There are a bunch of things that could be said to fix/help this spec, but most people can agree that unholy’s main problem is it’s single target damage is weak especially outside of army of the damned. And that’s the problem I think should be fixed; is army of the damned.
I know it’s an iconic dk ability and some people will be very against removing it. But I think it should be gone to help our single target damage be better more often.
My proposed idea is to replace it with pvp talent Raise Abomination. Make that ability baseline and tune it accordingly. With it being on a 1:30 minute cooldown that would be huge in giving us a big gain on bosses in mythic+ cause aotd on 8 minutes just kills our single target when it’s not up.
Now I know some people will say no cause it’s an iconic ability for dks, but we have apocalypse now which in a sense does the same thing. So I don’t really see the problem in removing aotd. And I actually love using raise abomination. I think it feels great and fits unholy’s theme.
Would anyone else be game for making that ability baseline and get rid of aotd?
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I second this notion, everything abomination does is good for Uh dk, gives virulent plague, puts wounds on target and most importantly doesn’t require my runes to use.
Both Dps Dk’s single target dps need to get a look at. We are too op in aoe department but so weak in single target. Dks have almost zero utility for raid except that deathgrip, which a lot classes can replace it with knock backs. Almost have no reason to choose dk over other classes for raids at the moment. Come on, class designers…theres logs to show how weak dks are. Don’t turn a blind eye on us…
Tyranadia,
I only get to raid with a buddies guild who’s progressing through heroic - so I admit I don’t have a fair vantage point with regards to DK dps in raids. In my small pocket of raids, I do absolutely fine.
I’ve seen countless times that DK do not provide utility, or that they possess less than other classes - but do they?
Death Grip - a 15 yard interrupt / pet interrupt - Brez. On top of this, we can swap Asphyx for Grip of the Dead for Oppulence. I find this plenty of utility. What’re you comparing DK utility to in order to deem as lacking?
Given that our AoE is outrageous, I’d even go as far as to say that this is also part of utility.
Legitimate question - no sarcasm here.
Well from a heroic stand point every class does fine, but mythic raiding and super high keys our single target dps is a hinder towards the group. They can easily get another melee class that isn’t struggling single target wise who provide better utility as well to take our spot.
Like I said in normal and heroic we are fine, but mythic is where we fall off
I have some news for you my friend, our aoe is crap without every single cd up compared to other classes that have less and lower cds and do better than us when they are not up.
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No, we are struggling in heroic as well. We don’t compete at all.
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Which cd’s?
- a rune or global for a VP?
- DnD?
- 4 to 5 runes?
- 100 runic Power?
Apart from DT which is a sub 1m CD, what could you be referring to?
And of course you’ll have more if you line these up - but these are baked into our rotation.
Are those considered cd’s? And if so, what classes are you referring to when comparing it to us “lacking”?
Bro, if anything, Army of the Damned needs to be kept and the Abom just made baseline anyway.
Everything we have requires ramp-up and re-spec and cooldowns. We should just have access to all our cooldowns baseline, take them out of the talent tree and replace them with something else.
I should be able to pop army, then gargoyle, then the abom. They need to go all in on our strengths, like they posted about.
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DT, Apoc, UF. Try aoeing without all these up and a dh or rogue will shi t all over your dps without using a single offensive cd. And im not even gonna mention boomie, locks and elementals.
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We can agree to disagree. I find you being hyperbolic when saying we get crapped on in aoe situations. Losing is not getting dumped on, and from what I can gather - at least according to Opulence, it’s simply not accurate. And look, I’ll stand corrected if you can verify that rouges, without popping a CD can crap all over us, or any other classes for that matter.
On Opulence, apart from an Elemental (Which I would agree, could be superior for not only the Spirit of Gold, but also cleaves - could top us. Ele’s solid). Again, it’s by no means a blowout.
I only checked your log and two other DK’s - each topped damage for Opulence (in both Mythic and heroic parses). I do think it’s a niche roll that UH flourishes at.
Is it so bad to display a positive in our class?
Yeah if you save cds for the adds, try aoeing without saving cds for them check how that goes for you. And those were on pugs try on a group that knows what they doing its not gonna look that good.
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I wont count your most recent log due to your death. On the 22nd, you lost by .02% dmg overall, and 108 dps. I say this to emphasize you didn’t get dumped on.
Don’t you think each class popped CD’s during Spirit of Gold? It’s tit for tat.
I cannot link. Check out Burch’s / Psychotypal logs. Each lead in overall dmg - Burch is Frost even. They weren’t pugs it was mythic progression.
Brez that cost so much resource is a joke to begin with, Druids can do better. As for deathgrip, easily replace with a better dps class with knockbacks. Nothing much needed to grip anyway. Grip of the dead compared to other classes slows. Well, these are very common utilities, not really worth mentioning. I only mention deathgrip because its unique to DK.
What I meant is Lock Gates, rogues,pallys and some other classes immunities, shamans totem, dispels and raid buffs and defensives…you tell me our utilities compares with others, seems ok or not. On top of that most of these class does slightly better dps, some does lots more even.
Raiding is a team game, I don’t think DKs have much to contribute at the moment.
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IMO the idea that we need to be deprived of an ability that has been class and spec defining since wrath beta is stupid talk.
the only reason army makes our ST low is that blizz is under some foolish idea that all classes should pull about the same dps whether they have 1 button or 12.
army should stay and our ST main sequence spells should be buffed to be on par with any other class’s dps. would that make us top dps? yes, but most people never output max dps on unholy anyway so it would balance out.
Brez does cost a resource - but it’s also instant. The trade off seems fine.
I don’t disagree, we don’t need to deathgrip much, but the same could be said for knockbacks too.
I disagree. Grip of the Dead is fantastic. Is there another 90% slow? If there is - is it the size of DnD?
Totally agree. Locks have Gate/Stones/ and maybe a soulstone if you count that? You’re right that Paladins can BoP mechanics and bubble. Shaman’s have Tremor, Earthbind and Windwalk if they talent into it on top of their decurse. Rogues? I’ve no idea what their utility is - Shroud? I think we bring more utility than them alone in that we have a instant Brez.
The numbers don’t lie though. Some classes flat out do more damage than DK’s, so utility aside, I could see why DK could be overlooked.