way too many two point nodes in the bottom, it feels like we’re being robbed of choices. AoE is mixed with ST, and makes those contrary nodes feel like wasted picks.
Would love an option for Divine Hammer to be included in the tree.
Would like to see Hammer of the Righteous as an option, or a choice to replace Crusader’s Strike.
Justicar’s Vengance: The ideal fix for this is for it to remain the same damage, but it is guranteed to heal for the damage rolled and not the damage done, and even add in if we were wanting to go OP, let it bypass a certain % of damage reduction/prevention. A five Holy Power ability needs to feel impressive everytime it is hit.
Eye for an Eye: I’d like an option for it to either reflect physical or magical attacks. This would increase the value of the spell exponetially.
Shields versus Shattering Throw, Mass Dispel, etc. A talent where all our shields do a small burst of holy damage when they expire, increased by the remaining duration. That way there is some thought given to if they want to let the person remain shielded, or they want to eat the damage.
Could even be a choice node with when they expire they reapply for half the duration.
Sacred Shield: The Wrath version would be a nice option to have back.
Divine Storm: Let it heal allys in 15 yards for a portion of the damage dealt.
This is my take on the trees and things I’d like to see in them. Seals while nice, I don’t see them giving them to us at this point. Just my two copper. Feel free to chew it up.
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Lots of good ideas in there.
I really wish they would let JV go though.
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Thank you. I agree letting JV go for something else would be the best move, but suggesting a fix knowing Blizzard’s stuborness seems like the best idea.
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