Thank you, you are so right, some of these issues come up when players that are
meet those that are more likely to chastise and shoot others down.
I consider each failed run a practice run, I try and learn what I did wrong and how I can improve on them, if I get told I was not the issue, I still try and learn so I can improve.
To those that feel like we are trying to force you to do things? we likely would not even know you or what you did if you kept quiet, but the moment you open your mouth all bets are off.
My 25 minute Atal run is not a practice run. It is a swift, smooth run and anyone who is doing less than a certain amount of dps/mechanics is nothing but dead weight.
Alright heres the challenge then. Take a group of people that have never set foot into a keystone before, crank it up to 15 and see how well they handle the bosses plus the affixes.
Knowing the people youâre bringing into the group have experience with the dungeon and the affixes, be they a main or an alt, is crucial. How would you deal with explosive? What about sanguine or quaking? Do they understand spacing out kills on a bursting week to prevent a wipe?
Theres a lot to take into consideration when setting up a group for M+ and IO score shows they have the knowledge of at least the dungeon and the affixes. At that point as long as they can carry their weight and deal the damage they need to, its all good and gravy my guy.
Untrue. Guardians abound. My main is an arms warrior Iâm getting invites just fine. Enhances here and there. Shadow. Any spec that exists I see fairly regularly in my 14 and 15 keys. I see 2-3k io players grouping with 700 io players in my keys.
Yeah when you start pushing above 15s, which is when m+ turns into an actual hobby, then yeah you start to see a narrowing towards the meta. But as far as having fun and gearing up any specialization in 475, no problem
I have wanted to respond to this but of course I got forum suspension for my original post here but again, I will still bet that raider io will still exist no matter how blizzard tries to stray away from it, people will still pug higher keys will still use it because it is mandatory if you pug your own keys, especially the higher you go.
The primary issue is that the current IO system doesnât mean someone has âskills,â it only means they have experienced the dungeon at a certain key level.
There is also to much a difference between fort and tyran, so IO score for fort and tyran should be separated on IO or fort and tyran should just be removed from the game.
What we need is blizzard to create their own ranking system for m+. Thats the only fair solution. IO worked for legion but isnât working with the newer content.
I do like jdotbâs idea that key scaling stops at lvl 20 and then after that its only about how fast you do the run. I think this could be refreshing. Its brilliant.
The only way youâd be able to stop an addon like raider io, or at least halt it is for blizzard to just disable showing m+/raid progress on a character. Note that I said halt because it would only be temporary and Iâm sure the addon developers are clever enough to figure out a system to work past it. However that would most likely be exploited and easily cheated.
If that happened, Iâm sure pug groups will start asking you to voluntarily disclose your M+/raid progress to the party leader as a condition of getting invited. If you refuse or you donât want to? Well then âhe must have something to hideâ, and then party leader just hits the âdeclineâ button.
The community will always find a way to weed out bad players, addon or not
I mean their are multiple ways for leaders to find out this stuff anyway. ask for all +15 achieve, AotC, furthest mythic kill achieve. They could use that +ilvl to decied if they want you or not.
People seem to think this is new, when it is not. Its been a thing since vanilla. People will use all the info they have to decide who they want in the group they formed. If they decline you, they have that right. Either you do not bring what they want (might be looking for a rogue for shroud or a shaman/mage for BL/TW.) or someone with better items has also requested to join and thats why they declined you
I hope that never happens. Me and my rio groups donât want to be hindered from preventing people who need gear from getting gear and only inviting those who overgear the content. That wouldnât be fair to us.
nah the people who pushes key will probably start logging their key run more and more. And probably mandatory to show the logs. On the keys around 10-15 Iâd say itâll be a clown fiesta. To a point where people will not invite anyone unless theyâre friends. Probably kill the pugging scene.
People complaining about io honestly make their own bed in the pug world. Theres so many ways to avoid pugs but they just choose not to yet complain about pugs making their own rules.
Dont like it? Either make your own, make friends or dont do it at all. Blizzard shouldnt have to hold your hand through every aspect of the game.
I mean you have a thread talking about a melee who doesnt know how to LoS Alleria. Think youd want someone like that running keys with you?
As an aside, i dont do m+ but even i know this much about the world.
And where would RIO be useful? in the 16+ keys the ones who do M+ as their endgame hang out and work with those of similar attitudes or the up to +15s that the ones that just do them for gear, possibly to help out their guild in raids, or as a change of pace?
The pro-IO crowd can be just as stupid as the anti-IO crowd , as quite a few of them make it sound like we want the 16+ crowd, or actual pushers, to carry the lower ones.
Ideas, like timer less versions, have been put forth yet get shot down. There are just different kinds of players being forced, by the systems in place, to mesh. I donât do above 15s, and if I did it would just be the occasional 16 for a +15 in the weekly chest, but even if I wanted to Iâd expect to be denied most, if not all, groups unless they are labeled âclearâ or âcompletionâ, at least till I have more timed keys of higher levels.
The issue, and why topics like this get made, are when the attitudes of the +16 and higher crowd, leak down to the lower levels where those that are likely just after a weekly clear are going to be.
To sum it up:
RIO is a godsend for those who do nothing but push keys and themselves higher and higher
RIO is a flawed system that is used, and abused, for the players who are just doing the bare minimum in order to progress their character for content they might prefer more (I.E. raiding/PvP)
To top it off, some of the âanti-RIOâ crowed recognize it has its uses, at and above certain levels, and we are more then happy to let it be used at those levels.
Quite a few of us likely would not, if it was not a way to gear up, up to certain points, but the fact gear progression, after WQs and normal raid ilvl, lacks a consistent path outside of M+ up to +15 (currently) means there will be those that do it just for the gear.
I think what we need is an M+ âchallenge modeâ for those that push keys, could easily be the forever scaling mode starting at +2 or not till +16 and what would be considered gearing M+, this latter would stop at +15, might be timed, might not be but would make it so the pushers and non-pushers never have to meet in groups and stop this kind of post.
