Restoration Shaman Feedback

Posting this on behalf of Tsunki, an EU player whom I very much agree with, as the EU forums often don’t get very much attention. I’ll add a few extra thoughts of my own below their post.

Hi, I’m Tsunki. If you’re ever stopped by the community discord, Ancestral Guidance, you might have seen me around. Resto Shaman is my passion in this game, and I have a particular interest in theorycrafting and trying to push the limits of the spec in raids. This is going to be a long one, so apologies in advance.
I’ll start by saying I’m not here to necessarily advocate for any of the proposed changes to be reverted, as I understand the need for the game to evolve. Instead, I want to provide feedback and highlight some of the issues in achieving the aims the developers have outlined in their rationale. Whilst my main focus is raiding and I don’t actively push M+, I do keep in mind the wider impact that any suggestions may have on the class.

‘Adding support to Riptide focused builds’

Whilst increasing the viability of other builds again would be very welcomed, the proposed changes actually make Riptide focused builds weaker, and less desirable than the alternatives. Some of the main reasons for this are as follows:

  • Removal of Primordial Wave (PWave):
    I understand that PWave was a polarizing talent, however it’s importance to the strength of Riptide focused builds shouldn’t be underestimated. One of the major weaknesses of Riptide focused builds is the lack of burst AoE healing in comparison to builds that lean into Chain Heal. Riptide focused builds have been at their strongest when PWave was good and we could play around the burst healing it provided (e.g. Season 2 Dragonflight), and one of the main reasons these builds have massively fallen behind is due to the lack of power that PWave had this expansion. Also, it’s worth noting that PWave functioned as an additional Riptide charge every 30 seconds, so losing this further devalues Riptide focused builds.

  • Whispering Waves:
    The introduction of this talent as an alternative to PWave is an interesting thought, however it requires pressing Healing Wave as your main rotational ability over Chain Heal to be viable. Currently, we do not press Healing Wave at all, favouring Healing Surge for triage healing, or Chain Heal for AoE healing. Whilst Healing Wave is an efficient single target heal, it is not strong enough to replace Chain Heal with this talent alone. One particular issue is that Chain Heal is a smart heal, whereas healing done by Whispering Waves not only requires setup in the form of spreading Riptide, it also has the potential to do considerable overhealing due to lack of control over targeting. Another thing to consider is that with Downpour, High Tide and DRE/Wellspring nodes all being very strong options, Whispering Waves really needs to shine to be chosen over the alternatives.

  • Wavespeaker’s Blessing:
    This talent needed a change to become a viable option in the highly contested bottom part of the tree, however at 22% spell power, the HoT portion of Riptide accounts for such a small fraction of our overall healing that at 10% per point, this talent will still never be favoured over the other options. Increasing the HoT portion of Riptide is not necessarily a bad idea, however a more fundamental change to the balance of Riptide’s healing is most likely needed to achieve this. If the desire is for Whispering Waves to become the lynchpin of these builds, then perhaps increasing the duration of Riptides further rather than focusing on the HoT power itself is something that would be a more suitable change. Furthermore, this talent, much like Undercurrent, suffers from requiring a 2-point investment, whereas many viable alternatives for pathing only require 1 point to take.

  • Ancestral Awakening (AA):
    Arguably the biggest blow to Riptide focused builds was the nerf to AA in Dragonflight, and then the further change to AA this expansion which introduced an RNG element to the talent. I will say that I believe the nerf to AA was largely unwarranted, and what I can only presume was a reaction to a very unique interaction with the Dragonflight Season 2 tier set, which naturally is now long gone. Whilst currently AA still performs reasonably well in terms of numbers if your primary source of healing is Healing Surge, this is mostly due to the fact that we have nearly 100% crit chance on Healing Surge currently due to the Season 1 tier set. Forcing us to use Healing Wave more would significantly weaken AA’s performance again, which is one of the things that Riptide focused builds really need to even out their healing profile.

  • Coalescing Waters:
    Coalescing Waters really brought Riptide to life again in the 11.0.5 patch, which is something I wrote about at length when putting together the Farseer raiding build. However, obviously this talent only triggers from pressing Chain Heal. Shifting more of our casts away from Chain Heal and more towards our single target heals actually reduces the value of Riptide again, as being able to regularly buff our Riptides to diversify our healing profile was a very positive change. Whilst I would argue that reducing the amount of Chain Heal we press is a good thing, this does need to be
    factored in.

Removal of Ancestral Guidance (AG)

The overlap between AG and Ascendance for raiding was caused by a particular sequence of events, in conjunction with the fact that AG redistributed Ascendance’s healing:

  • The significant nerf to AG’s power at the end of Dragonflight, which made it undesirable to press AG alone, like we had done previously.
  • The introduction of First Ascendant as a talent in The War Within, enabling us to pair the cooldowns every 2 minutes.
  • The fact that the damage patterns in Nerub’ar Palace heavily favored 2-minute cooldowns vs. 3 minutes, which made Preeminence more difficult to use. Whilst a 3-minute Ascendance with Preeminence is still very strong, the removal of AG significantly reduces the potency of our healing capability when incoming damage is more regular. No other classes currently rely on a 3-minute cooldown to achieve their optimal throughput, which will potentially harm the viability of the spec.

The removal of AG also negatively impacts Cloudburst, which is a core part of the spec currently, as healing done by AG fed the totem whereas healing done by Ascendance does not. Whilst Healing Stream has become a more viable alternative for Totemic, primarily due to Reactivity making the totem heal for more than intended/stated, this change pushes Farseer even further behind. For M+, this change hurts particularly as AG was strong enough to be used alone to handle healing intensive scenarios, allowing better spacing of healing throughput on a spec which is already very reliant on 3-minute cooldowns. It also removes some capability to do damage whilst healing, which is something that this spec still struggles with compared to other healers. An alternative to removing AG could have seen it being moved to the spec tree instead of the class
tree; that would have allowed an iconic spell (our spec Discord is even named after it!) to remain with the spec, whilst removing the issue caused by having it available to Elemental and Enhancement. If the aim is to prevent us from pairing AG and Ascendance, the interaction between the two abilities could be removed, and the ability tuned accordingly.

New Set Bonus

Whilst a lot of this will come down to tuning, there are a few issues at a glance with the new tier set for 11.1, particularly the design being based around Insurance! being consumed. With the way damage patterns have been in recent years, typically we don’t want to let people drop below 40% health, as that leaves them in significant danger of dying. Naturally when there are massive bursts of incoming damage, people will drop low enough for this to trigger, however this is where people will have damage reduction/healing cooldowns assigned, which will devalue the tier bonus significantly. Given Insurance! works the same for other healers too, this even further reduces the value of our Mastery, which benefits from targets remaining at low health. Further to this, our 4 set gains value the more we let Insurance! be consumed. As stated above, the opportunities for people to drop below 40% will be minimal, and optimal gameplay will actively prevent people dropping low more often than not. Due to having very little control over if/when Insurance! is consumed this will also result in the buff sometimes being unused, or unavailable when we want it. Having the bonus rely on casting Healing Rain is a serious problem for Farseer, which does not actively press Healing Rain at the moment. In raid, this is a GCD which does not do enough healing to warrant being pressed, even with Downpour talented. Even in M+, where damage matters, the frequent buffs to Ancestor damage has made pressing Chain Lightning a better alternative than pressing Healing Rain in most circumstances.

Mana Tide / Spiritwalker’s Tidal Totem (STT)

  • Mana Tide:
    Mana Tide is slightly stronger than it was before, presuming that we play Current Control to reduce the cooldown of Healing Tide, which we almost always do. It’s still a fairly lackluster talent, and with how much the spec suffers from mana issues in comparison to other healers at the moment, we would benefit from this talent giving more mana return to the Shaman themselves. The only downside to this being passive is the loss of an additional Chain Heal through Lively Totems when playing Totemic.

  • Spiritwalker’s Tidal Totem (STT):
    The current iteration of STT is still underwhelming compared to the one we had in Dragonflight, and it is now very rarely taken in any content. The cast time and mana cost of Healing Surge is already very low due to Tidal Waves and Resurgence, and it was rare that the need for this buff coincided with when you wanted to press Mana Tide. Having this talent now be reliant on pressing Healing Tide now further reduces its value, as you have even less control over when you can utilize
    the buff.

Therazane’s Resilience

This change is very positive, reducing the GCD burden of refreshing Earth Shield, and potentially being quite strong in all content when combined with Earthen Harmony. Its position in the tree also vastly improves the pathing to the DRE/Wellspring node, as Reactive Warding and Improved Earthliving are still extremely undertuned and/or difficult to get value from.

Downpour

This is a really good quality-of-life change, especially for Farseer, where the window felt very short before and was often difficult to use effectively. Pressing Downpour on Totemic felt much better, and whilst it will still continue to do so due to the length of time Surging Totem is active, this is as good as it can get with the current design.

Ancestral Vigor (AV)

Whilst this talent being 2 points again isn’t realistically going to change much for us, as we will just spend the additional point we gained from Healing Wave being baseline, it is a shame, as having more freedom to spend points in the top of the tree was something that this spec would really benefit from.

A few words of my own (very short):
The tier set definitely needs work. It is currently about half as strong as our Season 1 set bonus, with almost 80% of that healing coming from the Insurance! HoT left by the 2pc. It’s very likely we’d forego the 4pc entirely and just wear gear with better stats or wear our Season 1 2pc bonus if it was left untouched.

The removal of Ancestral Guidance hurts Cloudburst Totem A LOT. Ancestral Guidance was our only cooldown that fed into Cloudburst. Cloudburst Totem has a longer cooldown, less healing feeding it, and requires precise planning/execution compared to the very easy-to-use and almost-always-available Healing Stream Totem.

15 Likes

A well written post. I’ll throw in a few crazy ideas of my own:

Neptulon’s Blessing - Passive (Replace the Reactive Warding talent)
Riptide’s healing over time effect grants the effects of one of your elemental shields based on the target’s role.

Tank: Earth Shield
Healer: Water Shield
Damage: Lightning Shield

Healing Tides - Passive (Replace the Whispering Waves talent)
Healing Wave applies Riptide’s healing over time effect for 50% of its normal duration.

Wavespeaker’s Blessing - Passive (Reduce to 1-point, update effects)
Riptide’s healing over time is duplicated and distributed onto other allies with your Riptide, and its duration is increased by 4.0 sec.

Turn of the Tide - Passive (Replace Ancestral Awakening, this is a 1-point talent)
Whenever Riptide expires or is removed, the cooldown of Riptide reduced by 3.0 sec.

(NOTE: Ancestral Awakening would probably be better served on a Hero talent tree)

Tidewaters - Passive (Minor Change)
When you cast [Surging Totem: Surging Totem or Totemic Projection while Surging Totem is active / Healing Rain], each ally with Riptide on them is healed for (180% of Spell Power).

(NOTE: Allows Tidewaters to mesh better with the Totemic Hero Talents)

Mana Tide - Passive (Minor Change)
Healing Tide Totem now additionally grants 80% increased mana regeneration to allies and increases the effects of your Water Shield by 300%.

Spiritwalker’s Tidal Totem - Passive (Redesign)
Healing Tide Totem now allows you and your allies to cast while moving.

Downpour - Passive (Minor Change)
Casting [Surging Totem: Surging Totem or Totemic Projection while Surging Totem is active / Healing Rain], allows you to cast Downpour for 8 sec.

Downpour: A burst of water at your Healing Rain location heals up to 5 injured allies within 12 yards for (220% of Spell Power) and increases their maximum health by 10% for 6 sec.

(NOTE: Allows Downpour to mesh better with the Totemic Hero Talents)

Ancestral Vigor - Passive (Return back to 1 talent point)
Targets you heal with Healing Surge, Healing Wave, Chain Heal, or Riptide’s initial heal gain 10% increased health for 10 sec.

Tsunami - Passive (New talent placed beneath Tidal Waves)
Tidal Waves has a chance to refund a charge when consumed.

Spirit Link - Passive (New choice talent competing with Spouting Spirits)
You and your party members whose health is above 90% will automatically have their health redistributed to heal you or your party members whose health is below 50%. The rate of health distributed from a party member cannot exceed 1% of their maximum health per 1.0 sec.

Replaces Spirit Link Totem.

Healing Spring - Passive (New talent placed beneath Water Totem Mastery)
Earthbind Totem and Earthgrab Totem now act as a Healing Stream Totem in addition to its regular effects. The Cloudburst Totem talent does not affect Healing Spring.

5 Likes

First and foremost, there are many fantastic points made in this. I would like to add a bit of my own opinions, as well, from a mostly high key M+ perspective.

“Riptide focused builds”

Similarly to what is posted above, the current changes do not enable this build type to be playable. After doing some limited dungeon testing, I can comfortably say that this will not be a build that is used successfully in any meaningful dungeon content. It feels as if we have several parts of a build, but nothing that would cover for the role that Chain Heal has in the alternative playstyle.

Whispering Waves is extremely disappointing. I understand that pwave was very controversial for the player base, but it is also unfortunate to see it go and then replaced with a very weak, passive version. As stated by Tsunki, Whispering Waves revolves around pressing Healing Wave, which is very rarely used, if at all. In the dungeon testing today, you almost cannot even tell that any healing is being done with Whispering Waves. Unfortunately, m+ heavily revolves around high impact globals to heal heavy incoming damage on a frequent basis. With current tuning, this still would not even be enough healing for rot style fights.

This playstyle was largely popular in DF S2 m+ with the Runes of the Cinderwolf tier set. We were able to deal with mild to moderate incoming damage with Riptide healing in combination with Tidewaters and Ancestral Awakening while ramping for a strong pwave/Undulation combination for heavy damage. All three of those abilities - Riptide (the HoT aspect), Tidewaters, and Ancestral Awakening - are now much weaker in comparison to that patch. Ancestral Awakening has the current benefit of getting decent value out of heavy crit values from Healing Surge with the current tier, but this will go down as you replace our current tier in 11.1.

It is important to note that one of the biggest reasons why a “Riptide focused build” will continue to stay behind in favor of Chain Heal is largely due to the power Chain Heal gains from our talent tree. Chain Heal itself is not that impressive, but when you add Ancestral Reach/Flow of the Tides, Tidebringer, High Tide, and Coalescing Waters, it becomes a very potent ability. It’s my opinion that one of three things should happen -

  1. Shift some of the power gains from Chain Heal oriented talents in to our base kit.
  2. Allow for more flexibility of our CH talents to impact other abilities (i.e. Coalescing Waters buff to Riptide proccing off of more than just Chain Heal).
  3. Increase the power of alternative talents to make them competitive.

Or, alternatively, some combination of these.

Removal of Ancestral Guidance

Really unfortunate to have this ability removed again. It received heavy nerfs for restoration which allowed it to become combined with 2 minute Ascendance in raid, however this was still largely used as a standalone cd in m+. I primarily play Farseer in m+ and this impacts both of our healing as well as our damage. Farseer’s damage output relies heavily on active dps, rather than more passive damage from Acid Rain with Totemic, and AG on mild to moderate damage incoming trash packs was extremely helpful at being able to still get damage in without risking the lives of my allies.
In Blizzard’s post, they noted how similar AG and Ascendance have become, but the major difference is that AG feeds directly in to Cloudburst healing while Ascendance does not. While this can effect both hero talents, this is another blow to Farseer as we more regularly depend on Cloudburst healing over Healing Stream Totem.

Currents of the Gale Sovereign

My two general issues with our incoming tier set were pretty covered by the original post. Having our extra proc depend on players dropping below 40% rather than allowing for it to heal upon expiration is rather counterintuitive, especially given how weak that heal actually is in it’s current tuning state. This is further amplified by the 4p depending on consuming Insurance! for it’s bonus healing. In combination of this and the fact that Farseer largely does not cast healing rain in m+ (likely even in spite of recent Acid Rain buffs, though this is more beneficial to Totemic, anyways) means I will not be surprised if you see players opting out of wearing 4 tier pieces. While I do not mind being able to focus on my ilvl and stats, I think it is bad design for tier to not be worth equipping.

5 Likes

ptr bump, farseer nerf is no bueno

1 Like

Updating based on the PTR patch released this week with additional m+ testing -

It feels there is becoming a split in our kits with Totemic prioritizing Chain Heal and Farseer prioritizing non-Chain Heal builds. Unfortunately, the “Riptide focused build” for Farseer is still significantly underperforming in m+ to the point where it likely has a hard cap much lower than it’s counterpart. This is due to a few issues including, but not limited to -

  1. Our 4p depending on Healing Rain is still a blow to Farseer. This is not a satisfying ability to hit. Even with Acid Rain buffs, our damage is still very weak in comparison to other healers on PTR at the moment and this buff is more beneficial to Totemic. I do not expect people to maintain Healing Rain for damage, or even healing, when our globals are already so bloated.
  2. The nerf to Ancestors with the added mastery scaling will not change our stat weights and therefore is just a straight up nerf to their power. I cannot comment on raid, but our mastery is so rarely effective with how m+ is designed.
  3. Whispering Waves is very weak for any damage intake in m+, even with Ancestor’s Healing Wave (which are laughably weak). Even with a full party of riptides, Healing Wave with double Ancestor’s does not outpace almost any damage source that occurs more frequently than cooldowns can cover. Quite frankly, if you are trying to run a Farseer build without Chain Heal, I think you may still not even take this talent.
    I’m not quite sure how this ability could be tuned for both raid AND m+. However, I am pro-Primordial Wave and I think removing this ability for a weaker passive that will be hard to tune was/is a mistake. (There is still time to revert this.)
  4. Speaking of talents not worth taking - Wavespeaker’s Blessing. The HoT portion of Riptide is still so weak that a 10%/20% buff is a small drop in the bucket. The 3s/6s duration does not really provide anything in m+ due to the frequency of Riptide application we have available to us.
3 Likes

Weekly update to try to keep this thread alive based on current PTR patch tuning. However, there were a grand total of ZERO changes for restoration shaman. This is quite unfortunate given the current state of resto shaman on PTR in m+ is not only underperforming, but also not engaging to play.

For context, I have played at least some resto shaman in every single m+ season to date. I have acquired every 0.1% m+ title on this specialization. I am not super interested in playing other healers for the meta game, but would rather stick to the spec that I have known and loved for many years. My goal is not for resto shaman to dominate m+, but rather have it not feel unfun to play and not to feel as if I am massively holding my friends back by playing it.

For many players, Chain Heal is a core part of our kit. It is a beloved ability for many. However, that has never been the case for me. I did not particularly do a lot of resto shaman raiding and I only have a few CE’s in my history. Chain Heal was never an ability I used in m+ for the entirety of Legion or BFA m+ and was only used in a few scenarios throughout SL. Through many changes, this ended up being just what you needed to play in DF M+ to handle the incoming damage. Fortunately, this was no longer the case with the DF S2 tier set. We were given an alternative build that, while difficult for many, was quite satisfying to play around. It is quite unfortunate that many people did not like the difficulty of this build and felt the tier set forced them in to playing it. I believe this decreased the favorability for Primordial Wave in general. I will double down on my previous post about the removal of Primordial Wave being a mistake. For many of us, we were grateful for an alternative to Chain Heal that not only felt satisfying to play around, but also allowed for skill expression. Whispering Waves does not fill that void. At all. I also do not believe Blizzard is capable of tuning this ability to ever be fun or interactive in an m+ setting.

  • One of the reasons being that tuning it to function well with a strict 5 riptide target cap will not translate well in to raids, where you can get more riptides out. It would be nice for there to be tuning for m+ and raid separately, as there is for PVP, but that’s for another thread.
  • Another reason being that the lower, but more consistent healing of this rarely aligns with m+ damage design. There are likely only a handful of bosses in the history of m+ that you can get away with this over burst healing.

A few other notes/questions, while I’m here -

  1. What was the point of adding Jet Stream to our talent pages only to gut the ability? I understand not wanting to have one movement impairing removal ability to be superior to the rest, but this no longer functions in many places that other snare removals still do. You have effectively added a talent that is completely useless. In general, I do not really understand the idea of having snare removals but also snares that cannot be removed, but I digress.
  2. Why try to balance a nerf with Farseer Ancestor healing with mastery scaling, despite mastery not being a favorable stat for resto shamans in pve for quite some time? They also do not gain anything from our talents (barring Whispering Waves now), despite Totemic Chain Heals benefiting from them. This hero tree has already been outshined by Totemic for the entire first patch of this expansion and this is looking to continue in to 11.1.
  3. There seems to be an arms race occurring between the damage abilities of resto shaman and it does not seem like there is an obvious goal. You buff acid rain and it becomes our priority damage global. Then it is considered too strong and so it is nerfed and other abilities are buffed to compensate. Then acid rain is not worth talenting/pressing for some and so it gets a buff. The confusion for damage led to Farseer not only never talenting acid but, but also having odd circumstances where casting Chain Lightning in single target was a damage increase over pressing Lava Burst/Lightning bolt.
  4. If you are going to remove Ancestral Guidance, our ONE cooldown that works when paired with Cloudburst Totem, maybe consider improving other cooldowns to work with it. Or give back Ancestral Guidance, at least to restoration shaman. We have multiple talent slots that could easily be traded out for something useful.
8 Likes