Yeah there are plenty of ways Blizzard could satisfy the majority of players, while including LFD (and even their LFG tool if they think it’ll have a snowballs chance in hell of being used) but they still have to change their mind. So we have to keep posting.
Don’t know people think it won’t be used. It’s being used on beta and that’s a small sample size.
Hell, people use the LFG tool NOW on mankrik. It’s just a crappy tool right now.
The lfg tool is a massive improvement, but that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t have RDF too.
I just have to assume anyone on here AGAINST RDF or it even being cross-realm… is not and has not played for any length of time in Classic… because they would know that if you aren’t a tank, finding a group is a pain… or assume they on here because they are miserable IRL and just want other people to be unhappy.
6 Likes
I think a simple solution is to toggle.Some will keep it on and some will keep it off. Keeps both sides happy AND do what they used to give tanks incentive to tank. Even better rewards to cross server que.
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But ismt that the same as implementing RDF and letting people choose to use it? Or do you mean a toggle for X-realm queues initially… because tanks are the limiting reagent when it comes to forming a group. If you arent a tank, you will prpbably just toggle x-realm queing on because you will get access to a wider pool of tanks. Which essentially just becomes the same as implementing RDF and giving people the ability to form groups on their own (which as people have said, doesnt work because 1 system is both much faster and easier to form groups with at the cost of player agency and server identity).
I’m happy for there to be a toggle. The “loss of community” is directly a result of the constant cross-realm aspects that Blizzard kept adding, from LFD, to LFR, to CRZ and sharding, so I’d like to try and maintain that on servers that still have it, as long as possible.
Megaservers don’t need cross-realm, mid-tier should use realm-locked to avoid getting infested by the toxic attitudes of megaserver-minded players, and dead realms will probably want cross-realm but it won’t fix their dead realm. I’d prefer realm-locked only, but a toggle would allow me that experience.
Realm Locked RDF allows the same pool of players as their LFG tool, while providing a less toxic method of forming the group and preventing gatekeeping.
“Player Agency” is not defined by forming groups. What you’re referring to is “tank control”. That’s really one of those intentional misconceptions that keeps being repeated. RDF provides ‘player agency’ by allowing people to choose to opt into the queue or not. It also allows people to choose to use the LFG channel if they prefer, and while many will not do it manually, a realm-locked system will keep the same group of people available by both methods.
“Server identity” is maintained by that realm-locking. Being able to toggle to cross-realm (realm locked should be the ‘on login’ default) would be a choice by players, providing again, agency. And assuming realm-locked is the toggle default each and every time you log in, turning it on is an active choice, not a default state.
I am of the mindset that even small pop realms would be fine with no RDF outside of current tier content. You see it on TBC now, MGT runs are very frequent and not too difficult to find a group for. However, something like Sethekk halls normal is next to impossible because the playerbase has outgeared it BOTH on their alts and mains.
Low level content suffers even more. Even on megaservers its not great, but at least possible. If they just put redundant content into RDF i think many people would be fine with it. You arent going to struggle to find heroic groups for the first 3 months of WotLK, but by the time you get to TotGC nobody does anything except the TotC 5 mans.
Thats why i think if they just added RDF but adjusted the avaialable content you can queue for based on what is current, the net outcome is a positive experience for most players.
Based on your logic, you should want the reverse. RDF for everything except the current content release.
So no RDF for initial dungeons in Wrath during Naxx phase, but everything below that has RDF, then all dungeons on RDF when Ulduar comes out. In ToC the ToC instance is not on the RDF, but when ICC comes out it gets added.
I don’t like the concept really, but that’s what your logic should suggest.
Thats pretty much correct.
In phase 1, people wont struggle to find groups through LFG chat for northrend normals or heroics. Same with ToTC 5 mans in Phase 3 e.t.c.
The point is people dont struggle to make groups for current content. They do however struggle when players have outgeared/leveled that content, which is where RDF providing access to a X-realm player pool dramatically improves peoples abillity to get into group content no matter what stage of the game they are in.
If people want just RDF as it was im fine with that. But this I think is a level of compromise that at least supports the big pain points of losing the RDF system.
This sounds like a very good compromise.
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90% of the power of the RDF system is the Queue and Match functionality.
You can remove teleporting, crossrealm, goody bags, and whatever else I didn’t think of, and as long as Queue and Match remain, then most of what RDF is also remains. All the other QOL is fluff compared to the core of the system that is Queue and Match.
Queue and Match is the most fair system as it pertains to DPS players looking for groups.
5 Likes
More than acceptable honestly.
I’m pretty sure early iterations of the tool actually worked like this, it would primarily search on your server and then if nothing was found after x minutes or if x time would result in an unreasonably long queue it would open up to the battle groups!
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What does it matter if its teleporting? How many times running to Utgarde Keep does one person really need to do before its annoying? What positive is it to add an extra 15 minutes onto the experience for no reason?
What does it matter if its cross-realm? East Coast player gets off work a midnight his time on a weekend and his server is East Coast… you’re giving him the ability to queue and have people to paly with… instead of not logging in or not finding a dungeon in a reasonable amount of time.
There are zero positive things for a Game/Business to not leave it the way it was and leave it in the game… it literally only makes the game more enjoyable for content that LITERALLY doesn’t mean anything.
If you also removed the random dungeon part so you couldn’t continue farming heroics you’ve already cleared that day, that would be acceptable.
Specific queues or smart queues where you can’t land on a heroic youve cleared already to avoid infinite badges
Doesn’t have to be not-random, for that. It just has to not place people in groups that repeat dungeons. The reason why they changed it in LFD was the belief that the tool would not be used as much as hoped, so the pool would be too small to constrain it. Clearly that’s not reality though, so they could restrict people from repeating dungeons easily enough.
Aslong as people can’t farm infinite emblems to flood the market with crates gear and be full badge bis in a day
That’s easy enough to fix. BoP’s (or even BOAs) in loot bags only. Or just ditch the bags.
Why even have it cross server? Why not keep it within the server and only implement “cross server” on servers labeled “low” ?
3 Likes
Incorrect, it doesn’t “only makes the game more enjoyable” as you put it. It has it’s negatives, hence the reason that this decision was made in the first place and also the reason that if they were to come to a compromise the option to opt out of cross server or the delay on using the cross server pool is necessary.
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Can you tell me one of these negatives?