This answer still doesn’t make sense. LD is still the best Ret Trait and the other Ret traits are often a mix of really boring and bad.
I think why this answer is frustrating to so many people is that Ret is not in a great spot overall yet they are recieving nerfs over stronger classes that are recieving buffs in some cases, and while trait diversity is the claimed reason, nothing is being done to improve the traits people have complained about for 3-4 months now.
I appreciate the blue post but Im sure I speak for everyone here that we’d appreciate trait improvements/balancing way more than platitudes and mental gymnastics.
Letting one of my abilities deal an absurdly low amount of bonus damage over time on the handful of occasions that I crit is really unfun.
yes, lets have another situation where the only viable trait is wrath of the ashbringer and if all 3 of your relics dont have it youre not performing at h\the max instead of just getting one and done.
no lets have it so we need 3 specific azerite pieces to get the same trait on all 3 pieces instead of getting the full benefit of the effect from 1 trait.
in case you couldnt tell, that was sarcasm. wrath of the ashbringer traits being worth more than double the #2 trait was actually toxic
Don’t Strawman my argument. Having traits stack linearly has absolutely zero to do with a single trait being far and above too strong. You can have traits stack linearly (for example, if they took Light’s Decree and put 2 seconds on each trait instead of 5s on the first) to smooth out the value gain per trait without each individual LD trait being worth 3000 dps.
Instead of LD being 1000/450/450 dps per rank, if they smoothed it it would be a consistent and respectable 630/630/630. This would also allow for more fine tuning on the direct damage because it would provide some buffer insurance from making the 2nd and 3rd points being absolute trash, as they are now.
It wasn’t worth double of the other traits. Example is below. The issue with Legion traits was that you had to pray you got an ideal second trait because it was all RNG. Then you had to hope you got a decent 3rd trait as well. Then you had to hope the good traits were all connected. Azerite is predetermined now so it is not an issue.
Tbh Light’s Decree is too much of our damage currently. Would be nice if they dropped the damage further and brought up some of our other traits…Like giving Avenging might the same 5 seconds extension to avenging wrath (stacked with the 5 second extension, from decree) that light’s decree has, making Indomitable Justice and expurgation useful traits.
After that is done, fix…mobility…please…seriously…how…many…years…have…we…been…wheelchair…mobility…
maybe its like this because they want to prevent trait stacking, maybe they want to avoid a situation where one azerite trait is a requirement in all situations.
personally speaking id rather have other traits on my ret but rn i have 3 lights decree. its great for aoe and burst but i have no sustain outside my wings
love to see you posting and talking about your personal experience! +1 Ythisens.
rerolled ret for BoD, This nerf is justified. and Ret is just fine. for positive ret PR why not change [Expurgation] which is currently below tier 4 traits like bonded souls for all content to ‘when generating holy power’ has a ~10% chance to deal additional 1k per 2 sec for 6 sec… ( which would mean it could trigger off of all builder spells not just 1…) even [ Consecration]?
however my main point is: 3x **stacks of 1 trait should not be bis for all content.**
We saw this with Arcane Pressure at launch, the reworked Brainstorm on M Feted, shrouded Suffocation (sin rogue)… Seismic Wave (arms)… the 100 stack drain (locks) the list goes on and on… FUN DETECTEDeliminate, eliminate ahhhh. these traits where SIGNIFICANTLY off the charts and Lights Decree was the same… it has been nerfed in PVP 3 or 4 times already.
from a grand design perspective…
I would rather have all the traits FEEL overpowered… I would rather have all the traits BUFFED up to the top trait… so it is more of a pick your flavor, minmax per raid boss, per affix… per Arena comp. and you FELT the power of your traits changing your roation, ( tier sets) changing your playstyle, amplifying strengths in particular verticals to catch your arena enemy off guard…
I want depth,
customization
and theory crafting.
back to the trait at hand;
Swap the 3rd LD for Avenging Wrath and pump AOE/ST…
keep in mind for PVP it was nerfed more times that i can count… and if anything might need a slight buff, or like i said previously, Buff the bottom of the chart traits slightly so there is more variety.
It was easy to get x3 Light’s Decree because so much of the raid gear had that trait. It didn’t even feel overpowered or anything. It did have synergy with Empyrean Power which is total RNG.
As it is now weather or not you do good dps is to rng thanks to Empyrean Power. Sometimes you have many procs in your opener other times not a single proc. DPS looks amazing when you get all those procs.
There is always a best trait though. Before LD and EP we had and still have Relentless Inquisitor. We also have/had Avenger’s Might which is much stronger thanks to LD’s damage and wings duration increase.
EDIT: Even before the nerf though we weren’t going to be stacking LDx3 anyways.
Uhh, i have done keys with my guild and u r missing the point. Pugs want u to bring something special, stealth, bres, failing all that, preference for ranged. Having the highest aoe was something special in and of itself to justify bringing ret. At no point was i implying rets aoe was now bad. Simply it is no longer outstandingly high.
you havent done many keys. at all. considering your highest io in season1 was like 670.
after ret was buffed (before the 5th ring of traits was added0 i took my ret to 1900 io score just for fun before BDA opened. with only 1 lights decree on a 375 piece
ret brings a ton to keys as well as amazing aoe. brez can be filled by tank healer or ranged dps or even an engineer now, stealth by rogue (which is its own problem for another discussion) and leaves 1 last spot open for anyone. usually bring dh but youre not gimping your group if you bring a ret
Yes the trait was overperforming against our other traits. Even considering this, we aren’t massively out dpsing other classes, even in the instances in which you mention. We weren’t the top ranked spec for Opulence, plenty of other classes were capable of meeting our dps on that fight and the better the raid team the less adds will spawn and we’d fall further and further behind other classes. If it was the last boss of the raid and we could abuse the talent in some way to make the fight easier than intended maybe but it isn’t by a long shot. Even in 10+ M+ keys paladins don’t have a huge representation and the trait doesn’t make our damage ahead of other specs, plenty of which can do nearly as much in a mass gripped reaping wave while doing more outside of that… and overall have much better movement/defensive/utility for the rest of the dungeon.
Should the trait have been nerfed a bit? Yes it should have been, but it’s not like we were overpowered with 3/3 of it, and it put us in a far better spot overall than we have be in in years. We are still in an okay spot don’t get me wrong, but it would be nice to really shine for once.
Nah man. I totally feel what you are saying but some of the stuff they say is beyond ridiculous. Just a few weeks ago blues were out here talking like theres no criteria to get into high keys or anything, that teams are willing to just accept sub-optimal performance.
When they talk like this you need to put your foot down, especially if you’re a veteran and you know better. I’m sure this guy is truly a nice person who means well but at some point they need to start talking common sense and not bottom line, feel me?
Of course things that read as hate mail, threatening and such are never justified, but a post that might have a little bit of bite to it is fine.
Sure, I get you. I try to keep in perspective that this is just a game. If I’m truly unhappy, they won’t get my sub. There is a right way and a wrong way to offer feedback though. I think most of the people that rage at Blues clearly have never worked with the public before.
Everyone should have to work retail or in a restaurant for at least 1 year. We’d all be hell of a lot nicer. We’d also realize some of things we pitch a fit over aren’t really that big of a deal in the grand scheme of life.
Don’t you think there’s something clearly wrong in this expansion that tweaking an Azerite trait can have such an affect on an overall class one way or another? I think fundamentally that is one of the biggest issues with this expansion.
You are literally tuning classes, dmg, etc… to abilities found on pieces of armor that are randomly acquired to certain players. This isn’t like tweaking a primary stat, or versatility back in the day. Its a huge issue because some players don’t even have access to stack or do these.
Its not just this, its Drain Life for Afflic, it was RipTide for Resto sham, its SW Pain for SPs, and let’s not forget trinkets.
You keep introducing things that make specing and balancing harder for no real reason other than to say “hey this expac is neat bc u can choose traits on gear”.
MDI.The answer is MDI. Managing PVP and PVE together is difficult enough,and now the expectations of what plays well with viewers in the MDI adds to the mix.
Yup, this is yet another reason why I quit playing this game. Lost 15 lbs, and generally overall happier with my life.
They do this every time. Mostly when someone from their “sponsored parties” (method, or some other epeen competition) complains about something. That’s the only groups they listen to. Us “filthy casuals” have had enough of their s**t. So happy to save that $15 a mo.
You’re not wrong, but at basically every turn, blizzard has proven incapable of balancing stuff to even macro levels, let alone my truly desired micro-balanced stuff.
I mean you’re talking about the dev team that stripped like everything from classes and then even went so far as to use templates in PVP where they have EXCLUSIVE control over the balance and they still messed it up hardcore.
My faith in blizzard’s ability to balance is near zero. I’m just happy we even get the ~15% variance we do from top to bottom specs in “overall” performance on raids (which is still garbage variance; just better than something like the 100% variance vanilla had between the OP specs and scrub specs).
![:thinking:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/thinking.png?v=6" ":thinking:")
![:stuck_out_tongue:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/stuck_out_tongue.png?v=6" ":stuck_out_tongue:")
ahhhh. these traits where SIGNIFICANTLY off the charts and Lights Decree was the same… it has been nerfed in PVP 3 or 4 times already.![:v:t3:](https://d38bqls1q93fod.cloudfront.net/en/wow/images/emoji/twitter/v/3.png?v=6" ":v:t3:")