no i said “10 people with a pulse” the other 30 don’t got 1
classic 2019 was actually GIGA buffed. i played and clear all content in 2005-06/07 and it was an absolute joke. 40 man raids in OG times were 100% based off of player participation/attendance and just raw man power. the 2019 rerelease was actually “harder” (was braindead easy) but harder compared to 2004-07. i dont got evidence but myself and 4 other IRLs played both times. the biggest hurdle in 04 compared to 2019 was our 200-400ms + 10-30FPS compared to our 15ms + 60/300+ FPS today
i am 30 (was on the younger side of OG WoW) only did everything bc I gamed w/ my older brother and his friends. we had our own guild and cleared everything up until Naxx
There’s no appeasing WoW players. Whatever they did with BWL/ZG was going to make some people unhappy.
It ain’t that deep.
" is in the end of the day an catch up raid"
This guy must be American
Flex = % dmg and HP of bosses increased each player enters the raid. Designed for a base of 20.
No. In 04, we didn’t have the gift of hindsight like we did in Classic Vanilla. In 04, it was a living, breathing and ever changing game. That was the biggest challenge.
there was just a posting on wowhead about different modes about added mechanics and you have to enable 3 of the added mechanics to get access to the “hard mode” version of BWL.
I don’t know why, but i find it really funny. Like, random people struggled with MC enough as it was. Now they’re adding even more stuff.
its a weird system, there’s 5 different things you can turn on
blue = stack or you explode
red = people randomly get a dot and it keeps stacking up on them until u heal them over 90%
bronze = it makes you run really fast or really slowly, randomly
green = you get a giant green spotlight on you, after like 10 seconds you drop poison at your feet
black = this is the really important one, it seems to enable all “hardmodes” and all som mechanics, when we turned black on, razorgore had a giant drake add, vael had 60% hp instead of 30, broodlord randomly teleported away and activated all his traps etc etc
Ah. So it’s like added mechanics on top of SoM mechanics.
yes, there’s a guy at the start of bwl and he is clearly nefarian, but he has some mr potato head tier giant moustache and is pretending to not be nefarian, he tells you that you can turn on as many colours as you want but after 3 u won’t get any extra rewards
i guess u could choose not to turn on black if u never wanted to deal with som mechanics
bronze + red + blue should be pretty easy
oh. so default, SoM mechanics aren’t enabled?
correct, its vanilla bwl if you don’t choose black
i think it works like this
black is an optional “hardmode” that you can choose to do for no extra loot
any combination of 3 red/blue/bronze/green are pretty easy and grant max loot
SoM mechanics are enabled for the whole raid without black. Black adds unknown effects for now that are even not trackeable with the game log. Vaelstrasz killed our tank 3/4 times suddenly, nothing on combat log/logs “died by enviorement” we turned off black and it didnt happen again, just the normal tank bomb. So that is not how it works. What may confused you is that Chromaggus is not working properly and has even less mechanics than vanilla, seems like they need to fix it.
Blackwing Lair with (for now) Chromaggus exception is 100% SoM version even without hardmodes.
The hard modes seems to be very funny and will give a lot of life to re run the raid. But you know what can destroy it? 40 players on a raid designed for 20 zerging it and skipping every single mechanic by brute force.
Hope they think about this during the weekend and revert it this week. I am not against flex if it increases the difficulty in some way, but ofc i do with what they plan to do now. Fingers crossed that devs are watching us.
weird, i went in immediately and the big egg didn’t exist, then i came back a 2nd time and the egg didn’t hatch, then i came back a 3rd time when we did +black, the egg was there and the drake hatched, possibly bugged? The first 2 times he was 100% vanilla mechanics (razorgore)
black essence:
we killed vael, he had 60% hp instead of 30, without black he had 30
broodlord teleported away
firemaw had some electricity field thing that added a stack of nature damage to you that chain lightning - i think this is som?
the dragons have a debuff called “go” and “stop” - if you move with stop, you get blasted, if you don’t move with go, you get owned
chromaggus is cooked, bugged
The upset is 40maning a 20man tuned raid is like winning a go kart race with an F1 car. It may be fun to you cuz you literally care about nothing but the trophy even if it’s handed to you, but some of us classic players care about a little challenge.
And before you bring up the old rotten fallacy of “No body forces you to do X”, I’d tell you that an advantage in a competition is not an optional it is mandatory. If the NBA gives an option to the home teams to start up the game 20-0 you can’t tell ppl who think that’s a stupid “well nobody forces you to do it”.
Logs will almost certainly not count raids with more than 20. And there’s no extra loot for going in with more than 20 like retail flex.
So there’s two reasons not to just bring 40 people.
I really can’t understand how you think this will be good for the majority of the guilds.
Maybe for the first run would be even funny to blast the blackwing lair being a bunch of 20+ friends. But what comes after?
You will need to deal with two big problems:
-People unhappy because they can’t join to let the “core” parse and do the designed difficulty
-People unhappy because the whole weeks u run into it with 20+ and you are never facing the true design and difficulty of the raid
And believe me this will be a trouble and headache for the guilds to deal with because you will face gquits from example 1 and 2.
Its just simple and fair:
0 No hard modes: for the casual people
Each hard mode: more difficulty from 1 to 5 for challenging rosters.
I am sure that even the casuals will eventually up to 1 hardmode at some time.
But to blast a raid designed for 20 with more ppl is just bad and something we never saw before in any other wow version.
And again, flex IS ok but you have to add some kind of mechanics that gives more pushback to the encounters.
Yeah, you get less loot.
for BWL should be ‘min’ 20 and max 25,
40 no, if anything, make the major city bosses for each faction drop loot once a week, and make it a 40 man raid.