damn you are correct sir - i will amend my error lol
I’t’s really hard to get accurate numbers like this. Even the numbers we do have are based on pservers which have already shown to be off in some regards (boss parry was way off), so we won’t know for sure how they actually perform in Classic yet.
I just checked the last 40 Naxx raids from Northdale, which I assume is still the largest pserver, there wasn’t a single ret paladin in any of them. This alone should tell you how viable raiding guilds view ret, but it also shows how hard it is to get accurate information on how they perform. It is possible to find ret in the lower tier raids, but it’s hard to judge them based on farmed content.
There are some players testing out the spellingbee spec on Nighthaven. Again though, these are geared naxx raiders on farming runs, and much of the data is skewed (paladin getting things like PI and innervate for example, something that would never be done in progression raiding)
You keep saying this, but it doesn’t really apply to dps. It’s easy to find dps for raids. Healers are what hold back raiding guilds, not dps.
Those 40 Naxx raids I looked at above, all had 4 or more healing paladins. They can cover all the buffs without a ret. Paladins are really good healers.
Pal1-Kings
Pal2-Might/Wisdom
Pal3-Salv/Sanc
Pal4-Light
Sanc is nice for tanks, who wont need salv. The damage mitigation is hardly worth giving to the entire raid, and certainly doesn’t merit losing raiddps .
Nightfall isn’t utility exclusive to a paladin.
Pretty much just from seeing logs from private servers, so as I said, not accurate.
Sanctuary is very useful during progression fights on raid wide dmg boss encounters in all raid instances - Vael/Firemaw/Flamegor in BWL, pretty much all bosses in AQ40 and numerous bosses in Naxx with Thaddius and Loatheb being the most obvious
it’s a flat dmg reduction across the board and can be put on all 40 players - it’s one of the most underrated spells/abilities in the game as the damage reduction really adds up over long boss fight encounters for all 40 players
yes i know that but it proves my point that Holy Paladins would never swing it other than for Loatheb
but a way to combine both Blessing of Sanctuary + Nightfall is to have one Paladin be the AoE tank guy with BoSanc and then swing Nightfall the rest of the time in order to get the best of both worlds
I did that for a year in a guild back on Anathema and it was great all around.
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You can just have a couple warriors with nightfall and rotate off who uses it when and it’ll be better uptime than a ret paladin or enhance shaman. This is something you know and also blessings can be done by hpals
nope
spoiler alert - we did the math for every class/spec that can swing Nightfall
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That’s totally wrong.
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Yeah lol. That’s not correct in the slightest.
Nightfall min/maxing isn’t worth it anyways. That uptime only works on a few fights. Most fights aren’t patchwork tank and spanks. Let an OT swing it when they aren’t needed and be done with it, a dedicated NF swinger is a waste of a raid spot. You are making one fight easier and two fights harder.
Viable? Yes.
Optimal? No.
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Plus anyone who tells you they’ll swing nightfall forever for your raid will eventually quit or just stop playing. NOBODY wants to just be a nightfall bot. But this the pill no one wants to swallow. Kind of like enhancement shamans who will “swing it forever” then find out later it’s actually the most awful weapon for damage.
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A ret pally who can play to their protentional and able to utilize their spell kit to the fullest extent and give the advantage to the a raid group is very much wanted. However a ret pally who wants to nothing more than just pew pew dps dps and nothing more youll be hard pressed to find any serious guild doesn’t have to be hardcore just any guild looking to do progression. Your pure dps is below other melee like rogue or warrior and holy pallies come with the same kit and heal. A ret pally is a the pure definition of hybrid and most raids what you to bring your hybrid utility if your unwilling to do anything but pew pew your gonna have a hard time unless your just trying to be a casual social type guild.
Ret utility is the same as holy utility and dual role in raids is inefficient
If you like doing 30% less dps than pure dps classes then Ret Pally is a solid choice.
So no fury warrior offtanking. Got it. Bench all the warriors that aren’t MT.
Yknow what? Rogues can die if they stand in the wrong place. Just get hunters instead, since they scale good early on. Bench all the rogues too.
Ah, but just maybe 2 hunters max. All the rest can go to hell, mages are good for the food/water. Since hunters aren’t, bench the rest.
Because that would be…inefficient.
Oh. By the way. What makes you guys think Nightfall is even in phase 1?
Maybe you should have equipped a weapon along the way. Paladins have no downtime and can AOE farm starting at 40, if they have the gear for it.
Warriors and rogues are in fact the slowest classes to level because they don’t have the soft safety nets mana classes have.
And thank goodness you chose Paladin. Shaman would have driven you mad.
There is a reason he needed to start his own guild on lightbringer for anyone to raid with him
In summary OP
Play Ret join a casual raiding guild enjoy yourself so long as you don’t mind not being Pure DPS but a support role that DPS’s and provides utility all around.
If that’s how you want to play and have fun please do, don’t let anyone here discourage you from doing that.
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The delusions run deep.
I feel bad for anyone you are responsible for.
Weren’t you tired of me?
Munch, much.