are any of the epics pvp tho?
i avoid them for that reason, like sure i get my rogues daily win by solo recapping our av towers, but is it really pvp to just stand in front of 10 players and cap a flag while they spam aoe? its funny, but idk if its pvp.
Less so for sure. I think it can still be player vs player, even if you aren’t out right attacking them. It’s the lack of agency in them that is the issue. Isle just doesn’t have many good objectives. There are a few points or interest and that’s it. AV isn’t much better, but each point of interest has a lot more value.
Like in Isle, hangar IS by far the most impactful area. You could do almost nothing but hold hangar and have a few people killing glaives and demos and that’s it. That’s all you need. You can ignore everything else. 2-3 players are enough to hold off glaives and demos. That’s pretty broke if you ask me.
Even as bad as WG can be, a single good player feels like they can still have an impact. Holding a workshop or taking one. Not great and like hangar, sunken ring is still an easy win for defenders. As soon as the first catapults get built, it’s almost gg.
The ‘Epic’ battles that could happen only happen once and that’s it. It’s kinda sad after all these years that more hasn’t been done to perfect AV. 15+ years of data and you would think they would rework it.
I agree delete
But nah after playing 100 games of ioc in 14 days i can safely state that wg is even worse than ioc
They’re both bad so remove and add in tol barad
You’re all right.
Remove it all.
Especially Ashran.
As one-sided as IoC is, Wintergrasp is way way worse. “Player-versus-vehicle” format just isn’t very fun in general
It would be better of you to change your title, just in case.
large-scale pvp is what all pvp should be.
You forgot getting vote kicked for “being afk” every single time you try to defend q base assault that isnt hangar or docks for the allstar achieve.
Man this place is a riot.
Noted and appreciated, though I’ll leave it as is. This isn’t really a petition and is a discussion. If they want to delete it because I used a no no word… well, oh well. Not like they engage with us anyways.
lol. Yep. Nothing like getting punished for doing the objective.
I don’t mind this one. Wintergrasp is SO boring. If you defend, it’s either a really long win or a loss. If you attack, and you lose, it takes forever.
The only good outcome is attacking with organized people, then you can win quickly. Otherwise, big stink mode.
mine only problem with the glaives is the Anti Vehicle can be out of reach but the glaives can still hit the wall.
its the same on the alliance side if the horde get the glaives.
know about the stealth players but if hunters keep launching flairs no point
All epic bgs are terrible.
Fair enough! 
I don’t mind that. That’s kinda the point of the glaives. They take forever to spawn. As another person said, they don’t scale well. When Isle first launched, glaives were one of the better ways to win. Now, they are completely ignored because only a couple players are needed to manage them.
For sure. Both are bad in that if you lose the initial fight, the rest of the game is an absolute uphill battle to win. Like the fact that all of them are centered around getting this one node or doing this one objective says the maps aren’t balanced.
The fact EVERYONE rushes to sunken ring or hangar says ALL the other objectives are pointless. They badly need to balance them out. This would force players todo more actual pvp to retake refinery for instance. As is, it’s a waste of time. If you’re losing, getting it doesn’t mean anything.
Denied.
IoC is fun.
Only good thing about IoC is you know which side is going to win within the first 2-3 minutes of the match (the team that wins hangar). After that it’s usually no more than a 12-15 minute wait for it to be over
Wintergrasp on the other hand, you might be in there for 30+ boring minutes depending on how stubborn the offense team is. If offense team folds fast/all 3 towers go down then it might only be 19-20 minutes, but that’s still a looong time considering how boring the BG is 
Replace epic BG entirely with the TDM brawls. Blizz does not have an eye for siege combat design, they could do with going back to the drawing board completely on that.
no keep it remove wintergrasp instead
no no no no no no and nooooo thats why brawls is separate and has its own thing .